Post by rob on Sept 14, 2023 6:44:25 GMT -5
Greetings Dave
Dave" if you cannot discuss theology at depth – why do you present yourself as an expert?
Rob" I am no expert, just somebody who loves to explore things at infinite depth. I do not like jargon, which is a proud way scholars make a name for themselves, excluding others from their club.
Dave: "Absolutely agree – and every one of those metaphors, similes, is another layer of the same meaning – Like layer of an onion – each layer deeper and richer in meaning –
Rob" we both agree
Dave" Yep – from poetry you can invent any analogy you want
Rob" Maybe it's Gods way to confuse those who wish to be confused in their pride.
Dave" Correct – you mock what you do not know
You and the Catholics call it special knowledge that saves a Gnostic – when the whole time we ARE SPEAKING TO THE BAPTISM OF THE Holy Spirit
You and Ellen White mock the idea – call it satanic
More anti-christian teaching
Rob" If you do not wish to understand "Faith" there is no need to mock me, for understanding your reluctance.
Dave" Robert – your knowledge of scripture is so lacking it crazy. It is obvious you have never studied scripture and you certainly do not understand the Jewish mind-set of the NT Gospel
(google) Is the book of Psalms songs or prayers?
Psalms, book of the Old Testament composed of sacred songs, or of sacred poems meant to be sung.
Rob" You are welcome to your opinion and the tradition of your elders.
I will stick to the torah and the torah ONLY :-
Ps 4:1 ¶ ..and hear my prayer.
Ps 6:9 ..the LORD will receive my prayer.
Ps 17:1 ¶ ..A Prayer of David.
Ps 39:12 Hear my prayer, O LORD,
Ps 42:8 ...his song shall be with me, and my prayer
Ps 54:2 Hear my prayer, O God;
Ps 55:1 ¶ ..Give ear to my prayer, O God;
Ps 61:1 ¶ ..O God; attend unto my prayer.
Ps 65:2 O thou that hearest prayer,
Ps 66:19 ..he hath attended to the voice of my prayer.
Ps 66:20 Blessed be God, ..my prayer,
Ps 69:13 ¶ But as for me, my prayer is
Ps 72:20 The prayers of David .. are ended.
Ps 84:8 ..hear my prayer:
Ps 86:1 ¶ A Prayer of David.
Ps 88:2 Let my prayer come before thee:
Ps 90:1 ¶ A Prayer of Moses
Ps 102:1 ¶ A Prayer of the afflicted,
Ps 141:2 Let my prayer be set forth before thee
Ps 142:1 ¶ A Prayer when he was in the cave.
Ps 143:1 ¶ Hear my prayer, O LORD,
Jeff Benner sees "t@phillah" as "pleading", but "prayer" seems OK to me, the King James may have this meaning correct?
Dave" Zero academic honesty! - just make it up
Rob" As you can see, the Bible makes my theology, I do not make things up.
-------------------
Dave you still see STN as a prosecutor?
And mock me when God at our right hand, does not function as a prosecutor, but rather a Saviour.
You mock my two pennies of thought :-
Dave" It does not mean - Somebody at your right hand is empowering you, helping you to make decisions.
Rob" OK what does the "right hand " mean than?
Dave" You just said - Rob" Proof that the ... God is stronger than the opposing one.
Rob" Just because God is stronger than the creature, does not mean God dictates your free will to choose.
If you choose to rebel (break relationship) the fact God is stronger, does not help here. The relationship is broken and God can do nothing about this fact.
Dave" In simple terms -
The Right Hand - is the Hand of instruction and salvation
The Left Hand - is the hand of correction and mystery
Rob" Not what the material you posted says:
Right" is a synonym for "goodness" and "brightness," and "left" for "badness," "awkwardness," and "clumsiness.
My two pennies:-
The "right hand" is a person's active cognitive decison making world.
Either God or Satan stands at your right hand, actively empowering your decision making, giving your decisions their power.
Ge 48:18 The father was empowering the son using his right hand.
Ex 29:20 Aaron was active in the sacrifice process, the "right hand" symbolizes this active process of forgiveness.
Nu 22:26 Dave" Yep the path was blocked – can go to the right or left. Why is literal scripture a mystery to you?
Rob" So if the path is blocked, the active power of the right hand, is "opposing" the passage of the ass.
Not prosecuting the ass, nor accusing the ass, not being some adversary to the ass. The active "right hand" was opposing the ass.
De 5:32 Dave" Yep – stay on the straight and narrow path – don’t go to the right or left
Why is literal scripture a mystery to you?
Rob" Correct, do not transgress with an active right hand....
Jos 1:7 The right hand means do not be active with your powers of self, to trangress the laws of Moses
Job 23:8 Dave" The Left Hand - is the hand of correction and mystery
Rob" I could agree with you on the Left Hand.
The right hand is the active part of your decision making, where powers cannot be seen
Ps 16:8 Dave" The Right Hand - is the Hand of instruction and salvation
Rob" Hmm? not really. The human has on his right hand, the active powers of God who saves us.
Ps 26:10 Dave" quotes Adam Clark
Rob" The human's active cognitive entity that makes decisions, now allows much sinning to happen.
Ps 89:42
Rob" The human's active cognitive entity that makes decisions, now allows an adversary to be an agent for the human's sinning.
Ps 109:6 ¶ Set thou a wicked man over him: and let Satan stand at his right hand.
Dave" YEP – the Heavenly Prosecutor
Rob" typical, make the meaning different?
Rob" The human's active cognitive entity that makes decisions, now allows Satan as his agent for sinning.
In other words the active hand, is allowing Satan to empower his active mind wanting to sin.
Ps 110:1
Dave comments on salvation
Rob" The Father says to His Son, at the right hand of the Father, let me make your enemies become your footstool.
The active right hand, I am using is consistent as a meaning for all verses of context. This is not what Dave is doing.
Ps 138:7 The right hand is GOD's active nature. In this case His salvation.
Dave" In simple terms -
The Right Hand - is the Hand of instruction and salvation
The Left Hand - is the hand of correction and mystery
100% consistent with Jewish teaching
Rob" I do not agree Dave. sorry.
The "right hand" refers to the active nature of the human wanting power for something (from some power higher than the human).
or
The "right hand" refers to the active nature of GOD providing power for something
or
The "right hand" refers to the active nature of SATAN providing power for something
Dave" How does this prove your satan rebels, hates, or opposes God?
ROb" It shows two opposing powers,
the human's right hand has GOD or SATAN
God saves the human or Satan empowers the human
-----------------------
Ps 111:7 The works of his hands are verity and judgment; all his commandments are sure.
8 They stand fast for ever and ever, and are done in truth and uprightness.
The Hebrew words used here is emeth and aman, both related to amanuh, the word for faith.
The works of God's right hand are based on faith and they endure for ever and ever.
The work of the Opposer, at a human's right hand is empowering the human with self power, is not based on faith that endures for ever and ever.
This is a contrasting arrangement, mentioned in the torah for a reason. The word meaning of Opposer/oppose also is used for this reason.
------------------
Shalom
Dave" if you cannot discuss theology at depth – why do you present yourself as an expert?
Rob" I am no expert, just somebody who loves to explore things at infinite depth. I do not like jargon, which is a proud way scholars make a name for themselves, excluding others from their club.
Dave: "Absolutely agree – and every one of those metaphors, similes, is another layer of the same meaning – Like layer of an onion – each layer deeper and richer in meaning –
Rob" we both agree
Dave" Yep – from poetry you can invent any analogy you want
Rob" Maybe it's Gods way to confuse those who wish to be confused in their pride.
Dave" Correct – you mock what you do not know
You and the Catholics call it special knowledge that saves a Gnostic – when the whole time we ARE SPEAKING TO THE BAPTISM OF THE Holy Spirit
You and Ellen White mock the idea – call it satanic
More anti-christian teaching
Rob" If you do not wish to understand "Faith" there is no need to mock me, for understanding your reluctance.
Dave" Robert – your knowledge of scripture is so lacking it crazy. It is obvious you have never studied scripture and you certainly do not understand the Jewish mind-set of the NT Gospel
(google) Is the book of Psalms songs or prayers?
Psalms, book of the Old Testament composed of sacred songs, or of sacred poems meant to be sung.
Rob" You are welcome to your opinion and the tradition of your elders.
I will stick to the torah and the torah ONLY :-
Ps 4:1 ¶ ..and hear my prayer.
Ps 6:9 ..the LORD will receive my prayer.
Ps 17:1 ¶ ..A Prayer of David.
Ps 39:12 Hear my prayer, O LORD,
Ps 42:8 ...his song shall be with me, and my prayer
Ps 54:2 Hear my prayer, O God;
Ps 55:1 ¶ ..Give ear to my prayer, O God;
Ps 61:1 ¶ ..O God; attend unto my prayer.
Ps 65:2 O thou that hearest prayer,
Ps 66:19 ..he hath attended to the voice of my prayer.
Ps 66:20 Blessed be God, ..my prayer,
Ps 69:13 ¶ But as for me, my prayer is
Ps 72:20 The prayers of David .. are ended.
Ps 84:8 ..hear my prayer:
Ps 86:1 ¶ A Prayer of David.
Ps 88:2 Let my prayer come before thee:
Ps 90:1 ¶ A Prayer of Moses
Ps 102:1 ¶ A Prayer of the afflicted,
Ps 141:2 Let my prayer be set forth before thee
Ps 142:1 ¶ A Prayer when he was in the cave.
Ps 143:1 ¶ Hear my prayer, O LORD,
Jeff Benner sees "t@phillah" as "pleading", but "prayer" seems OK to me, the King James may have this meaning correct?
Dave" Zero academic honesty! - just make it up
Rob" As you can see, the Bible makes my theology, I do not make things up.
-------------------
Dave you still see STN as a prosecutor?
And mock me when God at our right hand, does not function as a prosecutor, but rather a Saviour.
You mock my two pennies of thought :-
Dave" It does not mean - Somebody at your right hand is empowering you, helping you to make decisions.
Rob" OK what does the "right hand " mean than?
Dave" You just said - Rob" Proof that the ... God is stronger than the opposing one.
Rob" Just because God is stronger than the creature, does not mean God dictates your free will to choose.
If you choose to rebel (break relationship) the fact God is stronger, does not help here. The relationship is broken and God can do nothing about this fact.
Dave" In simple terms -
The Right Hand - is the Hand of instruction and salvation
The Left Hand - is the hand of correction and mystery
Rob" Not what the material you posted says:
Right" is a synonym for "goodness" and "brightness," and "left" for "badness," "awkwardness," and "clumsiness.
My two pennies:-
The "right hand" is a person's active cognitive decison making world.
Either God or Satan stands at your right hand, actively empowering your decision making, giving your decisions their power.
Ge 48:18 The father was empowering the son using his right hand.
Ex 29:20 Aaron was active in the sacrifice process, the "right hand" symbolizes this active process of forgiveness.
Nu 22:26 Dave" Yep the path was blocked – can go to the right or left. Why is literal scripture a mystery to you?
Rob" So if the path is blocked, the active power of the right hand, is "opposing" the passage of the ass.
Not prosecuting the ass, nor accusing the ass, not being some adversary to the ass. The active "right hand" was opposing the ass.
De 5:32 Dave" Yep – stay on the straight and narrow path – don’t go to the right or left
Why is literal scripture a mystery to you?
Rob" Correct, do not transgress with an active right hand....
Jos 1:7 The right hand means do not be active with your powers of self, to trangress the laws of Moses
Job 23:8 Dave" The Left Hand - is the hand of correction and mystery
Rob" I could agree with you on the Left Hand.
The right hand is the active part of your decision making, where powers cannot be seen
Ps 16:8 Dave" The Right Hand - is the Hand of instruction and salvation
Rob" Hmm? not really. The human has on his right hand, the active powers of God who saves us.
Ps 26:10 Dave" quotes Adam Clark
Rob" The human's active cognitive entity that makes decisions, now allows much sinning to happen.
Ps 89:42
Rob" The human's active cognitive entity that makes decisions, now allows an adversary to be an agent for the human's sinning.
Ps 109:6 ¶ Set thou a wicked man over him: and let Satan stand at his right hand.
Dave" YEP – the Heavenly Prosecutor
Rob" typical, make the meaning different?
Rob" The human's active cognitive entity that makes decisions, now allows Satan as his agent for sinning.
In other words the active hand, is allowing Satan to empower his active mind wanting to sin.
Ps 110:1
Dave comments on salvation
Rob" The Father says to His Son, at the right hand of the Father, let me make your enemies become your footstool.
The active right hand, I am using is consistent as a meaning for all verses of context. This is not what Dave is doing.
Ps 138:7 The right hand is GOD's active nature. In this case His salvation.
Dave" In simple terms -
The Right Hand - is the Hand of instruction and salvation
The Left Hand - is the hand of correction and mystery
100% consistent with Jewish teaching
Rob" I do not agree Dave. sorry.
The "right hand" refers to the active nature of the human wanting power for something (from some power higher than the human).
or
The "right hand" refers to the active nature of GOD providing power for something
or
The "right hand" refers to the active nature of SATAN providing power for something
Dave" How does this prove your satan rebels, hates, or opposes God?
ROb" It shows two opposing powers,
the human's right hand has GOD or SATAN
God saves the human or Satan empowers the human
-----------------------
Ps 111:7 The works of his hands are verity and judgment; all his commandments are sure.
8 They stand fast for ever and ever, and are done in truth and uprightness.
The Hebrew words used here is emeth and aman, both related to amanuh, the word for faith.
The works of God's right hand are based on faith and they endure for ever and ever.
The work of the Opposer, at a human's right hand is empowering the human with self power, is not based on faith that endures for ever and ever.
This is a contrasting arrangement, mentioned in the torah for a reason. The word meaning of Opposer/oppose also is used for this reason.
------------------
Shalom