|
Post by Dave on Aug 2, 2022 22:55:19 GMT -5
D"He, then, the Father, wishing to reveal his wealth and his glory, brought about this great contest in this world, wishing to make the contestants appear,
So is Gnostic writings say the Father intentionally created false elohiym powers? to bring in a "great contest in this world, wishing to make the contestants appear" seems so from this writing?
YES - ABSOLUTELY CORRECT Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created—in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen, whether thrones or angelic powers or rulers or authorities. All was created through Him and for Him.
Christ – the image of God – All was created through Him and for Him.
Joh 1:3 All things were made through Him, and apart from Him nothing was made that has come into being.
D"since we have already known the Inscrutable One from whom we have come forth. Do you agree with this idea? YES – ABSOLUTELY CORRECT – Jer 1:5 God knew us / we knew God all before our biological conception
R" contestants, great contest, how is this not a Great Controversy and confirming my view? Word game on similar themes.
NOT EVEN CLOSE TO SIMULAR Contest – all God Plan – all God’s Will – all God’s design Controversy - -------------------------------------------------------------
2- REMEMBER THE QUESTION? Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world Nonsense R" OH so a SIN-BEARER for sins is not a part of Scripture, and the offering for our confessed sins, termed "chataah" is not what this Hebrew word means? Your answer has NOTHING to do with my question
The word in the in your verse = G266 - ἁμαρτία – hamartia - sin- offence, sin (-ful).
D"Heb 2:17 The High Priest must make an atonement – for the peoples SACRIFICES FOR SIN Nonsense R" Hmm? I think we are making big deal over themes? You are changing words with scripture to make it fit your doctrine
Question" Was Jesus meant to be a SIN-BEARER? y/n? Of Course – but it has NOTHING to do with my question
Hebrew word is "chatta'ah" The word in the in your verse = G266 - ἁμαρτία – hamartia - sin- offence, sin (-ful)
SO the chataah Jesus used was his own blood. Has nothing to do with your Rom 5:12 translation
Sadly the Greek spoils the harmony for the Hebrew. You deny the Greek and attempt to rewrite scripture to fit your own doctrine ----------------------------------
Is there a NT in Hebrew translation agreeing with this idea?
Rom 5:12 – (accordance) לְפִיכָךְ, כְּשֵׁם שֶׁעַל־יְדֵי אָדָם אֶחָד 1בָּא הַחֵטְא לָעוֹלָם, וְעֵקֶב הַחֵטְא 2בָּא הַמָּוֶת, כָּךְ עָבַר הַמָּוֶת לְכָל בְּנֵי אָדָם מִשּׁוּם שֶׁכֻּלָּם חָטְאוּ.
Rom 5:12 (OJB)לָכֵן כַּאֲשֶׁר עַל־יְדֵי אָדָם אֶחָד בָּא הַחֵטְא לָעוֹלָם וְהַמָּוֶת בְּעֵקֶב הַחֵטְא וְכֵן עָבַר הַמָּוֶת עַל־כָּל־בְּנֵי אָדָם מִפְּנֵי אֲשֶׁר כֻּלָּם חָטָאוּ:
-----------------------------------------------------
Show me where explicitly GOD commands a human to make other humans no longer live? D"Yet God commands Israel to perform genocide? R" Where is your Bible verse Dave for this idea?
PROOF you do know your scripture Jos 11:6 But Adonai said to Joshua, “Do not be afraid because of them, for tomorrow at this time I will give all of them slain before Israel. You are to hamstring their horses and burn their chariots with fire.” Jos 11:7 So Joshua and all the people of war with him attacked them suddenly at the waters of Merom and fell upon them. Jos 11:8 Then Adonai gave them into the hand of Israel, so they defeated them and chased them as far as Great Zidon and Misrephoth-maim, and up to the Valley of Mizpeh eastward. They struck them down until they left them no survivors. Jos 11:9 Joshua did to them as Adonai had instructed him—he hamstrung their horses and burnt their chariots with fire. Jos 11:10 At that time Joshua turned back and captured Hazor and struck its king with the sword, because Hazor had formerly been the head of all those kingdoms. Jos 11:11 They struck down every single soul in it with the edge of the sword, putting them to the ban. There was none left that breathed after he burned Hazor with fire. Jos 11:12 Thus Joshua captured all the cities of those kings and all their kings, and he struck them with the edge of the sword, putting them to the ban, just as Moses the servant of Adonai had commanded.
Putting them to the ban - have you any idea
Jos 11:11 and they smite every person who is in it by the mouth of the sword; he hath devoted—he hath not left any one breathing, and Hazor he hath burnt with fire; Jos 11:12 and all the cities of these kings, and all their kings, hath Joshua captured, and he smiteth them by the mouth of the sword; he devoted them, as Moses, servant of Jehovah, commanded.
devoting them - have you any idea
Exo 17:13 So Joshua overpowered the Amalekites and his army with the edge of the sword. Exo 17:14 Adonai said to Moses, “Write this for a memorial in the book, and rehearse it in the hearing of Joshua, for I will utterly blot out the memory of the Amalekites from under heaven.”
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2022 5:32:53 GMT -5
RP" So is Gnostic writings say the Father intentionally created false elohiym powers? to bring in a "great contest in this world, wishing to make the contestants appear" seems so from this writing?
D" YES - ABSOLUTELY CORRECT R" Are you sure you agree with me on this?
1) Father intentionally creates archon creatures with programmed ra and intelligence to tempt humans to follow their religion under a pretend elohiym power.
2) The archon are intentionally opposing man, tempting them to follow their marketed false religions to keep them sidetracked frokm following God. The archons cannot be opposing elohiym powers of the Father, because the Father created them as opposing elohiym powers to begin with.
3) "since we have already known the Inscrutable One from whom we have come forth" is known under various terms as the devil and satanas, the chief shad, or beast, who is an opposing elohiym power, opposing man, getting man to be sidetrack in the world.
D"NOT EVEN CLOSE TO SIMILAR Contest – all God Plan – all God’s Will – all God’s design Controversy -
R" Fair enough, because I have two elohiym powers, one came to become an elohiym power through sinning, the other true elohiym power is the Great Uncaused Cause G_D.
In your view, the Great Uncaused Cause G_D, intentionally creates the false opposing elohiym power, to oppose man and tempt man to sin, by following the creatures false religious views.
In your view, you cannot allow two opposing elohiym powers, because GOD made everything, including the false elohiym powers to tempt humans to sin. -------------------------------------------------------------------- I will come back later and comment on these views, but I want your opinions that I present your views correctly. --------------------------------------------------------------------
D"2- REMEMBER THE QUESTION? Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world Nonsense R" I see, you didn't like my replies? Didn't Adam make a sacrifice when he sinned?
Didn't the sacrifice point forward to Jesus dying for their sin-offerings?
Ge 3:21 ¶ Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.
Adam was required to kill the lamb and God made from the skin into clothing for both of them.
-------------------------------------------------------- D"PROOF you do know your scripture Jos 11:6 But Adonai said to Joshua, “Do not be afraid because of them, for tomorrow at this time I will give all of them slain before Israel. You are to hamstring their horses and burn their chariots with fire.” R" OK
Ex 34:9 And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.
This prayer Moses makes confirms that Israel were lukewarm as a nation...
Ex 34:10 ¶ And he said, Behold, I make a covenant: before all thy people I will do marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth, nor in any nation: and all the people among which thou art shall see the work of the LORD: for it is a terrible thing that I will do with thee.
Ex 34:11 Observe thou that which I command thee this day: behold, I drive out before thee the Amorite, and the Canaanite, and the Hittite, and the Perizzite, and the Hivite, and the Jebusite.
Jos 11:15 ¶ As the LORD commanded Moses his servant, so did Moses command Joshua, and so did Joshua; he left nothing undone of all that the LORD commanded Moses.
Why were these people to be killed utterly, and why does GOD ask humans to do the killing of these people?
Jos 11:20 For it was of the LORD to harden their hearts, that they should come against Israel in battle, that he might destroy them utterly, and that they might have no favour, but that he might destroy them, as the LORD commanded Moses.
All these nations were beyond saving, and thus not able to to redeemed, so they were to be destroyed utterly.
Jos 23:9 For the LORD hath driven out from before you great nations and strong: but as for , no man hath been able to stand before you unto this day.
Jos 23:15 Therefore it shall come to pass, that as all good things are come upon you, which the LORD your God promised you; so shall the LORD bring upon you all evil things, until he have destroyed you from off this good land which the LORD your God hath given you. 16 When ye have transgressed the covenant of the LORD your God, which he commanded you, and have gone and served other gods, and bowed yourselves to them; then shall the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and ye shall perish quickly from off the good land which he hath given unto you.
(KJV) Jos 24:12 And I sent the hornet before you, which drave them out from before you, even the two kings of the Amorites; but not with thy sword, nor with thy bow.
Jos 24:15 ¶ And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD."
16 And the people answered and said, God forbid that we should forsake the LORD, to serve other gods;
I agree GOD gave these people 400 years to seek God, but they refused, so does not God have a right to utterly wipe them out? Y/N?
God sent a hornet "tsir`ah" to drive out the wicked peoples.
Used three times. H6880 Jeff translates hornet The travelling active eye from the Divine Being Behold!
Who was this Divine Being as the hornet? Joshua was, a figure of Jesus the messenger for His Father.
Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 3, 2022 7:20:04 GMT -5
RP" So is Gnostic writings say the Father intentionally created false elohiym powers? to bring in a "great contest in this world, wishing to make the contestants appear" seems so from this writing? D" YES - ABSOLUTELY CORRECT
Col 1:16 – made by Him for Him John 1:3 - everything was made by Him
1) Father intentionally creates archon creatures with programmed ra and intelligence to tempt humans to follow their religion under a pretend elohiym power. YES – almost – if you would stop misrepresenting me and other – it would really help Father intentionally creates archon creatures with programmed (yester ra) their religion – the only religion the archon present is WORLD – treasures of this WORLD a pretend elohiym power. – YES THEY ARE NOT GOD – they are just arrogant and selfish
2) The archon are intentionally opposing man, tempting them to follow their marketed false religions to keep them sidetracked frokm following God. The archons cannot be opposing elohiym powers of the Father, because the Father created them as opposing elohiym powers to begin with. YES – the archon present WORLD – temp man with WORLD and things of this WORLD YES – man become involved with WORLD – focuses upon tangible WORLD – not intangible God
3) "since we have already known the Inscrutable One from whom we have come forth" is known under various terms as the devil and satanas, the chief shad, or beast, who is an opposing elohiym power, opposing man, getting man to be sidetrack in the world. You might call your god the devil or satanas – you are an Ellen White believer A Jew or Christian would never ever consider your statement Only you consider the Creator as satan
D"NOT EVEN CLOSE TO SIMILAR Contest – all God Plan – all God’s Will – all God’s design Controversy - R" Fair enough, because I have two elohiym powers Correct – you have two gods and two kings and you think that’s OK Dave has many false god - other gods - of all shapes and sizes - all of them archon - offspring of the Beast - none of them are in heaven facing off with God - they are all creatures of this WORLD
In your view, you cannot allow two opposing elohiym powers, because GOD made everything, including the false elohiym powers to tempt humans to sin. Col 1:16 – made by Him for Him John 1:3 - everything was made by Him Dave has many false god - other gods - of all shapes and sizes - all of them archon - offspring of the Beast - none of them are in heaven facing off with God - they are all creatures of this WORLD -------------------------------------------------------------------- D"2- REMEMBER THE QUESTION? Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world Nonsense R" I see, you didn't like my replies? Didn't Adam make a sacrifice when he sinned? NOT IN ROMANS 5:12 Why does Ellen White teach a sin is a sacrifice to the Lord Sin is an abomination to the Creator Sin is only a sacrifice to your satan god
-------------------------------------------------------- D"PROOF you do know your scripture Jos 11:6 - R" OK Why were these people to be killed utterly, and why does GOD ask humans to do the killing of these people? Because they are Rephiem – DUH YES – God ordered their death by the hand of man
I agree GOD gave these people 400 years to seek God, but they refused, so does not God have a right to utterly wipe them out? Y/N? The Chinese have had 5000 years to recognize YHWY – they are still here The Rephiem are offspring of the Nephilim
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2022 16:59:00 GMT -5
D"Dave has many false god - other gods - of all shapes and sizes - all of them archon - offspring of the Beast - none of them are in heaven facing off with God - they are all creatures of this WORLD R" OK, but they were once in heaven waring in heaven once, Rev 12 says so?
Involved Michael a prince, fighting against the archons, a Greek word for prince, so we have two princes or "young kings" fighting in heaven over religious rules or opposing each other.
How can you not agree to this idea?
And this same Michael the prince, fights again the same prince of the world for 21 days in Daniel 10? this time they are fighting on earth, invisibly, who cares , it's still a war on the earth?
How can you not agree to this idea?
DO you not understand these two princes are opposed to each other?
If Jesus the prince said about the prince of the world He has found nothing in me amiss, what will Jesus the prince find in the prince of the world? Plenty.
Jesus describes the prince of the world as a father of lies and a murderer.
The prince of the world is a sinning creature, and this is why the prince of heaven fights over the prince of earth.
The battle was once in heaven, now continues on earth.
But Dave denies the Bible texts.
The prince of heaven came to earth to JUDGE the prince of earth. JUDGE?
In Dave's view you cannot judge a creature doing programmed ra, approved already by GOD? so Dave's view is shot to pieces? Judge?
Judge what? Obviously the sinning prince on earth sins and finally must be stopped.
But Dave you deny this idea. ---------------------------------------
D"Why does Ellen White teach a sin is a sacrifice to the Lord Sin is an abomination to the Creator Sin is only a sacrifice to your satan god R" Brevity Dave, unpack your word salad, nobody understands?
D"The Chinese have had 5000 years to recognize YHWY – they are still here The Rephiem are offspring of the Nephilim R" The South America nations are not? too much sinning and God wiped them out, Chinese worshipped God for over 1000 years, until Satan took over...
D"The Rephiem are offspring of the Nephilim R" You make up stuff? Was not the whore of Jericho saved? She is not offspring of Nephilim?
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 3, 2022 22:12:47 GMT -5
D"Dave has many false god - other gods - of all shapes and sizes - all of them archon - offspring of the Beast - none of them are in heaven facing off with God - they are all creatures of this WORLD R" OK, but they were once in heaven waring in heaven once, Rev 12 says so? How can you not agree to this idea?
Sure – Rev 12:7 is scripture – the difference between us is one of equality Your satan is equal enough to stand toe to toe against God and His angels The Beast is a pathetic weak thing that was ejected from heaven – NO CONTEST ---------------------------------------
D"Why does Ellen White teach a sin is a sacrifice to the Lord Sin is an abomination to the Creator Sin is only a sacrifice to your satan god R" Brevity Dave, unpack your word salad, nobody understands?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2022 13:15:06 GMT -5
D"Sure – Rev 12:7 is scripture – the difference between us is one of equality Your satan is equal enough to stand toe to toe against God and His angels The Beast is a pathetic weak thing that was ejected from heaven – NO CONTEST R" No Dave you are trying to wiggle out of following the Hebrew torah which is your right, and follow only the Gnostic torah which is your right, a scripture of Jewish and Greek myths all rolled into one, we suspect written by Simeon Magnus, the fake believer of God mentioned in Acts.
The difference between both religions in major terms, is your Father intentionally created an opposing elohiym power to tempt humans to sin, using programmed creatures of yester ra only, and since these creatures have no free will, the Father approves of their actions on humans otherwise the Father would not have created them in the first place.
The only problem with this theory is it does not fit the Moses torah, not even close. It's totally different.
Moses torah says GOD wrote the ten commandments with his finger for Israel only because they forget the law in their heads, it was always made known to Adam, even before He chose to sin, but God gave an additional command to Adam so as to define the opposing elohiym power directly. (ie do not eat of His tree or His fruit, and Eve added nor even touch His fruit)
You go to great lengths to justify your Gnostic theory to say the created yester ra creature did not sin getting Eve to sin and Adam to sin, but I say he surely did, because for one thing, the creature only knows yester ra, and therefore is technically sinning all the time!!
The problem is in your defined views of Gnostic creative creatures, some can "sin" continuously, but its NOT a "sin" to these creatures because they have no "Free will".
One has to love the way Gnostic writings completely remove the love factor of the Father and reduced all the creatures the Father has made to robots, apparently humans are the only creatures with "Free will".
The second biggest problem with Gnostic views, the the word "judge".
God comes to "judge" that creature God created for some wrong doing?
How on in heaven or on earth, can a programmed robot creature of yester ra, be JUDGED for wrong doing, when the Father created the yester ra creature and therefore approves of its actions?
Unless of course the Father doesn't approve, than the creature would indeed be sinning, and therefore have free will to do sinning like humans do. But you cannot admit this idea, because than you would have to follow Ezekiel 28, the verse you ignore, as well as Rev 12, you also ignore, it was a war in heaven, but no real contest, so it wasn't a war at all, Scripture chose the wrong word. The fact that Jesus came to the "prince of the world" to cast "the prince of the world" OUT, tells me that your theory is bogus, and that the Father never approved of allowing this pretend opposing elohiym power tempt humans to sin after all.
Your Gnostic writings are false.
------------------------------------------------
D"Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SIN OFFERING – sin and death entered the world R" I have explained this over and over, don't you fathom my words.
When Adam sinned a lamb was slain for his sin, and God clothed the couple with that lamb.
While Scripture does not detail us with this idea directly, the suggestion is there.
For example where did Cain and Abel get olah offerings idea from? From dad...duh? and dad got the idea from a Sin-Bearer, the YHWH LORD called Jesus.
I quote"
To Adam, the offering of the first sacrifice was a most painful ceremony. His hand must be raised to take life, which only God could give. It was the first time he had ever witnessed death, and he knew that had he been obedient to God, there would have been no death of man or beast. As he slew the innocent victim, he trembled at the thought that his sin must shed the blood of the spotless Lamb of God. This scene gave him a deeper and more vivid sense of the greatness of his transgression, which nothing but the death of God's dear Son could expiate. And he marveled at the infinite goodness that would give such a ransom to save the guilty. A star of hope illumined the dark and terrible future and relieved it of its utter desolation. "Christ in His Sanctuary, p. 31.2 (Ellen Gould White)
So the sacrificial offering for sins existed in Scripture from the first sins of man, and Adam was taught this by the Sin-Bearer Himself, Jesus.
Even John said, "Behold the Lamb of ELohiym that takes away the sins of the world" Ge 22:7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?
Here the offering was intended to be "OLAH" this is a voluntary offering, as well as a offering for sins.
Joh 1:29 ¶ The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
Here is a translation of John in Greek, now which word is the Greek hamartia using, olah or chataah? We would have to use the LXX to make certain.
Just as the Hebrew word "adonay is translated kurios, and Baal is translated kurios, and YHWH is translated kurios, and even Adown is also translated kurios" , we lose so much in the Greek translations...
Isa 28:11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
No wonder the prophecy, the Hebrew goes out into a new stammering language, for Greek is a poor cousin of the Hebrew, and English is even worse.
Now if you wish to quibble over somethings here, please ask the questions specifically.... and don't forget to add your discussions.
Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 4, 2022 15:29:23 GMT -5
The difference between both religions in major terms, is your Father intentionally created an opposing elohiym power to tempt humans to sin, using programmed creatures of yester ra only, and since these creatures have no free will, the Father approves of their actions on humans otherwise the Father would not have created them in the first place. Agree up to the Father approves – Roberts assumption / injection to make it more wicked and evl sounding Agree – I am 100% a New Testament Christian - why do you deny the agl/NT?Gnostic Paul said - Col 1:14 In Him we have redemption—the release of sins. Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. Christ = God / Christ = the 3D Image of God = God in carnateCol 1:16 For by Him all things were created—in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen, whether thrones or angelic powers or rulers or authorities. All was created through Him and for Him. YES – all of it made by Him for Him YES – God’s Plan therefore God’s Will – because God is absolute sovereign NO – other creators NO – other creatures changing their own design and function – against God’s Will NO – other creature then altered God’s Plan in any way – against God’s Will I am 100% a New Testament Christian - why do you deny the agl/NT?Gnostic paul also says - Eph 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the worldly forces of this darkness, and against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. These very same creatures are our real struggle It is the BEAST – the sar / king / other god / of this world – in this world = archon The Beast come in many different forms and for many different reasons = archon Sometimes the archon is in physical form – sometime it is spiritual (unseen)REALITY OF THE ARCHON – made by HIM for HIMRev 12:9 … the great dragon … the ancient serpent, called the devil and satan, who deceives the whole world. He was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him. THE BEAST – the serpent race – we call them devils and satanas (Chaldean word not Hebrew word) The only problem with this theory is it does not fit the Moses torah, not even close. It's totally different.It is 100% consistent with Jewish demonology – Beelzebul and the shedim / Lilith / satyrs and other gods It is 100% consistent with Islamic demonology – Allah – Iblis – Jinn It is 100% consistent with every other serpent / snake religion – all other gods The only problem with this theory is it does not fit the Moses torah, not even close. It's totally different. The only doctrine it is at odds with = Roman Catholic Fallen AngelsMoses torah says GOD wrote the ten commandments with his finger for Israel only because they forget the law in their heads, it was always made known to Adam, even before He chose to sin, but God gave an additional command to Adam so as to define the opposing elohiym power directly. (ie do not eat of His tree or His fruit, and Eve added nor even touch His fruit) You go to great lengths to justify your Gnostic theory to say the created yester ra creature did not sin getting Eve to sin and Adam to sin, but I say he surely did, because for one thing, the creature only knows yester ra, and therefore is technically sinning all the time!! Blah blah blah – misrepresented – is that your only resonce – to continue to misrepresentYou refuse to grasp the 3000 year old basic Hebrew teaching of (yester ra) You don’t want to understand – so you can continue to argue against something you do not know ------------------------------------------------ D"Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SIN OFFERING – sin and death entered the world R" I have explained this over and over, don't you fathom my words. When Adam sinned a lamb was slain for his sin, and God clothed the couple with that lamb. AND WHY DID (your invented) SACRIFICE BRING SIN AND DEATH INTO THE WORLDWhile Scripture does not detail us with this idea directly, the suggestion is there. That a SIN OFFERING brought sin and death into the world as you have translated?Joh 1:29 ¶ The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. Here is a translation of John in Greek, now which word is the Greek hamartia using, olah or chataah? The answer is G266 - ἁμαρτία – hamartia – sin, offence, sin (-ful). Please ask the questions specifically.... and don't forget to add your discussions.1- why did your God of tov only - leave 99% of the globe to false ‘other gods’ Easy answer – And before anything came into being, it was the Father alone who existed, before the worlds that are in the heavens appeared, or the world that is on the earth, or principality, or authority, or the powers. [...] appear [...] and [...] And nothing came into being without his wish. He, then, the Father, wishing to reveal his wealth and his glory, brought about this great contest in this world, wishing to make the contestants appear, and make all those who contend leave behind the things that had come into being, and despise them with a lofty, incomprehensible knowledge, and flee to the one who exists. And (as for) those who contend with us, being adversaries who contend against us, we are to be victorious over their ignorance through our knowledge, since we have already known the Inscrutable One from whom we have come forth. We have nothing in this world, lest the authority of the world that has come into being should detain us in the world Easy answer – God’s Plan – always God’s Plan – because it is God’s creation and its God’s Will – because the One True God is ABSOLUTE SOVERIEGN 2- REMEMBER THE QUESTION? Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world Nonsense 5:12 because of one SIN (disobedience / transgression) – sin and death entered the worldHeb 2:17 The High Priest must make an atonement – for the peoples SACRIFICES FOR SIN NonsenseHeb 2:17 The High Priest must make an atonement – for the peoples SIN (disobedience / transgression) Heb 4:15 Jesus Christ is (G5565 – χωρίς - at a space, that is, separately or apart from (often as preposition): - beside, by itself, without.) a Sin Offering Heb 4:15 Jesus Christ is … without SIN (disobedience / transgression)Why won’t you explain your own Robert Method translation? Answer – because it is NONSENSE It is a corruption of scripture and therefore the message 3- D"Why do you teach it is a sin to obey God - and this question is 3 years old 20 hours ago robertt said: God cannot ask a human to kill another human. That would make GOD and the human doing the killing, both guilty of sin. Why do you deny scripture – I thought you teach the Tanak is the truth7 hours ago robertt said: you just make … the same questions you normally make.Still waiting for the same old answers
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2022 5:41:07 GMT -5
D"Blah blah blah – misrepresented – is that your only resonce – to continue to misrepresent You refuse to grasp the 3000 year old basic Hebrew teaching of (yester ra) You don’t want to understand – so you can continue to argue against something you do not know R" Why is this discussion so bad to you? If yester ra is the inclination to do evil, than surely programmed creatures without free will, are quite capable of doing ra, is this not what the Father intended these creatures to be?
I have not misrepresented you at all? If so explain.
And doing yester ra, is technically sinning is it not, though for these creatures, it is not moral sin, because they have no free will anyway, so their sins or RA is not held accountable to them.
BUT if this is true, why does Jesus come to judge them for doing things wrong and finally throw them into the Lake of Fire? This tells me there is something wrong with your Gnostic theory.
This is the third time I have asked this question, and you have no answer.
--------------------------------------------------- D" AND WHY DID (your invented) SACRIFICE BRING SIN AND DEATH INTO THE WORLD R" Explained this before.....
Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
but happy to add more details...
Question: When Eve, partnered to the HS (as all humans are to GOD via the HS) sinned, did not a mischief maker do mischief to the womb of both the human and therefore the functional perfection of the HS who also functions with a compassion-centre?
And it the mischief maker did mischief, the penalty for mischief, as all children are born though a womb is "life for life".
You must die, and the mischief maker must die. Your biology is spoiled and thus with RA. This is why a spoiled human who repents cannot return to GOD because the biology is spoiled and RA cannot exist in heaven. (I define RA as a fruit if SINNING, opposing your Gnostic view of RA as purely natural in origin, arising from matter)
The only remedy for this is, for Divinity to lay down His life for our life, and than judge the mischief maker for causing the mischief with his life.
Hence why sinners confessing their sins, unto the Sin-Bearer comes with a death sentence, the judgement for mischief is life for life, and the Saviour out of love, lays down His life for His friends.
D"That a SIN OFFERING brought sin and death into the world as you have translated? R" Not the sin-offering per se, but what the confessed sins unto the sin-offering represents, our Sin-Bearer bearing our confessed sins, and lifting away our guilt.
Do you understand what this verse is saying?
Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
One application of the judgement refers to the unborn baby dying before it was born, the mischief maker has to die for the death of the unborn baby. Such crimes as punching the unborn baby with your fist into the woman's belly.
OK what about mischief done to the function of the womb so that future babies are born dyfunctional? One example of this mischief is corrupting the DNA code so that the code is permanently changed and thus with RA.
What is the penalty for this kind of mischief? What the judgement says, your life for causing the RA in the unborn babies inside Eve, yet to be made by future generations.
Both examples show that mischief done to the womb of Eve is very serious indeed and caused a death penalty for all humans born under a human womb.
My two pennies, hope it makes sense. -----------------------------
D"Still waiting for the same old answers R" What questions are you asking? Your copy and paste is confusing to me....sorry....
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 5, 2022 8:43:19 GMT -5
I have not misrepresented you at all? If so explain. R" Why is this discussion so bad to you? If yester ra is the inclination to do evil, Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply is evil?Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply + subdue, conquer, and have dominion is evil?And doing yester ra, is technically sinning is it not, Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply is sinning?Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply + subdue, conquer, and have dominion is sinning?Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply is sinning and evil?Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply + subdue, conquer, and have dominion is sinning and evil?You have a sick perverted view of creation - God commanded all creatures to be sin and evil--------------------------------------------------- D" AND WHY DID (your invented) SACRIFICE BRING SIN AND DEATH INTO THE WORLD R" Explained this before..... Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, but happy to add more details... D"That a SIN OFFERING brought sin and death into the world as you have translated? R" Not the sin-offering per se, R" Not the sin-offering per se,ABSOLUTELY CORRECT – your Robert method translation is error and conveys the wrong Christian teaching! ----------------------------- robertt said: you just make … the same questions you normally make.D"Still waiting for the same old answers R" What questions are you asking? Your copy and paste is confusing to me....sorry....D"I have answered all your questions twice over why don’t you answer questions? R" Write a few questions than Dave, I will do our best. 1- why did your God of tov only - leave 99% of the globe to false ‘other gods’2- REMEMBER THE QUESTION?Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world YOU finally gave an answer for this question – I won’t ask it anymoreR" Not the sin-offering per se,ABSOLUTELY CORRECT – your Robert method translation is error and conveys the wrong Christian teaching!3- Why is it a sin to obey God? And to remove any confusion – I’ll repeat the same old questions over – without copy and paste1- why did your God of tov only - leave 99% of the globe to false ‘other gods’? 3- Why is it a sin to obey God?You have a complete Ellen White SDA theology that has all the answers – and address the totality of scripture – these are simple questions – why do you refuse to answer robertt said: you just make … the same questions you normally make.Why is it a sin to obey God? It is a simple question – doesn’t Ellen White and the SDA have an answer?Your God is love and mercy and compassion and LOVES only why did your God of tov only - leave 99% of the globe to false ‘other gods’?It is a simple question – doesn’t Ellen White and the SDA have an answer? And now I will ask Why do you deny the promise of eternal life?1Jn 5:13 I wrote these things to you who believe in the name of Ben-Elohim, so you may know that you have eternal life.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2022 16:52:18 GMT -5
D"Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply is evil? Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply + subdue, conquer, and have dominion is evil? R" I have never posted these ideas? God wanted his creatures to fill the earth and gave them DNA abilities to micro change the genotypes for this filling of earth, but all the animals do this without RA or SIN, both of these terms are the same thing to me Dave in my view, RA is just the fruit of some sinning in the past.
In your view you see RA as a natural consequence of matter. So I ask you why didn't GOD create matter without inherent RA in it? Surely God can create matter with different parameters?
Than nothing would contain RA, nothing would be sinful?
So my question to you is, why didn't the Father create a perfect world, when in fact the Father can create a perfect world? In your view your Father creates a flawed world. Why is that ?
Please answer the question? It's clear in the next Creation the world is restored perfect again, restored the Greek word suggests "kainos" Rev 21:1, NOT "neos", so if our world is restored, it much have been perfect the first time, but you do not consider this idea?
Why is that?
D"You have a sick perverted view of creation - God commanded all creatures to be sin and evil R" NOT SO, all creatures especially the higher intelligent ones have talking abilities, love and loving abilities and free will to praise God, however any sinning these animals do TODAY is not accounted in them as moral sins, unlike humans. Our sins are held accountable and thus our sins are considered moral sins.
So no, all the creatures were once sinless, as Adam was. Why did the animals become more RA like over time? God cursed creation, that is why. Over time the creatures experienced mistakes in the DNA and these led to RA problems in the animals behaviour.
I do not support your words at all. You shock me to think I posted them, when I did not. Now is my words here clear to you? --------------------------------------------
D"REMEMBER THE QUESTION?Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world
Heb 2:17 The High Priest must make an atonement – for the peoples SACRIFICES FOR SIN R" I see, please post again where I said these words you quote? "Rom 5:12 because of one man’s SACRIFICE FOR SIN – sin and death entered the world" Did I actually say this or are you reading my context poorly?
If you don't understand somebody Dave, you ask questions? no mock. Why don't you ask questions and write discussions so I understand what your thinking is?
I used to be a teacher. When students ask questions it means they are thinking. When there questions include parts of a teachers discussions, it means the student is really thinking very well. But if students do not ask questions, it means they are dead, and the teaching is going over their head. Hope this helps why I am the way I view things. I am also a science person so I think deeply and outside of the box.
RP" R" Not the sin-offering per se, D" ABSOLUTELY CORRECT – your Robert method translation is error and conveys the wrong Christian teaching! R" Oh, so what is the correct Christian teaching Dave, now I am asking about your view, since you claim to now know my view.
Please tell us your view, and be sure to include lots of Bible verses with discussions.
D"1- why did your God of tov only - leave 99% of the globe to false ‘other gods’? R" Who said GOD did? Dave thinks this?
God has had champions of faith all over the world from all times past. Including head hunters from various tribal groups. I wrote about this already? What further questions do you have?
How much salvation does one need in order to be saved Dave? according to your view?
In my view, it's simple
Ro 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness,
This applies to head hunter tribes too.
D"3- Why is it a sin to obey God? R" Been in this before. It is not a sin to obey God, but God does not ask you to disregard His own laws.
I gave you examples of this before.
So what is your problem, and unless you write a discussion your posts are confusing.
D"Why do you deny the promise of eternal life? R" Where did you get the impression I deny this?
Again write your discussion and quote me and my words?
SHalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 6, 2022 3:03:48 GMT -5
D"Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply is evil? Why do you teach the commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply + subdue, conquer, and have dominion is evil? R" I have never posted these ideas? D" misrepresented – is that your only resonce – to continue to misrepresent You refuse to grasp the 3000 year old basic Hebrew teaching of (yester ra) You don’t want to understand – so you can continue to argue against something you do not knowR" Why is this discussion so bad to you? If yester ra is the inclination to do evilThe commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply = (yester ra) self-preservation and the desire to reproduce The commandment to go forth be fruitful and multiply + subdue, conquer, and have dominion = (yester ra) self-preservation and the desire to reproduce + to grow and achieve / progress / build R" Why is this discussion so bad to you? If yester ra is the inclination to do evilYou refuse to grasp the 3000 year old basic Hebrew teaching of (yester ra) You don’t want to understand – so you can continue to argue against something you do not know In your view you see RA as a natural consequence of matter. So I ask you why didn't GOD create matter without inherent RA in it? God must obey by His own laws – your ruleEntropy = the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics Science cannot deny God – only validate God – Rom 1:19 + Psa 19:2 Surely God can create matter with different parameters?Agreed The First Age – Heaven – spiritual reality Judaism says – a lot happened during this Age Gnosticism says – a lot happened during this age Second Age – Earth – and with it came darkness / chaos + The Light – tov and ra God separated darkness from the Light – the tov from the ra God said it was GOOD God’s Plan – God’s Will – God is Sovereign – God is Absolute Gen 1:1 + Gen 1:2 + Gen 1:3 +Gen 1:4 Gen 1:1 – God created the HEAVENS …Rev 12:1 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. Rev 12:2 She is pregnant—crying out in birth pains, in agony to give birth. Gen 1:1… earth – is created in agony – birth painsRev 12:3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: a great fiery red dragon that had seven heads and ten horns, and seven royal crowns on his heads. Because it is corruptible – limited – an illusion – not the real reality – just a small 3D physical part of the whole Because it is corruptible = ENTROPY
Ra because is a movement away from the Thorne into 3D dust/fleshGen 1:2 Now the earth was chaos and waste, darkness was on the surface of the deep, Rev 12:5 And she gave birth to a son, a male child, who is to rule all the nations with an iron rod. And her child was snatched away to God and to His throne. Gen 1:3 Then God said, “Let there be light!” and there was light. Gen 1:4 God saw that the light was good. So God distinguished the light from the darkness. Rev 12:6 Then the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God so they might take care of her for 1,260 days. Surely God can create matter with different parameters?Agreed T he Third Age – AdamBegan tov – ended in ra - RESET – Flood of Noah – rule change The Next Age – Noah to Babble Began tov – ended in ra - RESET – rule change The Next Age – Abraham - RESET – rule change The Next Age – Jesus Christ – the Age of the Gentile - RESET – rule change The Next Age - end times – rapture – 2nd Coming - RESET – rule change Surely God can create matter with different parameters?Agreed Each Age = an Dispensation = an Anion – a period of time You cannot use future time to validate the past But the future can repeat the past Ecc 1:9 What has been is what will be, and what has been done will be done again. There is nothing new under the sun. Ecc 1:10 Is there anything about which is said, “Look! This is new!”? It was already here long ago, in the ages long before us. Ecc 1:11 There is no remembrance for former things, and things yet to come will not be remembered by those who follow. So I ask you why didn't GOD create matter without inherent RA in it? Surely God can create matter with different parameters?Agreed ANSWER - Heaven = tov – Gen 1:1 there was once and Age of tov You were there – I was there – we all were there – the host of heaven Deep inside we know (yester tov) – we have just forgotten (yester ra) That Age is not this AgeRev 21 – another realm of tov is promised That Age is not this AgeEcc 3:1 For everything there is a season and a time for every activity under heaven: Ecc 3:2 a time to give birth and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot what is planted; Ecc 3:3 a time to kill and a time to heal, a time to tear down and a time to build up; Ecc 3:4 a time to weep and a time to laugh, a time to mourn and a time to dance; Ecc 3:5 a time to scatter stones and a time to gather stones, a time to embrace and a time to refrain from embracing; Ecc 3:6 a time to seek and a time to lose, a time to keep and a time to discard; Ecc 3:7 a time to tear apart and a time to mend, a time to be silent and a time to speak; Ecc 3:8 a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace. So my question to you is, why didn't the Father create a perfect world, when in fact the Father can create a perfect world? In your view your Father creates a flawed world. Why is that ? I DO NOT SEE THIS WORLD AS FLAWED as in ra or evil or wicked in anywayA rock is just a rock – A cow is just a cow – an ant is just an ant And God said it was tov However – THIS WORLD is also home to – the BEAST and his army / offspring / demons / archon Once Eve drug her husband Adam into THIS WORLD – without the Tree of Life Man must deal with the Knowledge of Good and Evil Gen 3 – the Contest – established by God Please answer the question? It's clear in the next Creation the world is restored perfect again, restored the Greek word suggests "kainos" Rev 21:1, NOT "neos", so if our world is restored, it much have been perfect the first time, but you do not consider this idea? Why is that?If you read above – you know I will say a return to the First Age – Gen 1:1 God created HEAVEN … FYIChabad.org – Eden = the 3rd Heaven Eve stepped down into this WORLD a LOWER WORLD dimensionally Jew teach – the return of Eden Jews teach the RESTORATION of the man back to his original form If you are a Sadducee – Talmudic Jew - No spirit – this is Adam in the Garden If you are a Pharisee – Kabbalistic Jew – spirit – this is a return to HEAVEN -------------------------------------------- RP" R" Not the sin-offering per se, D" ABSOLUTELY CORRECT – your Robert method translation is error and conveys the wrong Christian teaching! R" Oh, so what is the correct Christian teaching Dave, now I am asking about your view, since you claim to now know my view. Please tell us your view, and be sure to include lots of Bible verses with discussions. Only need one verse – the verse we are discussingRom 5:12 So then, just as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, in the same way death spread to all men because all sinned. --------------------- D"1- why did your God of tov only - leave 99% of the globe to false ‘other gods’? R" Who said GOD did? Dave thinks this? Is all the world Jewish Was the Torah given to all the World
In my view, it's simple Ro 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, This applies to head hunter tribes too. You evade the question – why did God leave head hunter tribes on earth
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2022 16:27:44 GMT -5
Greetings Dave RP" Surely God can create matter with different parameters?D" Agreed The First Age – Heaven – spiritual reality Judaism says – a lot happened during this Age Gnosticism says – a lot happened during this age
Second Age – Earth – and with it came darkness / chaos + The Light – tov and ra God separated darkness from the Light – the tov from the ra God said it was GOOD God’s Plan – God’s Will – God is Sovereign – God is Absolute Gen 1:1 + Gen 1:2 + Gen 1:3 +Gen 1:4
R" SO you do have two distinct creations coming from GOD, for humans? D" Gen 1:1 – God created the HEAVENS … Rev 12:1 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. Rev 12:2 She is pregnant—crying out in birth pains, in agony to give birth. Gen 1:1… earth – is created in agony – birth painsR" I found this "------------------------------------------------------------- aleteia.org/2018/11/01/a-jewish-perspective-on-the-queen-of-all-these-saints-were-celebrating/A Jewish perspective on the queen of all these saints we’re celebrating If we look at Mary through ancient Jewish eyes, we understand why she's Catholics' favorite intercessor. On November 1, Christians worldwide are celebrating All Saints Day.
For Catholics, the Virgin Mary is considered the greatest of all saints. Many even refer to Mary as “the Queen of Heaven.” Though Mary lived 2,000 years ago, millions honor her and ask for her prayers daily.
Why do Catholics do this? Why make so much of Mary? After all, wasn’t she just an ordinary Jewish woman?
That’s what lots of people today believe. But as I show in my book, Jesus and the Jewish Roots of Mary, that’s not what the Bible says.
If you want to love Mary more, find her in the Old Testament (this book will guide you)
Don’t get me wrong. It’s true that the Old Testament says the “queen of heaven” was the name of a pagan goddess.Some ancient Israelites even committed idolatry by offering sacrifice to her—and got quite a tongue-lashing from the prophet Jeremiah as a result! (See Jeremiah 7:17-18.)
So why do Catholics call Mary the “Queen of Heaven”? Isn’t that idolatry too?
No. Because the Catholic Church did not get its beliefs about Mary from paganism. It got them from Judaism.
In order to see this clearly, you have to look at Mary through ancient Jewish eyes.
You have to look at Mary in light of what the Old Testament says about the Jewish Queen.
In ancient Israel, the king did not rule alone. There was also a queen. However, the queen was not the king’s wife, but his mother. She was known as the “Queen Mother”—in Hebrew, the gebirah.
To get an idea of just how important the Queen Mother was, consider what the Bible says about Bathsheba, the wife of King David and mother of King Solomon.
When Bathsheba comes into David’s presence, she bows to him as her king (1 Kings 1:15-16). But after David dies and Solomon her son becomes king, the tables are turned. Now, when Bathsheba comes into Solomon’s presence, he bows to her (1 Kings 2:19)! The king himself honors his mother because she is queen.
But it doesn’t stop there. King Solomon also has a “throne” brought in, so that his mother can sit at his “right” hand (1 Kings 2:19). Everyone knew what this meant. The Queen Mother was the most powerful person in the kingdom—second only to the king himself.
That’s why when the Queen Mother asks a favor of Solomon, he answers: “Make your request, my mother, for I will not refuse you” (1 Kings 2:20).
What does all this mean for who Mary was, and how Christians see her today?
First, if Jesus really was the long-awaited Jewish King—the Messiah—then his mother was the Jewish Queen.
That’s what it would have meant to a Jewish girl like Mary when the angel Gabriel told her that her son would “sit on the throne of his father David” (Luke 1:33). As mother of the new King, Mary would be the new Queen Mother.
It’s also why the book of Revelation describes the mother of the Messiah as a woman “in heaven” wearing “a crown of twelve stars” (Revelation 12:1-2). The crown shows she is a queen, and the twelve stars symbolize the people of Israel.
QUEENSHIP OF MARY
Second, if Mary is the new Queen Mother, then it makes sense to honor her. After all, “Honor your father and your mother” is one of the Ten Commandments (Exodus 20:12).
It isn’t idolatry to honor the queen. If the queens of earthly kingdoms are honored and loved by their people, then how much more the Queen Mother of the Kingdom of God?
Finally, if Mary is the Queen Mother of Jesus’ Kingdom, then she is certainly no ordinary woman. She is, quite literally, the most powerful woman in the universe. She is the true Queen of Heaven.
And Mary is still alive in heaven. (After all, we call it “eternal life”—not death.). As Queen Mother, Mary sits at Jesus’ right hand. And, like King Solomon, Jesus will not refuse her requests.
That’s why, since ancient times, Christians have asked Mary to pray for them. Consider the words of the most ancient Christian prayer to Mary we possess, written in Greek and discovered in the early 20th century on a scrap of papyrus:
“Under your mercy, we take refuge, O Mother of God. Do not disregard our prayers in time of trouble, but deliver us from danger, O only pure one, only blessed one.” (Anonymous Christian Prayer, 3rd-4th century)
One of the prayers Pope Francis asked for this month is the most ancient Marian prayer
Nowadays, we certainly live in troubling times. Dangers are everywhere, threatening the whole human race.
If Jesus really is the King he claimed to be, and Mary really is the Queen Mother, then it makes sense to ask her to intercede with her Son for us and for a world in need.
After all, she is the most powerful woman in the universe. "R" suggests to me the woman is Mary giving birth to Jesus, ( a Jewish view) not a reference to a creation of earth as you claim? However it is confusing all these different ideas? ----------------------- RP" So my question to you is, why didn't the Father create a perfect world, when in fact the Father can create a perfect world? In your view your Father creates a flawed world. Why is that ?D" I DO NOT SEE THIS WORLD AS FLAWED as in ra or evil or wicked in anyway A rock is just a rock – A cow is just a cow – an ant is just an ant And God said it was tovR" According to Gnostic view, it is flawed....came with ra according to your view? In my view, I have no flawed world, our world came perfect, without RA and later on after Adam sinned, RA came into our world, but our world was originally perfect. Your GNostic views is totally different. ------------------------------ D" Only need one verse – the verse we are discussing
Rom 5:12 So then, just as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, in the same way death spread to all men because all sinned.R" SO you support the idea that the spark inside your RA body comes born into the world SINNING already? How is that possible? D" Is all the world Jewish Was the Torah given to all the WorldR" No need, for other folds I will bring into my fold, Jesus said. Why did the Babel confound languages, and make folds? To slow the spread of RA and thus SIN. Jews have their own version of corrupted ways, mystic views, etc etc. D" You evade the question – why did God leave head hunter tribes on earthR" He didn't, some tribes were saved, those that listened, many were lost, they didn't listen. As missionaries we have come across Sabbath keeping tribes.... fancy that? D" Then what is this 10 Commandment crap that God must obeyR" All of His own laws and rules.... even including cooking in cattle dung, not human dung. God asked a prophet to cook in human dung but the prophet refused.... So God must have been testing the prophet. God has to obey all his laws, every yud and stroke. D" Why do you deny scripture – I thought you teach the Tanak is the truthR" You find difficult things in the Tanak for sure Dave, I agree, and as a child I do not have all the answers. So some mysteries are best left alone. You can ask God questions when you get to heaven yourself. D" Your Feel Good God of tov – kills – orders the killing – your feel good God orders genocide “…for I will utterly blot out the memory of the Amalekites from under heaven.”R" There is in GOD a level of kindness, it allowed the Amalekites 400 years to repent, but 99% of them refused, so doesn't God have the right to wipe them out? The method of wiping them out is strange, yes. Getting humans to kill other humans, rather than using a fire from heaven. You find difficult things in the Tanak for sure Dave, I agree, and as a child I do not have all the answers. So some mysteries are best left alone. You can ask God questions when you get to heaven yourself. Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 7, 2022 12:54:41 GMT -5
R" SO you do have two distinct creations coming from GOD, for humans? Spirit + Flesh = Gen 2:7 "--------------------------
aleteia.org/2018/11/01/a-jewish-perspective-on-the-queen-of-all-these-saints-were-celebrating/ R" suggests to me the woman is Mary giving birth to Jesus, ( a Jewish view) not a reference to a creation of earth as you claim? However it is confusing all these different ideas? Why do you turn to the Catholics for validation? The idea that Catholic Mary is the womb of creation is blasphemy -----------------------
RP"So my question to you is, why didn't the Father create a perfect world, when in fact the Father can create a perfect world? In your view your Father creates a flawed world. Why is that ? D" I DO NOT SEE THIS WORLD AS FLAWED as in ra or evil or wicked in anyway A rock is just a rock – A cow is just a cow – an ant is just an ant And God said it was tov R" According to Gnostic view, it is flawed....came with ra according to your view? Entropy is NOT evil – it is balance You teach – to slow down to avoid running over a child in the street is evil – when it is just entropy
In my view, I have no flawed world, our world came perfect, without RA and later on after Adam sinned, RA came into our world, but our world was originally perfect. Sorry Robert Gen 1:2 + Rev 12:3 all predate Adam ------------------------------
D"Only need one verse – the verse we are discussing Rom 5:12 So then, just as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, in the same way death spread to all men because all sinned. R" SO you support the idea that the spark inside your RA body comes born into the world SINNING already? How is that possible? Why is twisted misrepresentation your only argument? Flesh comes inherently with (yester ra) – YES – (yester ra) leads to SIN
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, (yester ra) and that it was pleasant to the eyes, (yester ra) and a tree to be desired to make one wise, (yester ra) she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, (SIN – disobedience / transgression)
Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, (yester ra) Robert - saw a bananna and it was good for food - is this evil? NO it is just (yester ra) self-preservation Robert saw it was pleasant to the eyes, - is this evil? NO it is just (yester ra) self-preservation and a tree to be desired to make one healthy - is this evil? NO it is just (yester ra) self-preservation Robert took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, Is there a commadment againt it? NO - It is NOT a SIN - is this evil? NO it is just (yester ra) self-preservation -------------------
D"Is all the world Jewish Was the Torah given to all the World R" No need, for other folds I will bring into my fold, Jesus said. Exactly Correct – God chose the 1% to witness to the 99% This is my question to you – why was the 99% left in ignorance and susceptible to the ‘other gods’ of the archon
Your God is love and mercy and everything nice – does no harm – loves everyone wants to save everyone This is my question to you – why was the 99% left in ignorance and susceptible to the ‘other gods’ of the archon Please answer
Why did the Babel confound languages, and make folds? To slow the spread of RA and thus SIN. Jews have their own version of corrupted ways, mystic views, etc etc. Your God is love and mercy and everything nice – does no harm – love everyone wants to save everyone This is my question to you – why did God add this layer of confusion?
You are a parent – God is our Father Gen 11:5 And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded. Gen 11:6 And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do. What a statement – proud of my achieving child – my child will go far - confidence
Gen 11:7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech. Gen 11:8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city. Your God is love and mercy and everything nice – does no harm – love everyone wants to save everyone This is my question to you – why did God add this layer of confusion?
D"Why do you deny scripture – I thought you teach the Tanak is the truth R" You find difficult things in the Tanak for sure Dave, I agree, and as a child I do not have all the answers. So some mysteries are best left alone. You can ask God questions when you get to heaven yourself. BULL SHIT – you teach / preach conflicting doctrines – and when you are caught – you pretend ignorance The only doctrine here that has no answers = yours = Ellen White’s
You find difficult things in the Tanak for sure Dave, I agree, and as a child I do not have all the answers. So some mysteries are best left alone. You can ask God questions when you get to heaven yourself. BULL SHIT – you teach / preach conflicting doctrines – and when you are caught – you pretend ignorance The only doctrine here that has no answers = yours = Ellen White’s
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2022 17:30:54 GMT -5
D"Why do you turn to the Catholics for validation? R" I didn't, I was intrigued by the Jewish presentation of the Queen is in fact the King's Mother.
See Solomon for example.
D"Entropy is NOT evil – it is balance You teach – to slow down to avoid running over a child in the street is evil – when it is just entropy R" Yes correct, but if you study RA in scripture, no natural contexts of RA exist, only fruits of sinning examples exist.
Show me your view than, with a Bible verse?
D"Why is twisted misrepresentation your only argument? Flesh comes inherently with (yester ra) – YES – (yester ra) leads to SIN R" So the spark is with a TOV only mind, robotic since it has no free will to choose.... Than comes into the body with it's biological yester RA mind, it has waited a thousand years to enter into, as a fetus, before the baby is born, the mind has already chosen to think yester ra thoughts, so the baby is born sinning already? Is this your view?
D"It is NOT a SIN - is this evil? NO it is just (yester ra) self-preservation R" OK why did Eve require a yester ra creature to get her to do yester ra when her own mind should have gotten her to eat of the tree all by herself?
Explain the need for the creature...
Explain the need for being aram, when Eve already has yester ra harassing the spark tov mind?
DO you agree with this idea? Eve already has yester ra harassing the spark tov mind? In my view, such an idea is totally wrong.
Your theory really makes no sense Dave, so try to explain away...
Explain the need for the aram creature... I see no need...
Explain the need for deceiving the woman? Surely the yester ra mind loves to explore new things, cats have curiosity, so why didn't Eve eat the fruit based on her own yester ra mind out of curiosity?
D"why was the 99% left in ignorance R" not left in ignorance? Why do you insist the Jewish way is the only way? Don't all humans have a conscience?
Is not the HS already speaking to all humans?
That is a 100% witness.
D"left in ignorance and susceptible to the ‘other gods’ of the archon R" Why have these when we already have yester ra in us?
D"This is my question to you – why did God add this layer of confusion? R" To slow down the influence of Satan. He now has to speak RA to different groups of humans in their language.
D"you teach / preach conflicting doctrines – and when you are caught – you pretend ignorance R" If my presentation is false, speak against it, but I rarely seeing your discussion's and you rarely quote Hebrew opposing my Scripture, you are confused with another layer of confusions, Gnostic, and you ask me why God add this layer of confusion? God didn't, Satan did.
But you have no free will creature who sins freely do you?
You ignore the Ezekiel 28 verses don't you? -------------------------------------------
Lu 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
Knowing some mysteries depends upon your level of being inside God's revelations . SHalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 7, 2022 21:48:57 GMT -5
D"Why do you turn to the Catholics for validation? R" I didn't, I was intrigued by the Jewish presentation of the Queen is in fact the King's Mother. Dear Robert – I know you are making a jest – I just forgot to laugh and giggleOtherwise – if you were seriouse – then you are a complete idiot This is a Catholic presentation from a catholic web-site promoting their Mary as the womb of creation And using ahl examples to prove it You just read what you want to hear -------------- D"Entropy is NOT evil – it is balance You teach – to slow down to avoid running over a child in the street is evil – when it is just entropy R" Yes correct, but if you study RA in scripture, no natural contexts of RA exist, only fruits of sinning examples exist. The only way your statement holds any weight – is if 1- IF we disregard – without form and void + chaos 2- IF we believe that mother earth magically popped into existence complete and whole 3- NOT consistent with Gen 1 4- NOT consistent with Rom 1:19 + Psa 19:2 5- NOT consistent with common sense | |
A lot of natural RA went into the formation of mother earth and all physical creation You can call it stellar cosmology – you can call it the Big Bang – a lot of it requires violent and catastrophic events – all of it natural – a by-product / inherent to physical creation It is NOT evil – it is NOT wicked – It is balance within nature = Intelligent Design = Rom 1:19 + Psa 19:2 D"It is NOT a SIN - is this evil? NO it is just (yester ra) self-preservation R" OK why did Eve require a yester ra creature to get her to do yester ra when her own mind should have gotten her to eat of the tree all by herself? Explain the need for the creature... All the serpent did was talk – talk – talk - pest - pest - bother Explain the need for being aram, when Eve already has yester ra harassing the spark tov mind?Physical entropy = a natural process of matter Spiritual entropy = arrogance = self-centered – thinking you are alone praise of self NOT God the Creator The BEAST was the first sentient – the first biological thinker – and it thought only of self The BEAST was just the first thinker to choose world / creation – over the Creator Why – because he was created with some matter (yester ra) Cows – ants – monkeys - cave man – all (yester ra) The only choice of (yester ra) = world Human beings= Gen 2:7 (animal with yester ra) + (spirit yester tov) Man is the creature that can choose World (yester ra) or God (yester tov)--------------- DO you agree with this idea? Eve already has yester ra harassing the spark tov mind? In my view, such an idea is totally wrong. Only because you refuse the 3000 year old Jewish teaching of (yester ra) Of course Eve had (yester ra) – and used it often when she was hungry – or bathed – or combed her hair – or made a bed to sleep on – DUH Only one of her choice was disobedience / a transgression of a CommandmentExplain the need for the aram creature... I see no need... It is just world – and the desires of this world Explain the need for deceiving the woman? Deu 8:2 … in order to humble you, to test you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His mitzvot or not. Fact – God test His people ---------------- D"why was the 99% left in ignorance R" not left in ignorance? Why do you insist the Jewish way is the only way? Don't all humans have a conscience? Correct – all human being are (yester tov)+(yester ra)Is not the HS already speaking to all humans? That is a 100% witness. So you are teaching that all pagan gods are YHWY and all pagans have the correct Torah How very NOT Judeo-Christian of youD"left in ignorance and susceptible to the ‘other gods’ of the archon R" Why have these when we already have yester ra in us? Correct – that is the question I am asking you – good that you got it correctly D"why was the 99% left in ignorance and susceptible to the other gods Isn’t your God the God of tov only – only love for everyone – does no harmD"Is all the world Jewish Was the Torah given to all the World R" No need, for other folds I will bring into my fold, Jesus said. Exactly Correct – God chose the 1% to witness to the 99%This is my question to you – why was the 99% left in ignorance and susceptible to the ‘other gods’ of the archonYour God is love and mercy and everything nice – does no harm – loves everyone wants to save everyone This is my question to you – why was the 99% left in ignorance and susceptible to the ‘other gods’ of the archonPlease answerD"This is my question to you – why did God add this layer of confusion? R" To slow down the influence of Satan. He now has to speak RA to different groups of humans in their language.Gen 1:28 God blessed them and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, fill the land, and conquer it. Rule over the fish of the sea, the flying creatures of the sky, and over every animal that crawls on the land.” + Gen 11:6 Adonai said, “Look, the people are one and all of them have the same language. So this is what they have begun to do. Now, nothing they plan to do will be impossible. = the influence of Satan - PLEASE EXPLAINYou give the praise to the wrong godYou ignore the Ezekiel 28 verses don't you?Ezk 28 is all about man – all about EvePrecept upon precept, line upon line – your view is not supported by scripture You keep saying your satan opposes the Creator – Yet –in every verse – your satan was in service to the Lord helping to facilitate God’s Will on earth So the opponent is only an opponent to Job, in Job's story? Fair enough So where would you go looking to see if "opponent" actually "opposes" GOD? Line upon line, here and there, remember, how to read Scripture? And your answer isAt least we have discovered the value of line by line – it doesn’t matter if it goes against Catholic doctrine------------------------------------------- Lu 8:10 - Knowing some mysteries depends upon your level of being inside God's revelations . Question" Are we supposed to KNOW all the answers in the tanak Dave? Y?N?Does this mean when you know you are contradictory – you don’t question or correct yourself
|
|