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Post by Dave on Jan 13, 2021 2:04:20 GMT -5
You keep saying the SHEDIM and the ARCHON are NOT of angelic origin, but an entirely different creature. Thus you have a created creature in heaven, that is now on earth, I don't know about?
Of course you know them
Eph 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the worldly forces of this darkness, and against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
Quote "According to one legend, the shedim are descendants of serpents, or of demons in the form of serpents, alluding to the serpent in Eden as related in Genesis. Decedents of serpents Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, … Great Dragon = First Archon = procreation = consistant with everything I have said
According to one common view, they are the offsprings of Lilith,[12] from her union with Adam or other men." YES! – The archon are made with some matter – correct – they procreate – correct Adam is the Hebrew word for man / mankind – as in Gen 6 YES! – the Jews consider her to be a whore
The Talmud describes the Shedim as possessing some traits of angels, and some traits of humans The Nephilim = ½ man + ½ bane elohiym = demigod
In three ways they are like ministering angels: They have wings like ministering angels; and they fly from one end of the world to the other like ministering angels; and they know what will be in the future like ministering angels. And in three ways they are similar to humans: They eat and drink like humans; they multiply like humans; and they die like humans.
Ministering angels – agree but the are not ministers of the Gospel – but of self They know the future – YES – they are heavenly being compared to man – they have a bigger view of the larger reality
Ponder this – we are 3D – and there are 7 heavens above = 10 Principalities are the lowest form of angels closest to man I see this as their domain = 4th D which would be our 3D + the first laver of invisibility / heaven They have full view of this – this this is not the totality of the 10D that is God’s awareness
They know the future and they know the scripture – why don’t they repent? They cannot – are not supposed to – are designed not to – or God’s Word would change They are serving an important and valued function within the totality of God’s Plan / God’s Will
Gnostic wiki "Evidently from works such as the Apocryphon of John, the Ophite Diagrams, On the Origin of the World and Pistis Sophia, archons play an important role in Gnostic cosmology. Probably originally referring to the Greek daimons of the planets, in Gnosticism they became the demonic rulers of the material world, each associated with a different celestial sphere.[3] As rulers over the material world, they are called ἄρχοντες (archontes, "principalities", or "rulers").
Quote "They are never depicted as reptilian in Classic Gnostic texts, except for perhaps having a lizard-face like the Archon Yao in the Secret Book of John. They are portrayed as hermaphrodite creatures owning different bestial faces, with an appetite for rape and brawling. They are a mixture of heavenly administrators and hellish union goons. Borrowing from William James and his take on God, they are omnipotent to the extent they can do what is possible, omniscient to the extent they can know what is known. Reptilian – this is 100% American Native theology – the snake people took them underground to survive the last great earth change – Azuni Sun City is one of the hottest UFO sighting areas in the world – jus a few miles away from Dulce New Mexico (google it) Reptilian – Zeta Speak – a large UFO Contact with the aliens of Zeti-Reticuli – are reptilian Reptilian – are a type of UFO alien in everybody’s definition Reptilian – was what morphed in front of David Ike that change him into the Conspiracy guy that he is
They are portrayed as hermaphrodite creatures owning different bestial faces 100% King Solomon with an appetite for rape – Gen 6 brawling - - families – infighting – Greek / Roman / Viking / Asian / Egyptian gods = ‘other gods’ , they are omnipotent to the extent they can do what is possible, omniscient to the extent they can know what is known. I just said this – they are aware of more than man – but they are lower than angels
Sorry Dave, like reading demonic stuff, too weird, can't find any info saying what archons are, or their origins. Jews say part angel part human. Weird. Gen 6 bane elohiym + any woman they choose = scripture
Way too confusing. Only if you do not see the scripture in it – see the hand of God in it It all sounds close – approximate – near – in support of the Jewish and My Gnostic view
From your Gnostic writings before you state the HS made a mistake and a chief archon emerged alive,
Well – here is a big difference between you and I My God does not make mistakes – it is all His Will / His Design / His Plan The archon serve a function within God’s creation
Only problem with this theory, there But I do not find any origin of this word except it means "beginnings" Correct – you play word games to keep the precept confusing Precept upon precept – I do not deny the Paul’s Principalities – who are John’s Archon – who are Solomon’s shedim
Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. This verse lists arche with angelic messenger, hence I suspect the arche are of angelic origin, NOT different created creatures. Yes – from man’s perspective all of these beings are invisible to us = heavenly beings Some are good guy angels – and some are other beings – but all invisible / spiritual / interdimensional to us
It is clear that the shedim referenced here are also functional term for arche, and therefore arche associated with angelic messengers. HEY – you are catching on finally – good for you
But I do not find any origin of this word except it means "beginnings" There is no torah proof that arche, is a different created creature. Ponder scripture Gen 1:21 … after their kind… after his kind Gen 1:24 … after his kind… after his kind Gen 1:25 … after his kind, … after their kind, … after his kind. Not Good guy angels that changed their specie -= form – into something King Solomon described and can be destroyed
D" Michael is an commander over angelic beings, who fought over the dragon and his angelic beings. The First Archon and his archon shedim - Correct You are on one hand opposing me, than agreeing with me??? DUH – word man – the angels of the dragon = bane elohiym = archon of procreation = shedim
Michael did not fight with angels, according to you because the arche are not angels?? Again word man – all of these beings are heavenly being from man’s 3D perspective Michael fought against the Dragon = The Beast = The First Archon and his procreation
There was no war in heaven over angels, the war was over arche, a brand new created creature rarely detailed in the torah.
This is a cultural statement – not a scriptural one Please Ponder what you have said here Correct the shedim is not mainstream Tanak – But they are Tanak and therefore relevant and scriptural
1- The Gnostic Contest exist on multiple levels – man vrs world (archon) + man vrs yester ra There is a world struggle – and an inner struggle In the ahl 100% of Israel are God’s chosen people – there is no doubt of this – the 1% In the ahl – it was Israel against the world – Israel against the Amorite and their ‘other god’s’- 99%
This set the stage for Jesus Christ – and the Gospel opens the door to 100%
2- agl = ahl + Christ – is a spiritual revival – and speaks to a more spiritual reality
Eph 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the worldly forces of this darkness, and against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
Who is the father of these forces (false prophets ministering spirits) – devil archon who is the father of this archon devil = the Beast- the First Archon
Rev 20:10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are too, and they shall be tortured day and night forever and ever.
This bright star, Nice try – but Isa 14 is about Cyrus / a man / every man that gets too big for his britches
You ignore the cherub chata in Ezekiel, is about The King of Tyre / a man / every man that gets too big for his britches
but happy to pursue arche where no origins of arche are explained? Please explain the origin of arche, but do not use angels?
Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created—in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen, whether thrones or angelic powers or rulers or authorities. All was created through Him and for Him.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2021 5:08:05 GMT -5
Greetings Dave
Well I must be getting better with understanding the archons, OK so Paul presumably lists these principalities, so I get your theory these archons are demigods, half human half angels, doing extreme havoc on earth.
You place the bright star as a metaphor on a wicked man, also Ezekiel onto a wicked man, yet these poetry similes do include labels of poetry not associated with man, ie morning star and cherub, which you ignore. But in your theory I guess you can ignore them.
But why would God intentionally create a creature that destroys mankind, rather than just test mankind with yester ra.
I mean take Job for instance, according to your theory, God tells the opposing archon to do things to Job, so this archon destroys Job's estate, rather than test Job.
Take the modern evil such as pedophilia, how is this just testing a 10 year old child so innocent, rather than testing the child's ra or tov? And you suppose God as a loving God, allows this as a God-will design of His glory?
Nothing good happens with archons who rape, and destroy... they do not test the minds on humans, they abuse the minds and for many humans almost permanently all their lives. How is a sexually abuse child supposed to grow up and follow a loving God? Do we also tell her that God intentionally designed you to be sexually abused for many years? Would that witness make her love God more? I doubt this.
Something wrong here in my thinking. Please explain.
Joh 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
Here is a simple evil. My children have gone blind, some of them. My X wife carries a faulty gene, and is now expressed in her children.
Joh 9:3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him. 4 I must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work. 5 As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.
Scripture does not talk about bad things, but it is alluded here. God is in control, yes, is the main point here. But why did the genes go wrong? Does God design mistakes? No
The clue here is NIGHT or DARK, Jesus leaves us in the dark as to the answer. It's just spoken as God's work to bring us light.
You say God is the designer of light and dark, so did GOD create sin too intentionally? I would say no, but you would say yes, the archons are intentionally designed to make sin occur right across mankind.
I do not buy into this idea, because while light is needed to make dark, darkness has nothing to do with light. Darkness is made by Beings blocking the light intentionally, as the shadow experiments reveal. Sure God engineers the light, making darkness visible, but does not do the sinning personally. A Being does this. I do not see your archons designed by God to test man, rather these archons came about by choosing to sin.
But I do for a complete study want you to answer my blind children and my friends who have sexually abused children now adults, and have little to do with God. How can leaving a permanent scar on a child, now adult, be simply a test by God intentionally? Is God that callous? that stringent? How would you witness to these innocent ones?
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 13, 2021 12:35:09 GMT -5
Well I must be getting better with understanding the archons, OK so Paul presumably lists these principalities, so I get your theory these archons are demigods, half human half angels, doing extreme havoc on earth. I know you love to restate things inaccurately so you can find error in your own version of the truth The archon are a specific group – separate from good-guy angels They were made differently than the angels for a different function They are all procreations of the First Archon – bane elohiym A sub-set / one small group of them / bane elohiym came to earth and fathered the Nephilim The Nephilim are ½ archon + ½ mortal women = demigods – just like Hercules After the flood 90% of these Nephilim were jailed in chains awaiting Rev 9 10% remain – and they father the biological Rephiem gene pool of the Amorite When this 10% died on earth – their spirit remained on earth as evil spirits
There are archon (principalities) than never came to earth of the archon that came to earth (only about 200 of them) 90% are locked away in chains awaiting Rev 9 of the archon that came to earth 10% became the evil spirits of our world after they fathered the Rephiem
So – there are archon in spirit form – principalities – that is a much larger group than just the bane elohiym of Gen 6 There are archon in human form – Rephiem – because Israel failed to complete the genocide There are also evil spirit archon – the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim that dies upon earth
You place the bright star as a metaphor on a wicked man, also Ezekiel onto a wicked man, yet these poetry similes do include labels of poetry not associated with man, ie morning star and cherub, which you ignore. But in your theory I guess you can ignore them.
You can hold onto your Roman 2 verse satan theology – you seem unable to speak of anything else Isa and Ezk are about a man – do you deny that are about a man Your metaphor does not supersede literal scripture 2 verses do not override the bulk of scripture Please quote one Jewish Rabbi that see it your way – you cannot because your satan is only a Christian belief
But why would God intentionally create a creature that destroys mankind, rather than just test mankind with yester ra. I mean take Job for instance, according to your theory, God tells the opposing archon to do things to Job, so this archon destroys Job's estate, rather than test Job.
Correction – satan did not destroy or kill All the satan of Job do was suggest it to other men – other men took care of the ra all by themselves
Take the modern evil such as pedophilia, how is this just testing a 10 year old child so innocent, rather than testing the child's ra or tov? And you suppose God as a loving God, allows this as a God-will design of His glory? Yes God allows this and it is all part of God’s design The design by God = gave man Free Will and let him go into the world once in the world - man is capabible of the very worse of humanity God only made the gun - it is to man to use it or miss-use it The children of Job were pawns in someone else testing Why does little Jimmy have to die – life is hard and it is a test for others
The truth – Feel Good Christianity is a lie The idea that God never cause harm to anyone is just nonsense And the Roman legacy of Feel Goodism = If God is Love why doe He allow all this evil in the world – either God is weak or God does not care – or God is not there
Nothing good happens with archons who rape, and destroy... they do not test the minds on humans, they abuse the minds and for many humans almost permanently all their lives. How is a sexually abuse child supposed to grow up and follow a loving God? Do we also tell her that God intentionally designed you to be sexually abused for many years? Would that witness make her love God more? I doubt this.
Nothing good happens with archons – Correct Sexual abuse – life as a Muslim or a Mormon = multiple marriages starting at age 12 Jehovah Witness are banned in several countries over child sexual abuse charges Sexual abuse within the Roman Catholic Church
All of it done by man upon man – man vrs man
Would that witness make her love God more? I doubt this. This witness is there to teach her what life without God is like To whom does she have to turn to for help – when man is against her - only God
What was the Holocaust all about – man hating the jews Or rallying the Jews to a new devotion to the Lord?
Joh 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind? Joh 9:3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
DUH – the man was blind – for the sole purpose of being healed To witness the Glory of God to this world and all who are watching
Scripture does not talk about bad things, but it is alluded here. God is in control, yes, is the main point here. But why did the genes go wrong? Does God design mistakes? No No – not mistakes Rather – Free Will on the part of man – and God loves man so much that He lets us choose world or God But the truth is – it is so easy to choose world because it fuels self and so hard to choose God because it denies self
The clue here is NIGHT or DARK, Jesus leaves us in the dark as to the answer. It's just spoken as God's work to bring us light. OK – we are the Prodigal Son – that God allows to enter the dark world It is our work – our mission – to reveal God’s Glory to the world God is in control, yes, is the main point here.
You say God is the designer of light and dark, so did GOD create sin too intentionally? Scripture says God created the ra – not the sin Sin is when man choose self over God – sin is man’s choice Does God allow this choice – YES! – definition of Free Will Why does God allow this choice – so man can choose God by his own choice – Prodigal Son
Now you explain – as a Christian why would you witness to the Australians Football league that they must follow the 613 Laws from the Torah You said it – now defend it
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2021 5:10:47 GMT -5
The archons are complex as you explain things, but thanks for explaining them now in detail to me.
One question though
You say archons only influence. Satan did not kill Job's family, Satan influenced men, and the wicked men did the destroying and killing.
This is not what "ruling" means, Dave. For example, the demon possession by Legion, did the man have full control of his body? There are many demon possessed souls Jesus cast out, did any of them have full control over their doings? You see when a "ruler" rules, it is much more than just an influence. When you become supporters of God using power than is God's this power flow is not yours, and so you do using His power, thus God rules over you completely, you simply choose which power promises flow. If such a flow of support works for followers of God, it is logical the same power flow works for Satan too.
Let me prove this idea:
Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
Here man is capable of sinning using his own powers of self. You agree with this . No Satanic flow is required here.
Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Here is how James says what I said before: We allow God's power to flow through us, a process called amanuah. When amanuah flows it is called works of God. However the faith does not produce God's works unless you ask.
Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Here there are some wicked humans who also support Satan, by claiming His words, that flow with His power, that moves through you.
1Jo 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
This verse is saying the same thing also using John.
If man does sinning, the power of sinning can flow from human self alone, or from the provider of sin, ie the devil. The works of the devil is to empower the flow of sin.
Not only is this empowerment done by influence, speaking suggestions, but also by demon possession of the mind. Just as a ruler who rules.
This idea of a rule who rules, is NOT the same idea as Governments who rule, they rule outside the body via laws. The Medium allows the administration of different rulers who rule. These rulers channel their power flow via the Medium sometimes directly into the person's mind. This is why when Saul sinned so much, God allowed the HS as a medium to allow another ruler to rule Saul, and this is recorded as a RA-Spirit.
1Ti 6:12 Fight the good fight of faith,
This also says the same thing. There must also be the faith that comes from supporting Satan, who is also able to supply the sinner with more lust for sinning.
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You ask about witness....
You begin in salvation as a babe, growing up in the love rules of Jesus. This takes time. No where does Jesus expect you to support every prayer promise right off once you are a supporter of God. There are several thousand such prayer promises of amanuah, not just 613 of them.
What I suspect you are asking is for the human to be using his self powers of human strength to stop playing sport and follow all the 613 laws. Such a notion is called works of the law by Paul, and while a pious achievement means nothing to God in terms of salvation.
Do you wish to discuss what salvation is and how amanuah works in Jesus, our Saviour? It is my faviourite subject, more important to get right than anything else? Would you not agree?
SHalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 14, 2021 8:55:26 GMT -5
The archons are complex as you explain things, but thanks for explaining them now in detail to me.Complicated – no The angels were created by the right hand and they serve and praise The archon were made by the left hand and serve a different function – you said to spoil – I say just to be selfish and use /abuse men for their own pleasure How do they abuse men – many ways About 200 of them came to earth and set themselves up as strong authorities To be the alpha – to be the master of the world – to be a god - are all self-serving desires Imagine the Greek and Roman Gods (a secular version of Gen 6 / Enoch) Two of them betting and placing man against man for amusement How do they abuse men – many ways Some men are so overwhelmed with money / career / fame they just do not have the time to seek God earnestly – are they committing a crime – are they evil – no just sidetracked – focuses elsewhere How do they abuse men – many ways They pose as aliens with their UFOs – not to recognized and identified But to be a mystery and offer a false plan/hope of salvation through alien knowledge Let me prove this idea: Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. Here man is capable of sinning using his own powers of self. You agree with this . No Satanic flow is required here
One question though You say archons only influence. Satan did not kill Job's family, Satan influenced men, and the wicked men did the destroying and killing. This is not what "ruling" means, Dave. For example, the demon possession by Legion, did the man have full control of his body? There are many demon possessed souls Jesus cast out, …Agreed – Correct – some people are possessed by evil spirits – absolutely agreeHowever – it is crazy to argue that every man that commits a sin is possessed Eve was not possessed by anything that forced her to sin – she choose all by herself Adam was not possessed by anything that forced him to sin – he choose all by himself You are a sinner – tell me of your personal possession by evil spirits – I’d love to hear it Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. And yet they do not repent – why – because they do not have the free will option to choose God They are not the creature that can choose – man is – that is man’s function If they repented – scripture and prophesy would have to be rewritten ----------------- You ask about witness.... You begin in salvation as a babe, growing up in the love rules of Jesus. This takes time. No where does Jesus expect you to support every prayer promise right off once you are a supporter of God. There are several thousand such prayer promises of amanuah, not just 613 of them. What I suspect you are asking is for the human to be using his self powers of human strength to stop playing sport and follow all the 613 laws. Such a notion is called works of the law by Paul, and while a pious achievement means nothing to God in terms of salvation.If you change my question – I guess you can get around answering itDave asks" Sir – the question – we are forbidden from even touching the skin of a dead pig Can believers of the Torah play football or not? Explain this A simple answer is no, they can't play football.WOW - no explination for all these people who love footballSo the next question from the audience = why not – why can’t a Torah believer touch the skin of a dead pigThe next question would beWhy do you say Christians must still keep those 613 Laws Aren’t Christians under a New Covenant? Now you explain – as a Christian why would you witness to the Australians Football league that they must follow the 613 Laws from the Torah You said it – now defend it When you witness to people on the street – is this how you answer their questions?Do you wish to discuss what salvation is and how amanuah works in Jesus, our Saviour?Belief in Jesus Christ as God and spirit (Trinity) = salvation – it is just that simple Faith = belief with conviction – steadfastness = this is better and reaps more reward But here is the problem – there are many diverse doctrinal groups that claim Jesus as savior Right now in the Philippines the Church of God is fight with the Church of Christ – and it involves guns JW claim Jesus Christ – and deny heaven and eternal life Mormons claim Jesus and think satan his twin brother Does it matter what you believe – Paul says YES Eph 6:13 Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you may be able to resist when the times are evil, and after you have done everything, to stand firm. Eph 6:14 Stand firm then! Buckle the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness. Your belief – held as a strong conviction of faith must be in the TRUTH – or you miss If your faith is aimed correctly – Joh 14:23 Yeshua answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our dwelling with him. Joh 14:24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words. And the word you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me. Joh 14:25 These things I have spoken to you while dwelling with you. Joh 14:26 But the Helper, the Ruach ha-Kodesh whom the Father will send in My name, will teach you everything and remind you of everything that I said to you. Joh 3:4 “How can a man be born when he is old?” Nicodemus said to Him. “He cannot enter his mother’s womb a second time and be born, can he?” Joh 3:5 Yeshua answered, “Amen, amen I tell you, unless one is born of water and spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. Joh 3:6 What is born of the flesh is flesh, and what is born of the Spirit is spirit. Neh 9:20 You also gave Your good Ruach to teach them. You did not withhold Your manna from their mouth and You gave them water for their thirst. Joh 14:26 But the Helper, the Ruach ha-Kodesh whom the Father will send in My name, will teach you everything and remind you of everything that I said to you.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2021 14:32:06 GMT -5
D" And yet they do not repent – why – because they do not have the free will option to choose God They are not the creature that can choose – man is – that is man’s function If they repented – scripture and prophesy would have to be rewritten
R How do you know this?
If angels can sin, than angels can repent, without the need of a Saviour to die for their sins, because angels do not have DNA nor procreation ability, so they stand or fall as sinners upon the sinning they choose to do. If they choose not to sin and come back to God, God welcomes them back. And did I suspect before they are all finished in the fruit of their sinning.
Once people have pride developed, they do not return to God, hence repentance has limitations. Same is true for angels who sinned.
Humans are different, when we sin, our sins affect our DNA so our sins do permanent damage to us, as souls, we also inherit DNA (a flesh body). So now we required a Saviour to restore our flesh body and the damaged DNA.
Angels do not have flesh bodies nor DNA I suspect, and according to Jesus do not do procreation, like humans do.
Hence angels can sin without any DNA recording their sinning or changing their bodies. That is my theory not much known from torah on this idea, and this explains why angels cannot have normal sex with humans. So the sinning angels still exist on earth, and will await their end after God finishes dealing with the sin problem. (These words of my theories are subject to change, as I have not completed my thoughts on this idea, Scripture does not speak of these things, I have not studied all things either. I think angels ate food and looked like men, so maybe some more thinking is required???)
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 15, 2021 13:23:41 GMT -5
D" And yet they do not repent – why – because they do not have the free will option to choose God They are not the creature that can choose – man is – that is man’s function If they repented – scripture and prophesy would have to be rewritten R How do you know this? If angels can sin, than angels can repent, Please read Book of Revelation – how does it read if the being of Rev 9 all repent – How does rec 12 play out if the archon repent – how does Rev 20 play out id the beast , the dragon, the devil , and the false prophets all repent
What a silly game you play with scripture
Angels do not have flesh bodies nor DNA I suspect, and according to Jesus do not do procreation, like humans do. Absolutely correct – angels do not have any matter Archon do – because they are made with some matter – different than the angels
Hence angels can sin without any DNA recording their sinning or changing their bodies. Without being made of any matter – angels have no yester ra Those angelic beings made with some matter (i.e. archon) do
angels cannot have normal sex with humans. Absolutely correct – only the archon procreate – because they are made with some matter And they only do it on earth / in earth – not in heaven or the spirit world
If you are such a biblicial scholar that you can deny scripture at will Whay are you unable to answer question from the Torah?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2021 14:51:39 GMT -5
D" Please read Book of Revelation – how does it read if the being of Rev 9 all repent – How does rec 12 play out if the archon repent – how does Rev 20 play out id the beast , the dragon, the devil , and the false prophets all repent
What a silly game you play with scripture R" Repentance has limitations, didn't I say? Read all the scripture on this theme:-
1 When the sinning angels all rallied to get Jesus crucified, that was the last straw. No further kindness entered into to for sinning angels.
2 A person's conscience can be seared, so they no longer have the HS speaking to them.
3 Pride prevents repentance.
4 The war in heaven went for long enough to fully sway the decisions of all the angels. God allowed time for sin to bear its fruit. Not the six seconds you claim.
5 Unpardonable sin, tells you repentance has limitations.
Some of these points may not be applicable to spirits, assuming that the spirit forms of angels are spirits, a term I do not really understand. You mention angels are not made of matter, I would disagree, again you do not follow all the torah on this:
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created,
Angelic cherub are in fact created, bara: Not fattened as you claim, but engineered. You even spoke that one can go into the woods and fatten timber into siege weapons for example. A silly notion. More likely go into the woods, get timber and engineer the timber into siege weapons, makes more sense. Clearly the cherub was made from matter.
What I am saying is since cherub are different kinds to humans, their creative engineering is different to us.
D"Absolutely correct – angels do not have any matter Archon do – because they are made with some matter – different than the angels
R" Notice my response to your statement above
Rob" Hence angels can sin without any DNA recording their sinning or changing their bodies. D" Without being made of any matter – angels have no yester ra Those angelic beings made with some matter (i.e. archon) do
R" You agree that angels are different to humans. Matter or no matter, they are different to humans. Why can't God create matter without yester Ra in it?
Rob: "angels cannot have normal sex with humans.
D" Absolutely correct – only the archon procreate – because they are made with some matter
R" Well, well with your theory you agree with my theory, but fail to elaborate... So?? Please explain?
How than can a sinning angel, who has no matter, no flesh body, have sex with human woman than, to cause the production of these half human, half sinning angels, you term demigods or archons, which are creatures similar to humans and can procreate?
And second question:
Gnostic writings do NOT explain the origin of the first archon in this way. These writing speak of the HS without her consort creating a creature who becomes self, and than procreates by itself making further archons (no mention of human woman here). Totally different story to Enoch.
Enoch describes 200 sinning angels all taking on hundreds of human woman to defile them, causing many different kinds of demigod humanoid beings you term archons. Again a totally different story written by Enoch.
Both sources are completely different from each other on the origin of archons.
Again please explain the discrepancies. Please place the Gnostic accounts of both Enoch and Gnostic writings, so the origin of Archons have complete harmony.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 15, 2021 16:24:03 GMT -5
D" Please read Book of Revelation – how does it read if the being of Rev 9 all repent – How does rec 12 play out if the archon repent – how does Rev 20 play out id the beast , the dragon, the devil , and the false prophets all repent What a silly game you play with scripture R" Repentance has limitations, didn't I say? Read all the scripture on this theme:- WOW Robert your satanology has you fooled
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, YEP – man was created perfect – until unrighteous was found within him The story of Adam and Eve and all mankind - agreed
Angelic cherub are in fact created, bara: Not fattened as you claim, but engineered. You even spoke that one can go into the woods and fatten timber into siege weapons for example. A silly notion. So what were those weapons made of – mud, birds, and squirrels
D"Absolutely correct – angels do not have any matter Archon do – because they are made with some matter – different than the angels
R" You agree that angels are different to humans. Matter or no matter, they are different to humans. Why can't God create matter without yester Ra in it? Because of God’s own Laws of Nature called Thermodynamics Entropy is inherent to neg-entropy
Rob: "angels cannot have normal sex with humans. D" Absolutely correct – only the archon procreate – because they are made with some matter
How than can a sinning angel, who has no matter, no flesh body, have sex with human woman Well here ya go – You are talking about sinning angels as the fallen angels of God who teuned their back on God and divided God kingdom against itself Archon are made with some matter – it was the bane elohiym archon that procreated with mortal women – because matter procreates
Gnostic writings do NOT explain the origin of the first archon in this way. These writing speak of the HS without her consort creating a creature who becomes self, and than procreates by itself making further archons (no mention of human woman here). Totally different story to Enoch.
You are correct – and you know you are correct Then you intentionally blend two different stories and twist them into confusion You know excalty what you do – you do it on purpose
Enoch describes 200 sinning angels all taking on hundreds of human woman to defile them, causing many different kinds of demigod humanoid beings you term archons. Again a totally different story written by Enoch.
Correct – the Gnostic text speak of the First Archon being created by the left hand of God and this First archon was made with some matter and procreated offspring archon Then the agl and Gnostic text say these archon (all of them) were ejected from the heavens into the earth of Gen 1:1 which now also includes the earth of Gen 1:9 = all physical creation
Gen 6 tells us that a sub-group of these archon (principalities / bad-guy angelic beings) the bane elohiym Came to earth and Fathered the Nephilim – who are demigods – who are also called archon
Enoch continues the story from Gen 6 forward The story of the Nephilim (archon)
Both sources are completely different from each other on the origin of archons. One takes place in the heavens first Then the next story happen on the ground Two different stories
Why are you so afraid to answer questions from the Torah
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2021 16:50:19 GMT -5
D" Entropy is inherent to neg-entropyR" Isn't GOD powerful enough to create matter without neg-entropy? y/n D" Archon are made with some matter – it was the bane elohiym archon that procreated with mortal women – because matter procreates
R" Yes I know the bane elohiym archon that procreated with mortal women , but I asked you, HOW IS THIS EVEN POSSIBLE?
Not a problem from GOD to create matter into anything He wants, but GOD is not mentioned by Enoch's account. The 200 angels "bane elohiym archon " all decide to defile the human woman, and you supply no details how this is even possible? Surely you have some Gnostic writings along this idea? D" You are correct – and you know you are correct Then you intentionally blend two different stories and twist them into confusion You know excalty what you do – you do it on purpose
R" no I am not intentionally making anything confusing Dave, I am simply trying to make harmony from all these materials you read. I would suggest not reading them further, because if they have "no light of dawn to the torah", they are not inspired. D" Correct – the Gnostic text speak of the First Archon being created by the left hand of God and this First archon was made with some matter and procreated offspring archon
R" OK than we have two different accounts on the origins of archons, a slang term for so called bad angels or bad demigods, allowed to intentionally do bad things by God. I find when examining your materials, they do not have harmony to each other, unlike the torah which is 100% true. You speak of some errors in dating Jesus birth, some typos, so human oversights, yes, maybe, but the written messages do have harmony, spanning dozens of human writers, thousands of years over time, all in harmony, so unlike the Gnostic writings. Why is this? Surely an opposing angel who is alive today, could not write a harmonious work of deception? Maybe GOD does not allow error to be so deceptive? Don't have all the answers? D: " Both sources are completely different from each other on the origin of archons. One takes place in the heavens first Then the next story happen on the ground Two different storiesR Hence why I do not read them Dave. What you wrote here is a "cop out". They are not inspired. D: "Why are you so afraid to answer questions from the TorahR I am not afraid of torah. I love torah. You do not read torah. Stop reading the confusion and stick to solar scriptoria in Hebrew, not Greek mixing the Hebrew either. Not with Gnostic supplementation's either. But you change topic...? Are we finished with Enoch and Gnosticism now? It's to me a confusion mixture of stories that do not follow torah, hence we can stop reading them. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. (KJV) Terrible translation for Hebrew word in English Heb 11:6 But without amanuah it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must amanuah that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. (Hebrew) So we must understand amanuah properly otherwise we are not saved by Jesus. spiritualsprings.org/ss-1513.htmRead our study on amanuah, and all the dozens of webpages looking at nearly every time amanuah is mentioned, including the other root related words in Hebrew. Tell me what you think? Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 15, 2021 22:48:53 GMT -5
D"Entropy is inherent to neg-entropy R" Isn't GOD powerful enough to create matter without neg-entropy? y/n Not saying that God can’t do anything But in the reality we find ourselves – this uni-verse of the 10D multi-verse God’s Laws of Thermodynamics remain In a different dimension / heaven – or at a different time when the rules are different I would never limit GodD" You are correct – and you know you are correct Then you intentionally blend two different stories and twist them into confusion You know exactly what you do – you do it on purpose R" no I am not intentionally making anything confusing Dave, I am simply trying to make harmony from all these materials you read. No you are not – you consistently mix terms and words just to corrupt the cosmologyYou also play word games – just so you don’t have to understand the message – the bigger picture Angels – from the perspective of man – they are all the invisible beings that reside (once resided) in the heavens – angels are heavenly beings - all heavenly being are termed angels by man – all of the are elohiym Now – as the scholars study scripture – as Jesus taught scripture – as the First Century Rabbi or Christian further defined these multiple invisible heavenly beings (angels) they became further subdivided. Eph 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the worldly forces of this darkness, and against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. All of these beings are bad-guy angels – and these bad-guy angels are called archon to distinguish them from the good-guy angels I offered once to switch all my vocabulary to principalities for the archon close to man and Powers for the archon above us if it would make you fell better I understand what power words have over you - word man - I stick to precepts/ teachings /instructions / principles Their originThe First Archon was created in heaven – by the left hand The First Archon was deliberately created for a purpose – to fulfill a function The First Archon was made with some matter (does not say made of matter – but with some) The First Archon procreated offspring to fill the ranks of his family tree – all of them are called archon And all of them were ejected from God’s higher heavens into the lower heavens – here in 3D land visible physical creation and 1 level of invisibility above us – Paul called them Principalities Slavic Enoch says God summoned the lower heavens to bring it about Gnostic John said it happened by the left hand D"Archon are made with some matter – it was the bane elohiym archon that procreated with mortal women – because matter procreates The bane elohiym are the offspring of the First Archon - the sons of (invisible bad-guy heavenly beings) These bane elohiym (archon) fathered the Nephilim (who are also archon by definition) R" Yes I know the bane elohiym archon that procreated with mortal women , but I asked you, HOW IS THIS EVEN POSSIBLE?Not only did the bane elohiym father the Nephilim (archon) – but they also crossbred the chimeras of our legendsNot a problem from GOD to create matter into anything He wants, but GOD is not mentioned by Enoch's account. Again you are attempting to mix terms Gnostic John and Slavic Enoch spoke to the first archons creation Ethoptic Enoch speaks of only the bane elohiym here on the groundThe 200 angels "bane elohiym archon " YES! – this is from Enoch and ever secular ‘other god’ matrix is built upon thisEgyptian gods came from space – there are 200 of them in family units the infight with 20 major playors The Gods of Sumar – came from space – 200 in family units that infought with 20 major players The Viking god – the god’s of Philippines and Samoa – the gods’ of the Greeks and Romans – the god’s of South America So much evidence you must denyI would suggest not reading them further, because if they have "no light of dawn to the torah", they are not inspired.OK – then please eliminate Enoch’s precepts about the Word become flesh to save humanity – and the precept of a Messianic Redeemer – and the idea that men can be save by the name of the Messianic Redeemer
All of this Enoch ideas / teachings / precepts must be garbage according to Robert
Then please strike 64 Enoch verses from your official Roman textD: "Why are you so afraid to answer questions from the Torah R I am not afraid of torah. I love torah. Then why are you so unwilling to answer any questions?All this time you have asked me one question after another – just so you cab ridicule me instead of studying scripture like a scholar I have asked you some questions – yet you refuse to even attempt to provide any answer You are a Christian and I have asked you to teach me your Torah – and you resist Just exactly what is your witness?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2021 16:04:27 GMT -5
D" Then why are you so unwilling to answer any questions?R" because we are changing topics. It adds to the confusion you have already. One must break down your first confusion into truth and error, than we can move one seeking more truth. Changing the subject is a way to avoid conviction. D" The First Archon was created in heaven – by the left hand The First Archon was deliberately created for a purpose – to fulfill a function The First Archon was made with some matter (does not say made of matter – but with some)
The First Archon procreated offspring to fill the ranks of his family tree – all of them are called archon And all of them were ejected from God’s higher heavens into the lower heavens –Rob: "This account is NOT spoken by Enoch, why would Enoch leave out this account, and other details Gnosticism shows? I quote some Gnostic material: But Norea( the first woman born normally from her mother Eve) said, “Sir (I am Eleleth, sagacity, the great angel who stands in the presence of the holy spirit.), teach me about these authorities. How did they come into being? By what genesis, and out of what material, and who created them and their power?”
The great angel Eleleth, understanding, spoke to me: “Incorruptibility inhabits limitless realms. Sophia, who is called Pistis, wanted to create something, alone, without her partner, and what she created was celestial.
“A veil exists between the world above and the realms below, and shadow came into being beneath the veil. That shadow became matter, and that shadow was projected apart. And what she had created came to be in matter, like an aborted fetus. It assumed a shape molded out of shadow, and became an arrogant beast resembling a lion. It was androgynous, as I have already said, because it derived from matter.
“Opening his eyes he saw a vast quantity of endless matter, and he turned arrogant, saying, ‘I am god, and there is no one but me.’
“When he said this, he sinned against all. And a voice came from above the realm of absolute power, saying, ‘You are wrong, Samael,’ that is, god of the blind.
“And he said, ‘If any other thing exists before me, let it become visible to me!’ Immediately Sophia pointed her finger and introduced light into matter, and she pursued it down to the region of chaos. And she returned up to her light. Once again darkness returned to matter.
“This ruler, by being androgynous, made himself a vast realm, an endless precinct. And he contemplated creating offspring for himself, and created seven offspring, androgynous like their parent.
“And he said to his offspring, ‘I am the god of all.’
“Zoe the daughter of Pistis Sophia shouted, saying to him, ‘You are wrong, Sakla’ (for which the alternate name is Yaldabaoth). She breathed into his face, and her breath became a fiery angel for her; and that angel bound Yaldabaoth and cast him down into Tartaros, at the bottom of the abyss.
“Now, when his offspring Sabaoth saw the strength of that angel, he repented and condemned his father and his mother matter.
“He loathed her, but he sang songs of praise up to Sophia and her daughter Zoe. And Sophia and Zoe found him and put him in charge of the seventh heaven, below the veil between above and below. And he is called ‘god of the forces, Sabaoth,’ since he is up above the forces of chaos, for Sophia placed him there.
“Now, when these events had come to pass, he made himself a huge four-faced chariot of cherubim and harps and lyres and an infinity of angels to act as ministers.
“Sophia took her daughter Zoe and had her sit at his right to teach him about the things that exist in the eighth heaven, and the angel of wrath she placed at his left. Since that day, his right has been called life, and the left has signified the unrighteousness of the realm of absolute power above. It was before your time that they came into being.
“Now, when Yaldabaoth saw him in this great splendor and at this height, he envied him, and the envy became something androgynous, and this was the origin of envy. And envy engendered death, and death engendered his offspring and gave each of them charge of its heaven. All the heavens of chaos became full of their multitudes.
“But it was by the will of the father of all that they all came into being, after the pattern of all the things above, so that the sum of chaos might be attained.
“There, I have taught you about the pattern of the rulers and the matter in which it was made visible, along with their parent and their universe.”
There are many things here not found in the Moses torah, but I shall not discuss this, only the fact these things are NOT discussed in Enoch's account. 2. And he took up his parable and said--Enoch a righteous man, whose eyes were opened by God, saw the vision of the Holy One in the heavens, ⌈which⌉ the angels showed me, and from them I heard everything, and from them I understood as I saw, but not for this generation, but for a remote one which is for to come. Enoch was are told was shown and heard of everything, but NOT about the heavenly origin of the archons, or the daughter of the HS, or the fact the HS made a creature which became the origin of the archon, a purposed design by God do his will. 2. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives from among the children of men and beget us children.' 3. And Semjâzâ, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.' Search Semjâzâ in Gnostic writings yields no resultsI cannot find any amount of readings in Gnosticm to make harmony from Enoch to GNostic accounts of Archon Origins. D" Gnostic John and Slavic Enoch spoke to the first archons creationSupply me the links, must I read and defend your cause, it's your theory, you defend it. D" Not only did the bane elohiym father the Nephilim (archon) – but they also crossbred the chimeras of our legendsR Again you did not answer my question: R" Yes I know the bane elohiym archon procreated with some mortal women , but I asked you, HOW IS THIS EVEN POSSIBLE? You do not answer this. D" Then why are you so unwilling to answer any questions? All this time you have asked me one question after another – just so you cab ridicule me instead of studying scripture like a scholar I have asked you some questions – yet you refuse to even attempt to provide any answer
You are a Christian and I have asked you to teach me your Torah – and you resist Just exactly what is your witness?R" Dave I have been with you a whole year, trying to piece together your theories on the archon, and it is merely confusion to say the least. You say You are a Christian and I have asked you to teach me your Torah – and you resist Just exactly what is your witness?I have offered you to study my links about faith, but you are unwilling? I would love to discuss how to be saved by Jesus. Instead you ask about the mark of Cain, and what this is. I would rather we speak about matters in Scripture where much evidence lies, not where little evidence is found. So where do we go from here Dave? Can you defend the origin of the archons or not? Or is the Enoch account different from Gnostic account? Does the HS really have a daughter? I thought you see YHWH as cardinal one with three expressions, how does one even fathom Greek ideas inside Gnostic, just read the good bits and leave out the bad bits? Torah does not work like this, at least it reads perfectly all the time, though you point out some problems, minor really. So did Enoch see everything or not in heaven? He says angels sinned. Their leader Semjâzâ is not found in Gnostic accounts? Why is that? Enoch says angels sinned, Ezekiel says Angels sinned, Rev 12 says angels sinned. So far so good. Than Enoch says the angels had sex with humans producing giant demigods. I asked you is this even possible? Its a major shift from Enoch writings, and you say nothing about this? You agree that angels are different created kind than humans, so the sexual intercourse is not compatible. SO explain how is it possible? I can't find any evidence to back your theory, only this so far: exemplore.com/paranormal/My-Personal-experience-with-the-paranormalIts really about sinning angels, playing around in your mind, via the pineal gland, and masturbation is really a terrible sin in itself, many suggest this is the demon having sex with you. Personally Dave I will not go this far into origins of archons, I tend to see there is no evidence as your Gnostic materials suggest, but as for sinning angels also termed demons, yes they are real indeed. The scriptures simply say one of the angels sinned, causing others to sin with him. But Gnostic writings speak of so much complex stuff, so many things beyond the simple Moses account. SHalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 16, 2021 19:07:15 GMT -5
D"Then why are you so unwilling to answer any questions? R" because we are changing topics. It adds to the confusion you have already. One must break down your first confusion into truth and error, than we can move one seeking more truth. Changing the subject is a way to avoid conviction.
I have been trying to get you on a different topic for months But you admit – that in all your SDA education – you are only qualified to speak to satanology So you cannot yield your conviction to your satan and his strong authority
D" The First Archon was created in heaven – by the left hand Rob: "This account is NOT spoken by Enoch, why would Enoch leave out this account, and other details Gnosticism shows? I quote some Gnostic material: Sophia, who is called Pistis, wanted to create something, alone, without her partner, and what she created was celestial. … and cast him down into Tartaros, at the bottom of the abyss.
There are many things here not found in the Moses torah, but I shall not discuss this, only the fact these things are NOT discussed in Enoch's account.
The story of the birth of Jesus is 6 to 9 years different between Luke and Mathew Luke says it happened after the next King and Roman governor after Herod Mathew says it happened at least two years before Herod’s death
Both Mathew and Luke speak to the same event – and disagree – but that is OK Christian – you won’t even look at the evidence Both Mathew and Luke are INSPIRED and weighted accordingly
No one makes the claim that the Gnostic text or Enoch is INSPIRED No one holds Gnostic text or Enoch with the same weight as the Torah or Mathew and Luke Gnostic written and the Slavic Enoch speak to the First Archon creation in the heavens The Ethoptic Enoch – from which you quote – speaks only to the bane elohiym
Amazing that you cannot tell the difference
Enoch was are told was shown and heard of everything, but NOT about the heavenly origin of the archons, or the daughter of the HS, or the fact the HS made a creature which became the origin of the archon, a purposed design by God do his will.
So what is this Slavic Enoch 26:1 AND I summoned the very lowest a second time, and said: 'Let Archas come forth hard,' and he came forth hard from the invisible. 2 And Archas came forth, hard, heavy, and very red. 3 And I said: 'Be opened, Archas, and let there be born from thee,' and he came undone, an age came forth, very great and very dark, bearing the creation of all lower things, and I saw that it was good and said to him: 4 'Go thou down below, and make thyself firm, and be for a foundation for the lower things,' and it happened and he went down and fixed himself, and became the foundation for the lower things, and below the darkness there is nothing else. Same story – just a different view
2. And the angels, the children of the heaven, saw and lusted after them, and said to one another: 'Come, let us choose us wives from among the children of men and beget us children.' 3. And Semjâzâ, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.'
I cannot find any amount of readings in Gnosticm to make harmony from Enoch to Gnostic accounts of Archon Origins. (Nephilim)
The Apocryphon of John - The Nag Hammadi Library And he (Noah) recognized his authority, and she who belongs to the light was with him, having shone on them because he (the chief archon) had brought darkness upon the whole earth.
"And he made a plan with his powers. He sent his angels to the daughters of men, that they might take some of them for themselves and raise offspring for their enjoyment. And at first they did not succeed. When they had no success, they gathered together again and they made a plan together. They created a counterfeit spirit, who resembles the Spirit who had descended, so as to pollute the souls through it. And the angels changed themselves in their likeness into the likeness of their mates (the daughters of men), filling them with the spirit of darkness, which they had mixed for them, and with evil. They brought gold and silver and a gift and copper and iron and metal and all kinds of things. And they steered the people who had followed them into great troubles, by leading them astray with many deceptions. They (the people) became old without having enjoyment. They died, not having found truth and without knowing the God of truth.
Just exactly what is your witness? I have offered you to study my links about faith, but you are unwilling? I am not here to help you increase your faith in your doctrine – or validate your doctrine for you I would love to discuss how to be saved by Jesus. You spend all you time here disbelieving anything and everything except your satanology doctrine that divides God’s Kingdom against itself in direct contrast to the words of Jesus Christ
Is this your witness here and now – God is weak because His kingdom is divided against itself – and your satan broke it – how to do you expect any Torah believer to accept this doctrine
Instead you ask about the mark of Cain, and what this is. I would rather we speak about matters in Scripture where much evidence lies, not where little evidence is found.
If you understood the curse and mark of Cain then you would understand the death of Cain and the curse of Lamech
Gen 4:23 And Lamech said unto his wives, Adah and Zillah, Hear my voice; ye wives of Lamech, hearken unto my speech: for I have slain a man to my wounding, and a young man to my hurt. 24 If Cain shall be avenged sevenfold, truly Lamech seventy and sevenfold.
If you knew why the Jews were prevent from touching the skin of a dead pig – you would understand the abomination – and therefore understand the abomination desolation that had nothing to do with 70AD and Rome
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2021 15:52:06 GMT -5
Greetings Dave
At last you answer my questions with Gnostic writings that do indeed make sense.
So the HS leaving here consort, decided to make a being, who become self, and thought He was a god, began sinning in this regard, so was banished to a lower order of heaven. This chief archon, began to procreate itself into other archons, who later (about 200 of them) decided to come to earth and defile woman. They did this by changing forms, so the men who had sex with these woman, actually became corrupted, and the children these men bore also corrupted. These became Nephilim, the giants who ruled earth as more archons. Some eventually died and so the spirit forms of these giants continued to live on as evil demon spirits.
Overall the class of Beings termed archons, are a term to describe Beings intentionally created by God to do ra.
Nearly done, one question Dave:
He (chief archon) sent his angels to the daughters of men, that they might take some of them for themselves and raise offspring for their enjoyment.
Why is the term archon, also classified as an cherub? The chief archon procreates itself into more archons in the lower heavens. This is something cherub cannot do? Cherub are also not of the same matter as humans or presumbly archons?
You speak of good angels and bad guy angels, yet both were created very differently? The Father YHWH created the cherub, and the HS created a single archon angelic being who immediately became evil with ra thoughts. Hence two creations for the same classification of kind. Can you explain why Gnostic writings even use the term angels with archons? It would have been better to keep them different?
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D"I have been trying to get you on a different topic for months
R" Oh sorry, create a new thread than, and you begin illuminating me. I will try not to evaluate your material until I fully understand it, OK?
D" If you understood the curse and mark of Cain then you would understand the death of Cain and the curse of Lamech
R" Oh ------------------
D" You spend all you time here disbelieving anything and everything except your satanology doctrine that divides God’s Kingdom against itself in direct contrast to the words of Jesus Christ
R" If the devils were one the same side as God's kingdom, I would agree with you, discussing them as separate would divide God's kingdom.
So prove to me that devil and devils kingdom is on God's side?
Here is my proof they are not on same side as God's kingdom.
Joh 8:12 ¶ Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
light opposes dark. So already we have two separate entities.
You get around this by saying God creates dark?
Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do
Yes God engineers both darkness and ra, the dysfunctional aspects of darkness.
So you than say God places both entities into his perfect will and calls both very good.
Another view, is GOD only creates darkness and ra, so the sinning of some beings is made manifest. As the shadow experiment shows, to make shadows of darkness you require a relational distance between the Creator and the Creature causing the sin problem. In this view, the darkness and the shadows of ra, and the sinner causing the sin darkness all by definition oppose GOD because of their sinning. In this view, the sin problem is not a part of God's will, but GOD "put's up" with the darkness and the sinners causing darkness, until the sin problem is fairly and lovingly dealt by GOD.
So as we proceed through Jesus speech, which of these views is more likely to be the case, view 1 or view 2?
Joh 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
Some Jews knew about a pierced Messiah, but many other Jews did not know this. When Jesus is lifted up on the cross.
Nu 21:8 And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole:
GOD tells Moses to place a "burning Being" upon the pole, and so Moses placed a symbol of a serpent upon the pole. This is NOT what God told him? Or maybe we have two "burning beings" upon the pole? One "burning being" bit Israel and they began dying much faster. The other "burning being" would heal them if they chose to look at the symbol up there.
Question: are these two burning beings, on the same side of God's kingdom?
Or do these two burning beings Oppose each other?
Ge 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
Here is the same burning being, that Moses uses as a Hebrew word. Here the burning being speaks to Eve, and gets her to sin.
Question: Is this burning being, on the same side of God's kingdom, getting man to sin?
Or do this burning beings Opposing God because it gets mankind also to sin?
If we stick to view 1, than sin is also a part of God will, and design. Some go on to say inside man are both entities of good and ra, so mankind is to disdain the yester ra in the mind and do instead the yester tov that God really approves.
SO the burning being is simply testing man by getting man to sin. It is up to man not to yield to the sin and testing/tempting, and follow God properly.
But in a German classroom many years ago a Professor asked his students, did God create everything. Some students said yes. So the Professor said, if God created everything, than evil is created, therefore God must also be evil, and a fairy tale.
A brave student called Albert Einstein challenged the teacher that evil does not exist, It is simply a term sinners use to describe living in sin, with less of God's power flowing.
That is verified by the shadow experiment, that is exactly how sin shadows are made. God does not do the sinning, He only makes himself shine less brightly.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Jesus calls the devil a provider (ab) of lies, we usually translate a father of lies.
Question How many providers are in heaven? One
So why does Jesus call the devil a father?
SO how does view 1 work if there are two fathers in the created heavens of God?
Joh 8:46 ¶ Which of you convinceth me of sin?
The Greek word here is hamartia, or chataah, meaning sin-offering.
Jesus is asking the Jews do you convict me of a sin-offering? Jesus has done no errors, so does not require to look upon the pole with the two burning beings there. If you have done nothing wrong, you do not require a sin-offering. Yet the Israel who sinned, and now look to the sin-offering on the pole, to remove that sin, tells you the two burning beings oppose each other.
Some say, yes the burning being only tests mankind. If that is so, and on the same side as God's kingdom, why than must the sin-bearer have to die for our sins?
Joh 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
QUestion. DOes this mean if you hear GOD, or Not hear God, are you on the same side as God but do not hear, or are you opposing God in your sins, therefore do not hear God?
Joh 8:48 Then answered the Jews, and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil?
Why do the Jews accuse Jesus having a devil, if Jesus is opposing the Jews?
Jesus is opposing the Jews, hence why the Jews say Jesus is a devil.
But Jesus is saying the Jews here have the devil in them, not Jesus.
Joh 8:57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
Jesus supplies evidence that Jesus is greater than humans, from divine origins.
Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. (KJV)
The Jews took up stones to stone Jesus to death. Yet Jesus chose NOT to die than. Divinity would not die than because the Jews claimed Jesus should die because a human is claiming to be God. So Jesus would not die than, and opposed their intent.
Question If Jesus opposed their intent, than is it logical that the passage is also about opposing?
The Hebrew word "satan" means to "oppose/opponent/opposer" This word is used to establish meaning when some being opposes another being. If is a functional word, not the name of some Being per se'/
Mt 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: 26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? 27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. 28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.
In this passage, is Jesus speaking of two kingdoms? Yes the kingdom of devil and the kingdom of GOD. SO if Jesus cast out devils and spoil his kingdom, than the kingdom of God has come upon you. So these two kingdoms oppose each other, and the rules of both kingdoms oppose each other.
Why do they oppose each other? Because the devil kingdom promotes sinning, and the kingdom of God does no promote sinning.
But view 1, still allows for this? Man is to disdain ra and do tov. OK, so why does divinity come down to earth to directly challenge this kingdom, destroy it and judge it, so the sinning kingdom of devils will no longer exist in the eternity ahead?
In the second view, divinity comes down to oppose sin by dying to sin, thus revolving the sin problem for all eternity. That means sinning will no longer ever be tolerated ever again.
In the first view, why not simply have yester ra for eternity in humans, and only allow yester tov humans to live on, but yester ra humans no live on? Since GOD is able to do ra regardless of his laws, than there is no need for divinity to die. Everything can be handled by heaven from heaven. But the NT does not do this, divinity comes down to die on the pole. Why? to oppose the burning being upon the pole.
SHalom
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Post by Dave on Jan 17, 2021 22:28:12 GMT -5
So the HS leaving here consort, decided to make a being, who become self, All Gnostic accept the Trinity – the HS is the Spirit of God = the HS is God This gnostic text simple places the creation of the Archon to the Left Hand of God God is still the only creator – no such thing as a second creator and thought He was a god, His very first though was of Self – correct – he thought himself alone and therefore the first began sinning in this regard, so was banished to a lower order of heaven. Also – the archon are made of some matter – this makes them less than angels or heavenly Adamus the perfect race of man – and matter does not belong in the invisible heavens – the archon do not belong in heaven – do not fit in heaven – and are cast into matter (physical creation) This chief archon, began to procreate itself into other archons, Correct – the First Archon procreated an army of offspring / children all of the family archon who later (about 200 of them) decided to come to earth and defile woman. Later – a small group of 200 – of the total number – a sub-set of them all are responsible for Gen 6
They did this by changing forms, so the men who had sex with these woman, actually became corrupted, and the children these men bore also corrupted. They did not turn into men – they always remain archon Shapeshifting is not about them changing shape – but rather them making us see / believe in a false image The archon are made with some matter – and women are all matter This is all I know – it is all it says
These became Nephilim, the giants who ruled earth as more archons. YES – the Nephilim are still of the family archon – grandchildren to the First Archon Some eventually died and so the spirit forms of these giants continued to live on as evil demon spirits. YES! After the flood – 90% are jailed and 10% remain Of the 10% that remain - They are made of matter and therefore they die off eventually First they father the Rephiem – then become trapped here as evil spirit after they die Overall the class of Beings termed archons, are a term to describe Beings intentionally created by God to do ra. They are intentionally created by God for a purpose Is that purpose ra? – Gnostic literature says they are to stress creation – and help man forget who he really is Who is man – spirt from God – souljourning here to witness – and we will return to God in the end You absolutely deny this – the archon influence in the SDA doctrine is clear
Nearly done, one question Dave: Why is the term archon, also classified as an cherub? Who says this – only you
The chief archon procreates itself into more archons in the lower heavens. This is something cherub cannot do? YES! You are correct – this is how we know for sure the archon are not cherub
You speak of good angels and bad guy angels, yet both were created very differently? The Father YHWH created the cherub, and the HS created a single archon angelic being who immediately became evil with ra thoughts. Hence two creations for the same classification of kind. NO – two separate creation for two separate kind – and all kind after its own kind Can you explain why Gnostic writings even use the term angels with archons? It would have been better to keep them different? And the Gnostic writings do keep them separate – and speak of the archon Slavic Enoch also speaks of the Archas – same being different spelling John, James, Peter, Philip, Thomas, and Paul all speak of the archon and anything they wrote about it was place into the Roman index and you are not allowed to read it
The Prayer of Paul is a simple prayer that sounds like any other prayer – except for the phrase = “tell me what no archon has heard” – suddenly this writing of Paul is heresy In fact – Roman wants you to believe that all the agl authors also wrote heresy at the same time they wrote the agl
You believe Rome – you accept that Rome is the authority that judges scripture as inspired – you let Rome instruct you as to your beliefs and attitudes
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D"I have been trying to get you on a different topic for months R" Oh sorry, create a new thread than, and you begin illuminating me. I will try not to evaluate your material until I fully understand it, OK?
You want me to present do you can ridicule and tear down You first – you are a Bible Scholar that Preaches openly on the net It is your turn to teach me the great insight of a SDA education
D" If you understood the curse and mark of Cain then you would understand the death of Cain and the curse of Lamech - R" Oh So you don’t understand what I mean – then what do you says is the curse and the mark and how does it affect the ahl ------------------
R" If the devils were one the same side as God's kingdom, I would agree with you Instead you believe that God’s Kingdom is divided against itself – and satan divided it with 1/3rd of God’s owm loyal angels
So prove to me that devil and devils kingdom is on God's side? NO – you prove to me that Jesus Christ lied when he made the claim that a Kingdom divided against itself cannot stand No – you prove to me that God’s Kingdom must fail – Or you prove to me that Jesus Christ lied
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