Post by Dave on Oct 8, 2023 1:18:34 GMT -5
James Daniel Tabor is a Biblical scholar and Professor of Ancient Judaism and Early Christianity in the Department of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte, where he has taught since 1989 and served as Chair from 2004–14. Wikipedia
Today – he is also seen as he go to guy for the Dead Sea Scrolls
Do he and I agree – not 100% - but pretty close
As an academic – he just presents the material pro and con
Even he admits = he does not support some ideas – and support other ides only partially
How and When Did Satan Become the God of this World?
James Tabor – 42 min
00:30 – all the way through God is the creator of the world
Now satan is the god of this world
So how did this shift happen – THE GREATEST SHIFT in human thought the history of the world
What happened – When did it happen
1:50 – there are cosmic rulers of the world
2:15 – They (archon) thought they could get rid of Jesus by killing him
BUT ACTUALLY – GOD USED THEM as part of God’s Plan
Dave - I like it - Agree
3:00 – satan has fallen to the earth
Yep – Rev 12:7 – throw down from above – war in heavenly
Human like figures – with wings – can appear / dissappear
3:55 – angels = messengers – any kind of messengers
Usually appear as humans (Gen 6 hybrids come to mind)
5:00 – 3 Books
Elaine Pagal
Michael Heiser – pretty literal – homest textual analysis
Phillip Almond
Finally a line by line honest review of all the verses about satan
The project Robert refused to complete
Mar 1:13 He was in the wilderness forty days, being tempted by satan. And He was with the wild beasts, and the angels were taking care of Him.
Tabor – satan tempted Jesus
Dave – Agree – Jesus was a man just like you and me and fair game to satan
But the sprite within / the inner man = Christ who is God incarnate
Who said – it is written – now repeated - cannot tempt God – so go away
Proof that Jesus was 100% flesh (yester ra) + 100% Christ the image of God (yester tov)
Flesh (yester ra) + Spirit (yester tov)
00:740 - Mar 3:23 He called them and began speaking to them in parables: “How can satan drive out satan?
Mar 3:24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand.
Mar 3:25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house will not be able to stand.
Mar 3:26 And if satan has risen up against himself and is divided, he cannot stand but his end has come.
Mar 3:27 “But no one can enter a strong man’s house to ransack his property, unless he first ties up the strong man. Then he will thoroughly plunder his house.
Tabor – God is not ruling this world - satan is the ruler of this world
Jesus is bringing on the Kingdom of God – overthrowing satan’s authority
The strong man is ruling this world – but has no power over Christ – the image of God
Dave – Agree – God made the world exactly as He Planned – then let it go
Animals – are BEAST ruled by (yester ra) self-preservation ans survival of the species
The archon are BEAST ruled by (yester ra)
Man is stuck in the middle – because we are the creatures that can choose
Man = (yester ra) flesh + (yester tov) spirit
08:40 - Mar 4:15 These are the ones beside the road where the word is sown. Whenever they hear, satan comes quickly and takes away the word that has been sown in them.
Tabor – satan can steal good information away
Dave – 99.99999% Darwin more reasonable – easier to accept – than the just believe it Creationist – whose pseudo-science even drive more educated away
08:50 - Luk 4:13 And when the devil had completed every test, he departed from Him until another occasion.
Tabor – Jesus whacked satan down – but satan is strategic - will wait for another opportunity
Dave – Agree – the world is always on 24/7
09:24 - Luk 10:17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, “Master, even the demons submit to us in Your name!”
Tabor - demons are associated with sickness / illness
by casting out demons – satan’s kingdom is beginning top crumble
Dave – I understand what he is saying and building up to – Jesus has the power over this world and the demons
BUT
Exorcism in the Old Testament: A Closer Look at ...
www.timothytomlinson.org › single-post › exorcis...
One of the most famous examples of exorcism in the Old Testament is the story of King Saul and the demon-possessed man in the book of 1 Samuel.
Tabor - satan fell from heaven like lightening
Originally a reference to Gen 1:2 – but now also the fall of satan’s kingdom here on earth
The sacking of satan’s kingdom by Christ – the world view
Dave – agree – the world
11:00 – Mar 7:26 The woman was a Greek, from Syrophoenicia. And she kept begging Yeshua to drive the demon out of her daughter.
Mar 1:26 And the unclean spirit, after throwing the man into convulsions and crying out with a loud voice, came out of him.
Luk 11:20 But if by the finger of God I drive out demons, then the kingdom of God has come to you.
Tabor - one thing you can say about Jesus = a healer + exorcist
The kingdom of God is not waiting to come – it already arrived with Christ
Let your will be done on earth as in heaven
It is a sign that the beginning of the end has begun
Dave – agree – Tabor speaks the truth - and we can say a whole lot more
12:20 - Luk 13:16 So this one, a daughter of Abraham incapacitated by satan for eighteen years, shouldn’t she be set free from this imprisonment on Yom Shabbat?”
Tabor - Hemorrhaging = a medical condition / sickness / illness
Dave - Remember - 9:24 - Luk 10:17
Tabor - demons are associated with sickness / illness
by casting out demons – satan’s kingdom is beginning top crumble
12:25 Mat 13:39 The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are angels.
Tabor – When the Gospel is preached the enemy can sow weeds (doubt)
Dave - Yep – the more error the church is found guilty of – the farther away from the church people associate themselves
12:40 - Luk 22:3 Then satan entered into Judah, the one from Kriot, one of the twelve.
Tabor – Jesus chose the 12 – including Judas
Judas = the devil – satan came into Judas
Was Judas always a devil – or did he change at the last super
Dave – this is the same story as 16:10 - Act 5:3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has satan filled your heart to lie to the Ruach ha-Kodesh and keep back part of the proceeds of the land?
Tabor – Ananias + money / mammon – troes to GREEDly hold back some of the money = satan filling your heart
Dave – yep – the archon fuel / feed your wants and desires (yester ra)
This is the same story as 12:40 - Luk 22:3 Then satan entered into Judah,,for 30 oieces of silver
Wealthy man asked a poor waitress – sex for 1 million dollars
At first – the poor waitress wanted to slap the wealthy man
BUT – 30 pieces of silver = WOW
She could get out of debt – the kids could go to college – her mom could have that operation
SO – she reluctantly – agrees
Wealthy man says great – lets go right now for $20
The poor waitress respond – hey! - what do you think I am?
Wealthy man says – we just decided that – now we are arguing over the price
13:10 - Joh 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world! Now the prince of this world will be driven out!
Joh 14:30 “I will not talk with you much longer, for the ruler of this world is coming. He has nothing on Me.
Joh 16:11 and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged.
Tabor – 13:52 – the powers of the world are being overthrown – and behind these powers are evil forces – visible and invisible
Dave – Yep – Eph 6:12 powers / archon – our real struggle
14:10 - Luk 22:31 “Simon, Simon! Indeed, satan has demanded to sift you all like wheat.
Luk 22:32 But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith will not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.”
Tabor – Peter is trying to protect Jesus Christ from the Cross – Peter is on the wrong side of the plan of salvation
Peter doesn’t understand that it is the Cross and the Resurrection is God’s Plan
Dave – correct – peter crime here = ignorance
NOT satanic possession
15:10 - Joh 8:44 You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks lies he is just being himself—for he is a liar and the father of lies.
Tabor - Man has the same nature as the devil
Dave – yep – both beast / flesh – both (yester ra)
Tabor – Predestination – it has been a big debate
Dead Sea scrolls = Enoch – reincarnationist
You can quote scripture on both sides - so he wont pick a side
Dave – I will pick a side
You can quote scripture on both sides because both are true
Reincarnation is not for everyone – but does exist for some
16:00 - Joh 10:20 Many of them were saying, “He has a demon. He’s insane! Why listen to Him?”
Tabor – notice how demons and possess ion = mental health issues (crazy)
Dave - agree
16:10 - Act 5:3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has satan filled your heart to lie to the Ruach ha-Kodesh and keep back part of the proceeds of the land?
Tabor – Ananias + money / mammon – troes to GREEDly hold back some of the money = satan filling your heart
Dave – yep – the archon fuel / feed your wants and desires (yester ra)
16:30 - Act 13:10 and said, “O you, full of all deceit and trickery, son of the devil, enemy of all righteousness—will you not stop making crooked the straight paths of the Lord?
Tabor – Simon son of the devil – satan can fill your heart -
Dave – yep – the archon fuel / feed your wants and desires (yester ra)
16:45 - Act 26:18 to open their eyes—so they may turn from darkness to light and from the power of satan to God, that they may receive release from sins as well as a place among those who are made holy through trusting in Me.’
Tabor – The Gospel of Paul – open their eyes from DARKNESS – to see the LIGHT – then they get to escape the power of satan – and are forgiven
Turning from the power of sin – so sin doesn’t rule them
Dave –
Gen 1:1 – Rev 12:1-2 = creation
Gen 1:2 – Rev 12:3-4 – the BEAST / Darkness / ignorance
Gen 1:3 – Rev 12:5 – the LIGHT – truth of God
Gen 1:4 – rev 12:7 – God separated the two
Turning from the darkness / ignorance of God – to- The LIGHT / Christ – the truth of God
WOW – no wonder Robert accuses Paul of being a Gnostic
17:19 - 2Co 4:4 In their case, the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, so they might not see the light of the Good News of the glory of Messiah, who is the image of God.
Tabor - God has blinded the understanding of the unbeliever – God did it
It is the hand of God
Then he says – satan is able to blind them
People who don’t get it – can't really see it (Robert)
BUT – God is opening their minds - an awakening
Another reference to predestination
and those who are call receive a reward in heaven
Dave – Agree - God is opening their minds - an awakening
Catholics call it a secrete knowledge The chose just call it the truth
Yes – some are chosen to be who they are – so God’s Will unfolds as written
Not everyone – but a select few
Yes – rewards or Punishment – to each man his proportional due
18:50 - Rom 16:20 Now the God of shalom will soon crush satan under your feet. May the grace of our Lord Yeshua be with you.
Tabor – a reference to Gen 3:15 – doon
Dave – Agree
19:12 - 1Co 5:5 you are to turn such a fellow over to satan for the destruction of his fleshly nature, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Yeshua.
Tabor – sexual immorality – delivered over to satan but can still repent and be saved
We have victory over satan because we are NOT ignorant (in darkness) abut the Reality of the Archon – satanas – The BEAST
satan can take advantage of a weakness
Even tho we are post Jesus – Paul still applies the Law of Moses
1Co 7:4 The wife does not have the rights to her own body, but the husband. Likewise also the husband does not have the rights to his own body, but the wife.
Tabor - Married couple are not to refuse sex to one another – because without it – humans will cheat- physically or mentally
satan is waiting for a crack – an opening – to attack you (by feeding that desire)
Dave – Agree – within reasons and fairness
1Co 7:9 and if they have not continence—let them marry, for it is better to marry than to burn;
Mat 5:28 but I—I say to you, that every one who is looking on a woman to desire her, did already commit adultery with her in his heart.
Dave – Agree - satan is waiting for a crack – the world is on 24/7
21:12 - Col 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision done not by hand, in the stripping away of the body of the flesh through the circumcision of Messiah.
Col 2:14 He wiped out the handwritten record of debts with the decrees against us, which was hostile to us. He took it away by nailing it to the cross.
Tabor – satan disguises himself as an angel of LIGHT
Dave – “DECEPTION” – it is what the archon do – deceive the whole world
21:35 - 2Co 12:7 even in the extraordinary quality of the revelations. So that I would not exalt myself, a thorn in the flesh was given to me—a a messenger of satan to torment me, so I would not exalt myself.
Tabor – Paul has all these visions and revelations – BUT – to keep him from being too elated about it – a messenger of satan harassed him
Dave – Yep – Hebrew satan in the NT G4566 – a remnder from the prosecutor / accuser to be good
23:00 - Eph 6:11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you are able to stand against the schemes of the devil.
Tabor – the wiles of the devil
Dave – Gen 3:1 the most subtal (arum)
23:08 - 1Th 2:18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.
Tabor – the world gets in the way – things come up – the WORLD VIEW of the NT
Dave – Yep - the WORLD – Gen 3:14-20 man vrs world + man vrs archon
23:55 - 2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
Tabor – The anti-Christ will do ‘pretended’ signs – tricks – fool the people
God sends the delusion to some that the delusion is real – if you are not on the side of LIGHT you can be take nover
Dave - Agree – not real miracles of creation – just tricks
God sends the delusion – hardening of the heart – God did it!
Just as God hardened Pharaoh's heart – God did it
Just as God sent some aside – God does it
Just as God predestines (chooses) some – God does it
Why – to facilitate God’s Will upon the earth
24:25 - 1Ti 5:15 For some are already turned aside after Satan.
24:28 - 2Ti 2:26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
Tabor – this is getting scary isn’t it
Dave – the archon sidetrack you – get your focus off of God and the HS
Work – career – fame – fortune – name – all SELF-ish
You can spend your life as an amazing scientist – and deny God - Darwin
OR – through history you have the repeating cycle of
Rape – pillage – plunder – and murder to force groups of men under the rule of one alpha male (yester ra) – until the next alpha male comes along
OR – through history you have the repeating cycle of
Business men making money out the front door – while polluting the planet – oppressing the labor force – slavery – creating a debt dependency out the back door
Dave – if satan came out and said follow me – the enemy would be obvious
Tabor – it is scary
Dave – agree – but rephrase
Not as much scary as OVERWHELMING – th attack come from so many angels we are confused at times what is fake news
This is why knowledge of the archon is important – so you recognize them in our world and the messaging of the world
Eph – 6:13-20
24:35 - Heb 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
Tabor – Christ destroys the one who has the power of death - the devil
Dave – NOT that the archon can kill you – but by keeping you in this world leads to death
24:40 - Jas 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
1Pe 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
Tabor – This is literally your satan the devil
Always prowling around looking for prey
Dave – Yep our satan – Eph 6L12 the archon - of the world that is open 24/7
25:07 - 1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Tabor – works of the devil = the devils long term plans
Dave – David Ike – Just outside out field of view – are entities that are anything but human – that have been manipulating this world from the outside for eons – some call them demonic – some call them the serpent race – islam calls them the Jinn
Dave – the first centuries and authors of the Gospels called them archon
Eph 6:12 – our real struggle- principalities / archon and the invisible powers behind them
Col 1:16 - principalities / archon and the invisible powers behind them – created by God for God
Dave - David Ike – why would a human participate in a conspiracy that will take 100s of years to unfold
Answer – it is not about the humans – they are pawns used by these outside powers – they are the ones that will see the conspiracy through
Jud 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
Tabor – Jude is saying – if you have to fight – Call on the Lord
Dave - Rom 12:19 Never take your own revenge, loved ones, but give room for God’s wrath—for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine; I will repay,” says Adonai.
26:05 - Rev 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
Tabor – The synagogue of satan – trust in the world
Dave – Yep – choosing world over God
Rev 2:10 Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, so that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation for ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
Tabor - Rev 2:10 – G5438 – φυλακή - phulakē (pergamon in latin) - purgatory
From G5442; a guarding or (concretely guard), the act, the parson; figuratively the place, the condition, or (specifically) the time (as a division of day or night), literally or figuratively: - cage, hold, (im-) prison (-ment), ward, watch.
Purgatory – a place of Proportional Punishment
Dave - I’m good with it – no criticism - agree
26:20 - Rev 2:24 “But to the rest of you in Thyatira, who do not hold to this teaching and have not learned the so-called ‘deep things’ of satan—I place on you no other burden.
Tabor – the teachings of the Nicolaitans
Dave – (google) What were the Nicolaitans teaching?
They lead lives of unrestrained indulgence. The character of these men is very plainly pointed out in the Apocalypse of John, [when they are represented] as teaching that it is a matter of indifference to practice adultery, and to eat things sacrificed to idols.
26:25 - Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was thrown down—the ancient serpent, called the devil and satan, who deceives the whole world. He was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
Tabor – The BEAST begins in heaven – but is thrown down to earth – and knows his fate
Dave – Yep – ejected from heaven into physical creation – Entropy
Know his own fate – Entropy will wind down to nothingness
27:09 - Rev 20:2 He seized the dragon—the ancient serpent, who is the devil and satan—and bound him for a thousand years.
Rev 20:10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are too, and they shall be tortured day and night forever and ever.
Tabor – 27:40 – there are all kinds of operations going on behind the scenes – in this world view
Dave – Yes – the archon are a multi-pronged attack – they have their hands into everything worldly
--------------------------------------------
27:50 – Hebrew Cosmology
Sheol is NOT HELL – everyone is their good and bad waiting – [waiting resurrection (introduced into Judaism 160 BC Book of Macabees – just before Christ)]
Dave – yes – Hades is NOT HELL - everyone is their good and bad waiting
Yes – Resurrection is a Jewish teaching – in the end – “returned / restored” to the body of Adam and Eden
28:57 – Hebrew satan is like heavens lawyer for the prosecution
29:09 – He makes a connection between the prosecutor and Job
29:03 – God is in total control
-----------------------------------------------
29:50 – as you move into the Hellenistic world
00:30 – all the way through the OT God is the creator of the world
Now satan is the god of this world
So how did this shift happen – THE GREATEST SHIFT in human thought the history of the world
New Cosmology 300BC - 1500AD
10 heavens – God on top – man lower on earth – hades below earth in 3 locations – the Isle of the Blessed – Tartarus – and those waiting
31:30 – earth is a dark place and man is made to be here – not heaven
31:50- here is death outside of Eden
Dave – Yes – the world is a hard place Gen 3:14-24 – God did it
Yes – outside of Eden – in a different location – death was going on
Yes – Gen 3 – Adam and Eve did not change anything – except location
From Eden where there is no death to the WORLD where death exist
32:05 – Humans learning of good and evil = humans growing to maturity
Children do not know good vrs evil - YET
Humans learning of good and evil = man coming of age
Dave – I like it - Eze 28:15 You were perfect in your ways from the day that you were created, until unrighteousness was found in you.
Did God know man would grow and learn as he matured
Dave – Yes – all God’s Plan – all God’s Will
Robert - Nope – not supposed to happen – it would mean God made a mistake
Dave – I have owned good dogs – yet lay a steak down in front of him – tell him ‘don’t eat it or I’ll be mad’ - and walk away
What is going to happen?
Maybe 5 mins – OK good boy
But go away for a few hours and that steak is lunch
Am I predicting the future? - No – just human (dog) nature (yester ra)
32:45 – man is on earth – down here / lower world – surrounded by these other forces
32:55 – a Gnostic reference – this is not our home – just passing threw
33:18 – by the time of Planitus - 3rd century AD this is the world view
33:50 – he presents my teaching
10 heavens / dimensions – 7 heaven / dimensions above – 3= 3 here – physical reality
The archon have agents on all 7 heavens
Gnostic the Beast appeared then created for himself 7 the 12 – that made the 72
Yes – there is a correlation
satan rule in the dimensions above us – NO
Gnostic the archon are trapped close to earth – the first layer just above us
So – as man look “up” to God in the high heaven – we have to look through the archon – they get in our way
Hades below – 3 compartments
The Isle of the Blessed – the Bosom of Abraham – First fruits – near the throne – Rev 20:4
Tatarus – a sulfer pit of fire and brimstone – the abyss – the pit
and those waiting – purgatory / prison – Proportional Punishment
33:58 – THE MOST SIGNIFICANT FIND FROM ANCIENT HISTORY
The artifact that changed our world
We know when it happened -
The earliest record 300AD – gold foil from tombs of early Christians
34:45 – the idea of reincarnation over and over up the food chain until man has a chance for a spiritual awakening – very Hindu – new age
36:45 – journey of the soul – enter Hades – but is met by “The guardians of below” – who ask who are you and where are you
THIS IS SALVATION – if you know who you are and where you belong
Where are you – in dearest darkest death – but it is NOT my home
You express a knowledge (Gnostic) an understanding of our real origin
“We are children of God and heaven is our real home”
If you know who you are – they (the guardians) will allow you to ascend into heaven
Dave – Heb 9:27 – death then judgment
Are you saved (Divine Pardon) or NOT
Saved allowed to ascend into heaven – First Fruits Reb 20:4
If NOT – Proportional Punishment to await the First Resurrection Rev 20:5
Christian / Catholics – St Peter standing at the pearly gates
-------------------------------------
In all of this comprehensive review of biblical satan
Zero mention of Exk 28 or Isa 14
OR – the idea that satan rebels, hates, and opposes God
Or – the idea of two equal gods locked in a cosmic struggle over God’s right to rule the universe
Today – he is also seen as he go to guy for the Dead Sea Scrolls
Do he and I agree – not 100% - but pretty close
As an academic – he just presents the material pro and con
Even he admits = he does not support some ideas – and support other ides only partially
How and When Did Satan Become the God of this World?
James Tabor – 42 min
00:30 – all the way through God is the creator of the world
Now satan is the god of this world
So how did this shift happen – THE GREATEST SHIFT in human thought the history of the world
What happened – When did it happen
1:50 – there are cosmic rulers of the world
2:15 – They (archon) thought they could get rid of Jesus by killing him
BUT ACTUALLY – GOD USED THEM as part of God’s Plan
Dave - I like it - Agree
3:00 – satan has fallen to the earth
Yep – Rev 12:7 – throw down from above – war in heavenly
Human like figures – with wings – can appear / dissappear
3:55 – angels = messengers – any kind of messengers
Usually appear as humans (Gen 6 hybrids come to mind)
5:00 – 3 Books
Elaine Pagal
Michael Heiser – pretty literal – homest textual analysis
Phillip Almond
Finally a line by line honest review of all the verses about satan
The project Robert refused to complete
Mar 1:13 He was in the wilderness forty days, being tempted by satan. And He was with the wild beasts, and the angels were taking care of Him.
Tabor – satan tempted Jesus
Dave – Agree – Jesus was a man just like you and me and fair game to satan
But the sprite within / the inner man = Christ who is God incarnate
Who said – it is written – now repeated - cannot tempt God – so go away
Proof that Jesus was 100% flesh (yester ra) + 100% Christ the image of God (yester tov)
Flesh (yester ra) + Spirit (yester tov)
00:740 - Mar 3:23 He called them and began speaking to them in parables: “How can satan drive out satan?
Mar 3:24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand.
Mar 3:25 And if a house is divided against itself, that house will not be able to stand.
Mar 3:26 And if satan has risen up against himself and is divided, he cannot stand but his end has come.
Mar 3:27 “But no one can enter a strong man’s house to ransack his property, unless he first ties up the strong man. Then he will thoroughly plunder his house.
Tabor – God is not ruling this world - satan is the ruler of this world
Jesus is bringing on the Kingdom of God – overthrowing satan’s authority
The strong man is ruling this world – but has no power over Christ – the image of God
Dave – Agree – God made the world exactly as He Planned – then let it go
Animals – are BEAST ruled by (yester ra) self-preservation ans survival of the species
The archon are BEAST ruled by (yester ra)
Man is stuck in the middle – because we are the creatures that can choose
Man = (yester ra) flesh + (yester tov) spirit
08:40 - Mar 4:15 These are the ones beside the road where the word is sown. Whenever they hear, satan comes quickly and takes away the word that has been sown in them.
Tabor – satan can steal good information away
Dave – 99.99999% Darwin more reasonable – easier to accept – than the just believe it Creationist – whose pseudo-science even drive more educated away
08:50 - Luk 4:13 And when the devil had completed every test, he departed from Him until another occasion.
Tabor – Jesus whacked satan down – but satan is strategic - will wait for another opportunity
Dave – Agree – the world is always on 24/7
09:24 - Luk 10:17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, “Master, even the demons submit to us in Your name!”
Tabor - demons are associated with sickness / illness
by casting out demons – satan’s kingdom is beginning top crumble
Dave – I understand what he is saying and building up to – Jesus has the power over this world and the demons
BUT
Exorcism in the Old Testament: A Closer Look at ...
www.timothytomlinson.org › single-post › exorcis...
One of the most famous examples of exorcism in the Old Testament is the story of King Saul and the demon-possessed man in the book of 1 Samuel.
Tabor - satan fell from heaven like lightening
Originally a reference to Gen 1:2 – but now also the fall of satan’s kingdom here on earth
The sacking of satan’s kingdom by Christ – the world view
Dave – agree – the world
11:00 – Mar 7:26 The woman was a Greek, from Syrophoenicia. And she kept begging Yeshua to drive the demon out of her daughter.
Mar 1:26 And the unclean spirit, after throwing the man into convulsions and crying out with a loud voice, came out of him.
Luk 11:20 But if by the finger of God I drive out demons, then the kingdom of God has come to you.
Tabor - one thing you can say about Jesus = a healer + exorcist
The kingdom of God is not waiting to come – it already arrived with Christ
Let your will be done on earth as in heaven
It is a sign that the beginning of the end has begun
Dave – agree – Tabor speaks the truth - and we can say a whole lot more
12:20 - Luk 13:16 So this one, a daughter of Abraham incapacitated by satan for eighteen years, shouldn’t she be set free from this imprisonment on Yom Shabbat?”
Tabor - Hemorrhaging = a medical condition / sickness / illness
Dave - Remember - 9:24 - Luk 10:17
Tabor - demons are associated with sickness / illness
by casting out demons – satan’s kingdom is beginning top crumble
12:25 Mat 13:39 The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are angels.
Tabor – When the Gospel is preached the enemy can sow weeds (doubt)
Dave - Yep – the more error the church is found guilty of – the farther away from the church people associate themselves
12:40 - Luk 22:3 Then satan entered into Judah, the one from Kriot, one of the twelve.
Tabor – Jesus chose the 12 – including Judas
Judas = the devil – satan came into Judas
Was Judas always a devil – or did he change at the last super
Dave – this is the same story as 16:10 - Act 5:3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has satan filled your heart to lie to the Ruach ha-Kodesh and keep back part of the proceeds of the land?
Tabor – Ananias + money / mammon – troes to GREEDly hold back some of the money = satan filling your heart
Dave – yep – the archon fuel / feed your wants and desires (yester ra)
This is the same story as 12:40 - Luk 22:3 Then satan entered into Judah,,for 30 oieces of silver
Wealthy man asked a poor waitress – sex for 1 million dollars
At first – the poor waitress wanted to slap the wealthy man
BUT – 30 pieces of silver = WOW
She could get out of debt – the kids could go to college – her mom could have that operation
SO – she reluctantly – agrees
Wealthy man says great – lets go right now for $20
The poor waitress respond – hey! - what do you think I am?
Wealthy man says – we just decided that – now we are arguing over the price
13:10 - Joh 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world! Now the prince of this world will be driven out!
Joh 14:30 “I will not talk with you much longer, for the ruler of this world is coming. He has nothing on Me.
Joh 16:11 and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged.
Tabor – 13:52 – the powers of the world are being overthrown – and behind these powers are evil forces – visible and invisible
Dave – Yep – Eph 6:12 powers / archon – our real struggle
14:10 - Luk 22:31 “Simon, Simon! Indeed, satan has demanded to sift you all like wheat.
Luk 22:32 But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith will not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.”
Tabor – Peter is trying to protect Jesus Christ from the Cross – Peter is on the wrong side of the plan of salvation
Peter doesn’t understand that it is the Cross and the Resurrection is God’s Plan
Dave – correct – peter crime here = ignorance
NOT satanic possession
15:10 - Joh 8:44 You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks lies he is just being himself—for he is a liar and the father of lies.
Tabor - Man has the same nature as the devil
Dave – yep – both beast / flesh – both (yester ra)
Tabor – Predestination – it has been a big debate
Dead Sea scrolls = Enoch – reincarnationist
You can quote scripture on both sides - so he wont pick a side
Dave – I will pick a side
You can quote scripture on both sides because both are true
Reincarnation is not for everyone – but does exist for some
16:00 - Joh 10:20 Many of them were saying, “He has a demon. He’s insane! Why listen to Him?”
Tabor – notice how demons and possess ion = mental health issues (crazy)
Dave - agree
16:10 - Act 5:3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has satan filled your heart to lie to the Ruach ha-Kodesh and keep back part of the proceeds of the land?
Tabor – Ananias + money / mammon – troes to GREEDly hold back some of the money = satan filling your heart
Dave – yep – the archon fuel / feed your wants and desires (yester ra)
16:30 - Act 13:10 and said, “O you, full of all deceit and trickery, son of the devil, enemy of all righteousness—will you not stop making crooked the straight paths of the Lord?
Tabor – Simon son of the devil – satan can fill your heart -
Dave – yep – the archon fuel / feed your wants and desires (yester ra)
16:45 - Act 26:18 to open their eyes—so they may turn from darkness to light and from the power of satan to God, that they may receive release from sins as well as a place among those who are made holy through trusting in Me.’
Tabor – The Gospel of Paul – open their eyes from DARKNESS – to see the LIGHT – then they get to escape the power of satan – and are forgiven
Turning from the power of sin – so sin doesn’t rule them
Dave –
Gen 1:1 – Rev 12:1-2 = creation
Gen 1:2 – Rev 12:3-4 – the BEAST / Darkness / ignorance
Gen 1:3 – Rev 12:5 – the LIGHT – truth of God
Gen 1:4 – rev 12:7 – God separated the two
Turning from the darkness / ignorance of God – to- The LIGHT / Christ – the truth of God
WOW – no wonder Robert accuses Paul of being a Gnostic
17:19 - 2Co 4:4 In their case, the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, so they might not see the light of the Good News of the glory of Messiah, who is the image of God.
Tabor - God has blinded the understanding of the unbeliever – God did it
It is the hand of God
Then he says – satan is able to blind them
People who don’t get it – can't really see it (Robert)
BUT – God is opening their minds - an awakening
Another reference to predestination
and those who are call receive a reward in heaven
Dave – Agree - God is opening their minds - an awakening
Catholics call it a secrete knowledge The chose just call it the truth
Yes – some are chosen to be who they are – so God’s Will unfolds as written
Not everyone – but a select few
Yes – rewards or Punishment – to each man his proportional due
18:50 - Rom 16:20 Now the God of shalom will soon crush satan under your feet. May the grace of our Lord Yeshua be with you.
Tabor – a reference to Gen 3:15 – doon
Dave – Agree
19:12 - 1Co 5:5 you are to turn such a fellow over to satan for the destruction of his fleshly nature, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Yeshua.
Tabor – sexual immorality – delivered over to satan but can still repent and be saved
We have victory over satan because we are NOT ignorant (in darkness) abut the Reality of the Archon – satanas – The BEAST
satan can take advantage of a weakness
Even tho we are post Jesus – Paul still applies the Law of Moses
1Co 7:4 The wife does not have the rights to her own body, but the husband. Likewise also the husband does not have the rights to his own body, but the wife.
Tabor - Married couple are not to refuse sex to one another – because without it – humans will cheat- physically or mentally
satan is waiting for a crack – an opening – to attack you (by feeding that desire)
Dave – Agree – within reasons and fairness
1Co 7:9 and if they have not continence—let them marry, for it is better to marry than to burn;
Mat 5:28 but I—I say to you, that every one who is looking on a woman to desire her, did already commit adultery with her in his heart.
Dave – Agree - satan is waiting for a crack – the world is on 24/7
21:12 - Col 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision done not by hand, in the stripping away of the body of the flesh through the circumcision of Messiah.
Col 2:14 He wiped out the handwritten record of debts with the decrees against us, which was hostile to us. He took it away by nailing it to the cross.
Tabor – satan disguises himself as an angel of LIGHT
Dave – “DECEPTION” – it is what the archon do – deceive the whole world
21:35 - 2Co 12:7 even in the extraordinary quality of the revelations. So that I would not exalt myself, a thorn in the flesh was given to me—a a messenger of satan to torment me, so I would not exalt myself.
Tabor – Paul has all these visions and revelations – BUT – to keep him from being too elated about it – a messenger of satan harassed him
Dave – Yep – Hebrew satan in the NT G4566 – a remnder from the prosecutor / accuser to be good
23:00 - Eph 6:11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you are able to stand against the schemes of the devil.
Tabor – the wiles of the devil
Dave – Gen 3:1 the most subtal (arum)
23:08 - 1Th 2:18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.
Tabor – the world gets in the way – things come up – the WORLD VIEW of the NT
Dave – Yep - the WORLD – Gen 3:14-20 man vrs world + man vrs archon
23:55 - 2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
Tabor – The anti-Christ will do ‘pretended’ signs – tricks – fool the people
God sends the delusion to some that the delusion is real – if you are not on the side of LIGHT you can be take nover
Dave - Agree – not real miracles of creation – just tricks
God sends the delusion – hardening of the heart – God did it!
Just as God hardened Pharaoh's heart – God did it
Just as God sent some aside – God does it
Just as God predestines (chooses) some – God does it
Why – to facilitate God’s Will upon the earth
24:25 - 1Ti 5:15 For some are already turned aside after Satan.
24:28 - 2Ti 2:26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
Tabor – this is getting scary isn’t it
Dave – the archon sidetrack you – get your focus off of God and the HS
Work – career – fame – fortune – name – all SELF-ish
You can spend your life as an amazing scientist – and deny God - Darwin
OR – through history you have the repeating cycle of
Rape – pillage – plunder – and murder to force groups of men under the rule of one alpha male (yester ra) – until the next alpha male comes along
OR – through history you have the repeating cycle of
Business men making money out the front door – while polluting the planet – oppressing the labor force – slavery – creating a debt dependency out the back door
Dave – if satan came out and said follow me – the enemy would be obvious
Tabor – it is scary
Dave – agree – but rephrase
Not as much scary as OVERWHELMING – th attack come from so many angels we are confused at times what is fake news
This is why knowledge of the archon is important – so you recognize them in our world and the messaging of the world
Eph – 6:13-20
24:35 - Heb 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
Tabor – Christ destroys the one who has the power of death - the devil
Dave – NOT that the archon can kill you – but by keeping you in this world leads to death
24:40 - Jas 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
1Pe 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
Tabor – This is literally your satan the devil
Always prowling around looking for prey
Dave – Yep our satan – Eph 6L12 the archon - of the world that is open 24/7
25:07 - 1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Tabor – works of the devil = the devils long term plans
Dave – David Ike – Just outside out field of view – are entities that are anything but human – that have been manipulating this world from the outside for eons – some call them demonic – some call them the serpent race – islam calls them the Jinn
Dave – the first centuries and authors of the Gospels called them archon
Eph 6:12 – our real struggle- principalities / archon and the invisible powers behind them
Col 1:16 - principalities / archon and the invisible powers behind them – created by God for God
Dave - David Ike – why would a human participate in a conspiracy that will take 100s of years to unfold
Answer – it is not about the humans – they are pawns used by these outside powers – they are the ones that will see the conspiracy through
Jud 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
Tabor – Jude is saying – if you have to fight – Call on the Lord
Dave - Rom 12:19 Never take your own revenge, loved ones, but give room for God’s wrath—for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine; I will repay,” says Adonai.
26:05 - Rev 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
Tabor – The synagogue of satan – trust in the world
Dave – Yep – choosing world over God
Rev 2:10 Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, so that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation for ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
Tabor - Rev 2:10 – G5438 – φυλακή - phulakē (pergamon in latin) - purgatory
From G5442; a guarding or (concretely guard), the act, the parson; figuratively the place, the condition, or (specifically) the time (as a division of day or night), literally or figuratively: - cage, hold, (im-) prison (-ment), ward, watch.
Purgatory – a place of Proportional Punishment
Dave - I’m good with it – no criticism - agree
26:20 - Rev 2:24 “But to the rest of you in Thyatira, who do not hold to this teaching and have not learned the so-called ‘deep things’ of satan—I place on you no other burden.
Tabor – the teachings of the Nicolaitans
Dave – (google) What were the Nicolaitans teaching?
They lead lives of unrestrained indulgence. The character of these men is very plainly pointed out in the Apocalypse of John, [when they are represented] as teaching that it is a matter of indifference to practice adultery, and to eat things sacrificed to idols.
26:25 - Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was thrown down—the ancient serpent, called the devil and satan, who deceives the whole world. He was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
Tabor – The BEAST begins in heaven – but is thrown down to earth – and knows his fate
Dave – Yep – ejected from heaven into physical creation – Entropy
Know his own fate – Entropy will wind down to nothingness
27:09 - Rev 20:2 He seized the dragon—the ancient serpent, who is the devil and satan—and bound him for a thousand years.
Rev 20:10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are too, and they shall be tortured day and night forever and ever.
Tabor – 27:40 – there are all kinds of operations going on behind the scenes – in this world view
Dave – Yes – the archon are a multi-pronged attack – they have their hands into everything worldly
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27:50 – Hebrew Cosmology
Sheol is NOT HELL – everyone is their good and bad waiting – [waiting resurrection (introduced into Judaism 160 BC Book of Macabees – just before Christ)]
Dave – yes – Hades is NOT HELL - everyone is their good and bad waiting
Yes – Resurrection is a Jewish teaching – in the end – “returned / restored” to the body of Adam and Eden
28:57 – Hebrew satan is like heavens lawyer for the prosecution
29:09 – He makes a connection between the prosecutor and Job
29:03 – God is in total control
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29:50 – as you move into the Hellenistic world
00:30 – all the way through the OT God is the creator of the world
Now satan is the god of this world
So how did this shift happen – THE GREATEST SHIFT in human thought the history of the world
New Cosmology 300BC - 1500AD
10 heavens – God on top – man lower on earth – hades below earth in 3 locations – the Isle of the Blessed – Tartarus – and those waiting
31:30 – earth is a dark place and man is made to be here – not heaven
31:50- here is death outside of Eden
Dave – Yes – the world is a hard place Gen 3:14-24 – God did it
Yes – outside of Eden – in a different location – death was going on
Yes – Gen 3 – Adam and Eve did not change anything – except location
From Eden where there is no death to the WORLD where death exist
32:05 – Humans learning of good and evil = humans growing to maturity
Children do not know good vrs evil - YET
Humans learning of good and evil = man coming of age
Dave – I like it - Eze 28:15 You were perfect in your ways from the day that you were created, until unrighteousness was found in you.
Did God know man would grow and learn as he matured
Dave – Yes – all God’s Plan – all God’s Will
Robert - Nope – not supposed to happen – it would mean God made a mistake
Dave – I have owned good dogs – yet lay a steak down in front of him – tell him ‘don’t eat it or I’ll be mad’ - and walk away
What is going to happen?
Maybe 5 mins – OK good boy
But go away for a few hours and that steak is lunch
Am I predicting the future? - No – just human (dog) nature (yester ra)
32:45 – man is on earth – down here / lower world – surrounded by these other forces
32:55 – a Gnostic reference – this is not our home – just passing threw
33:18 – by the time of Planitus - 3rd century AD this is the world view
33:50 – he presents my teaching
10 heavens / dimensions – 7 heaven / dimensions above – 3= 3 here – physical reality
The archon have agents on all 7 heavens
Gnostic the Beast appeared then created for himself 7 the 12 – that made the 72
Yes – there is a correlation
satan rule in the dimensions above us – NO
Gnostic the archon are trapped close to earth – the first layer just above us
So – as man look “up” to God in the high heaven – we have to look through the archon – they get in our way
Hades below – 3 compartments
The Isle of the Blessed – the Bosom of Abraham – First fruits – near the throne – Rev 20:4
Tatarus – a sulfer pit of fire and brimstone – the abyss – the pit
and those waiting – purgatory / prison – Proportional Punishment
33:58 – THE MOST SIGNIFICANT FIND FROM ANCIENT HISTORY
The artifact that changed our world
We know when it happened -
The earliest record 300AD – gold foil from tombs of early Christians
34:45 – the idea of reincarnation over and over up the food chain until man has a chance for a spiritual awakening – very Hindu – new age
36:45 – journey of the soul – enter Hades – but is met by “The guardians of below” – who ask who are you and where are you
THIS IS SALVATION – if you know who you are and where you belong
Where are you – in dearest darkest death – but it is NOT my home
You express a knowledge (Gnostic) an understanding of our real origin
“We are children of God and heaven is our real home”
If you know who you are – they (the guardians) will allow you to ascend into heaven
Dave – Heb 9:27 – death then judgment
Are you saved (Divine Pardon) or NOT
Saved allowed to ascend into heaven – First Fruits Reb 20:4
If NOT – Proportional Punishment to await the First Resurrection Rev 20:5
Christian / Catholics – St Peter standing at the pearly gates
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In all of this comprehensive review of biblical satan
Zero mention of Exk 28 or Isa 14
OR – the idea that satan rebels, hates, and opposes God
Or – the idea of two equal gods locked in a cosmic struggle over God’s right to rule the universe
