Jewish satan as an obedient servant of God -vrs- a Christian Free Will villain
7:25 – Angels have no Free Will
8:40 – Hinduism – neo-monotheism. It has always been mon-thiestic with a Trinity of a god Head. Bahama the Creator, Shiva the Destroyer, and Vishnu who has came as a man twice to impart wisdom and knowledge. They say, their God is one – but has a multitude of faces and they are awaiting the Third coming.
8:50 – All Gnostics are pagan. Jews think Christians pagan – therefore Christian Gnostics = pagan to Jews. Gnostic literature is a compost if many txt from may cultures and much of it is totally pagan. I am a Gnostic Christian than embraces ahl first, agl second, and value of the Gnostic Gospels found within the Nag Hammadi Text, written by the same authors as the agl Canon
10:15 – Gnostic Christians were crushed by the Roman church 10:50 - Satan is NOT God’s enemy
10:50-13:10 – God created Evil (RA), and why God created the Contest
15:30 – Book of Job 16:30 – Satan obeys God
21:45 – you have never sin without make a – CHOICE
23:00 – Thank God for satan 26:25 – the archon help us forget the consequence of Sin 27:00 – 1 Chronicles 21:1 -vrs- I Samuael 24:1 28:00 - Isaiah 14 = Babylon 33:20 – Exk 28 = Tyre / USA?
7:50 – Frankenstein 10:00 – Archon are not a DIRCECT product of creation – but a by-product of creation – a consequence of creation – Entropy 11:40 – Gnostics and Christian place the creation of the Archon in the Gap 13:15 – Archon are a by-product of creation – a product of something already made 14:00 – Entropy of Creation
14:30 – Lilith – 100% Jewish 3 theories of Lilith and her offspring with ‘The Adam’ Premise 1 = Adam – to the Jews means more than just Eve’s husband, Abraham was an Adam, Israel at Sinai was an Adam. Premise 2 = Our reality is a reflection of heaven – God’s will on Earth, as in heaven. Theory 1 – Gnostic - Adam in the Gap = creation + female Lilith = offspring = female –Archon – the by-product of creation – the resulting Entropy of the Negentropy / creation Theory 2 – Jewish – Lilith may have been earthly Adam’s first wife that had offspring before Eve – but then they say, none of it was physical – it all happened in spirit form – and it all happened on day 6 Theory 3 – Christian – before Christ was ever born Judaism is pagan and all this is myth
17:50 – How did they come to be 18:30 – what is the Talmud 20:20 – Archon reproduce (100% Islamic Jinn) 20:40 – what do they look like? – The Christian view is from Dante’s Divine Comedy 23:25 – they can take any form – shapeshifters (100% Islamic Jinn) 24:00 – 32:55 – The life of a demon / Archon They can fly, have the knowledge of angels, they can multiply, they can die, they eat (100% Islamic Jinn) Islamic Jinn feed off of our fear – our negative energy we generate when we fear 24:56 – they are egocentric – only concerned with themselves – their own importance Gnostics say they are jealous of man because we have Free Will and they do not. Islam says, they are jealous of us because we took over earth from them. Christians just say they are hate. 26:45 – They exist where humans cannot – Jewish in the earth, in the air, in the first realm above us – Gnostic = Jewish + on the moon, in Saturn, in space – Islamic = Jewish + Gnostic + dark alleys, toilets, fortune tellers, grave yards – Christendom = either everywhere or locked away 33:00 – Lilith = Chief Archon? 43:55 – 52:15 - Asmodeus is the king of the demons. – different than satan. Gnostics simply say there are hierarchies among the Archon - (100% Islamic Jinn) 51:50 – Archon / demons are more spirit than physical - (100% Islamic Jinn) 53:00 – Jewish exorcism 53:45 – Are Archon / Demons Real? 54:00 – Where are they? 55:20 – Archon / Demons are associated with grave yards (100% Islamic Jinn)
55:55 – Angels 51:25 - 10 levels of angels - The Gnostic difference elohiym and bane elohiym
Gnostic view – 'el (singular) = Creator – Josh 22:22 God of gods – the 'el of elohiym pl = all heavenly host – The Trinity, angels, and archon 'el + 9 levels of elohiym – 8 levels of angelic elohiym + 1 level of Archon elohiym Making the bane elohiym = offspring of the Archon elohiym – NOT angelic elohiym Catholic view – Creator Father and Trinity + 9 levels of angels – the lowest level being called – powers and principalities (Archon) Christian view – Trinity + angels – then the angles rose up against God and some of them changed species to be demons
58:00 – I LOVE this description of fire and elohiym 1:00:00 – What do angels look like – no form – can take on any form
1:07:00 Angel satan – obedient servany – The Prosecutor 1:08:30 – satan the Divine Prosecutor 1:09:20 – satan the tester
1:10:40 – Elijah 1:11:50 – Abraham 3 visitors – angels don’t eat, have sex, or mingle in this world in any way.
If angelic elohiym do not have sex - then they cannot be the bane elohiym of Gen 6 - However, Archon elohiym do have sex
1:13:26 – Jewish Joke 1:13:45 – Creating angels
1:15:00- Recap 1:15:20 – Why they exist 1:16:30 – Entropy of creation 1:17:30 – Tumah + Kedushah + CHOICE 1:18:20 – The parable of the King
I have great respect for Chuck Misler - his presentation of satan 1:09 - satan hinders 1:20 - satan wants to keep productivity down 2:30 - satan can only act with the permission of God - All Ra is father filtered 3:00 - Eph 6 is real and alive URGENT! 3:20 - The Gnostic Contest 3:50 - satan has convinced us that he doesn't exist - always operates by deception 4:30 - The Archon are real and active today
Not once does Chuck Missle mention Ezk 28 or Isa 14 Not once does he suggest that satan has Free Will In fact, Missler says, satan can only act with God's permission (God's servant) Missler does say - and makes the point - the Contest is alive - The archon are real and in your face - TODAY
0:26 - Demons are real entities (the archon offspring of the Chief Archon) 0:45 - Demon Spirits (Archon) = 'other gods' desiring worship 2:10 - only one devile (overseer) + many demnons (Archon) satan has locality - but has a large staff 2:49 - awareness of our own inventiations to the Archon 3:10 - Possession 3:30 - Possession is not a 'mental health issue' 4:30 - Very real - very powerful - spirit realm 4:50 - Human history - validates the Reality of the Archon (David Ike, 13 Famlies) 5:30 - necromancing - fortune tellers - saiances 5:59 - they have angelic knowledge - they know Christ 6:08 - their destiny is sealed - No Fre Will 6:20 - Conspicquous participation in Global Governments (David Ike, 13 Families) 7:00 - Christendom being led by Archons (Coporate prayer in Sun day church, Christmas, and Easter) 8:00 - Achons alway operate by deception 8:45 - The Armor of Eph 6 - PRAYER 9:45 - Jewish exorcisms - always formal part of Judaism 11:05 - the Archons fate is sealed - NO FREE WILL 12:15 - the difference between the devil, satan, and demons Archon leadership can manafest (bane elohiym)- while archon off spring seek embodment The idea Missler uses to suggest demons are the disembodies spirits of the Nephilim = 100% Coptic = 100% Gnostic from the Book of Jubilees chpt 10 - and Book of Enoch chpt 15 12:45 - the Reality of the Rephiem
Not once does Missler ever say anything about Ezk 28 or Isa 14 Not once does Missler ever suggest satan has Free Will
X. 1 And in the third week of this jubilee the unclean demons 2 began to lead astray †the children of† 3 the sons of Noah; and to make to err and destroy them. 2. And the sons of Noah came to Noah their father, and they told him concerning the demons which were, leading astray and blinding and slaying his sons' sons. 3. And he prayed before the Lord his God, and said:
God of the spirits of all flesh, 4 who hast shown mercy unto me, And hast saved me and my sons from the waters of the flood, And hast not caused me to perish as Thou didst the sons of perdition; 5
For Thy grace hath been great towards me, And great hath been Thy mercy to my soul; Let Thy grace be lift up upon my sons, And let not wicked spirits rule over them Lest they should destroy them from the earth.
[paragraph continues] 4. But do Thou bless me and my sons, that we may increase and multiply and replenish the earth. 5. And Thou knowest how Thy Watchers, the fathers of these spirits, acted in my day: and as for these spirits which are living, imprison them and hold them fast in the place of condemnation, and let them not bring destruction on the sons of thy servant, my God; for these are malignant, and created in (page break) order to destroy. 6. And let them not rule over the spirits of the living; for Thou alone canst exercise dominion over them. And let them not have power over the sons of the righteous from henceforth and for evermore." 7. And the Lord our God bade us to bind all. 1 8. And the chief of the spirits, Mastêmâ, 2 came and said: "Lord, Creator, let some of them remain before me, and let them hearken to my voice, and do all that I shall say unto them; for if some of them are not left to me, I shall not be able to execute the power of my will on the sons of men; for these are for corruption and leading astray before my judgment, for great is the wickedness of the sons of men." 9. And He said: "Let the tenth part of them remain before him, and let nine parts descend into the place of condemnation." And one of us 4 He commanded that we should teach Noah all their medicines; for He knew that they would not walk in uprightness, nor strive in righteousness. 11. And we did according to all His words: all the malignant evil ones we bound in the place of condemnation, and a tenth part of them we left that they might be subject before Satan 5 on the earth. 12. And we explained to Noah all the medicines of their diseases, together with their seductions, how he might heal them with herbs of the earth. 13. And Noah wrote down all things in a book as we instructed him concerning every kind of medicine. Thus the evil (page break) spirits were precluded from (hurting) the sons of Noah. 14. And he gave all that he had written to Shem, his eldest son; for he loved him exceedingly above all his sons. 15. And Noah slept with his fathers, and was buried on Mount Lûbâr in the land of Ararat. 16. Nine hundred and fifty years he completed in his life, nineteen jubilees and two weeks and five years. 17. And in his life on earth he excelled the children of men save Enoch because of the righteousness, wherein he was perfect. For Enoch's office was ordained for a testimony to the generations of the world, 1 so that he should recount all the deeds of generation unto generation, till the day of judgment.
The Book of Jubilees is quoted by Jews and Christians and endorses Enoch
The Book of Enoch 15:8. And now, the giants (Neplilim), who are produced from the spirits and flesh, shall be called evil spirits upon the earth, and on the earth shall be their dwelling. 9. Evil spirits have proceeded from their bodies; because they are born from men, ⌈⌈and⌉⌉ from the holy Watchers (Archon) is their beginning and primal origin; ⌈they shall be evil spirits on earth, and⌉ evil spirits shall they be called. [10. As for the spirits of heaven, in heaven shall be their dwelling, but as for the spirits of the earth which were born upon the earth, on the earth shall be their dwelling.] 11. And the spirits of the giants afflict, oppress, destroy, attack, do battle, and work destruction on the earth, and cause trouble: they take no food, ⌈but nevertheless hunger⌉ and thirst, and cause offences. And these spirits shall rise up against the children of men and against the women, because they have proceeded ⌈from them⌉.
This is an interesting thread Dave. So many differences with my own views. Where to begin? Much we have discussed before. So I pray to GOD and ask what makes us different?
I think the answer is this Greek word "archon". Let's start in only the NT torah, using Greek.
What does "Archon" mean in the Greek NT context?
Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities "arche" or "archon" ??, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
There are 36 contexts that use archon, the word means "ruler or prince or both' this is not a BEING but a TITLE or FUNCTION a Being does. This is a major point.
Mt 9:34 But the Pharisees said, He casteth out devils through the prince of the devils.
As this example shows...
Now we have to ask what does the OT torah also say about the NT torah, both torah has to have the same harmony.
In the OT Hebrew this word is "sar" meaning prince.
Is there a passage similar to the one above?
Da 10:13 But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.
Here the word "archon" is used twice as a title ... the archon of Persia Michael the chief archon...
So we need to identify who Michael is, and who the archon behind Persia might be?
Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
If we don't study any more between the OT and NT torah, we see already Michael is associated with angels, and the dragon also with angels, assuming the Greek term "aggelos" is the Hebrew word "cherub" in this context.
Sometimes "aggelos" is also "messenger" as in "malak". So much for Greek.
So confirm for me how you see "archon" in the Greek. 1) Does the word mean a title or a being? 2) Does the word mean prince or ruler, ie a title? 3) where is this word in the Hebrew torah?
You might say, to be fair that Eph 6:12 the context make "archons" a Being?
Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against "princes", against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places
Sometimes saying one is a "prince" is saying one is a Being. So does the Hebrew talk about "archons" as a created being? no it doesn't. The only created being mentioned in Hebrew torah is "adam" as a kind of humans and "cherub" as a kind of angel.
00:45 – The Tanak is 3 time larger than the Christian OT 01:30 – The Christian OT is 1/3rd of the Tanak 06:10 – Satan is not a NOUN – it is averb 09: 00 - I can be your satan – you can be mine (Gnostic –we ca be Christ to another – like Abraham, Moses, Cyrus) 09:20 – Job 15:00 – Our ‘dirty clothing’ 20:15 – a great explanation of Zorasterism (There is only one Creator God Ahura Mazda – but man is trapped with a duality of good and evil, powers of good (gods) pull us one way – powers of evil (gods) pull us another – Their doctrine for man = in all things choose right) 20:50 – only ONE FORCE in the world = God Gnostic – Agreed – BUT – God does not do the RA Himself (God is Good attitude), Gnostics have a very real and active spiritual realm – God’s angels are busy Gnostic – as a consequence / byproduct / ‘indirect’ creation of TOV = RA (entrpy is a Law of God) This indirect creation (feminine in nature) = archon – different then angels that are the agents of entropy RA – like rust on a car – just keep corroding away 21:45 – The Rabbi misstates dualism Gnostic – dualism exist – TOV and RA and we are trapped within the Contest between the two As a Gnostic – this does not make Good God and Bad god – this make one Creator that created the paradigm beneath him – Christ / HS – Male / female – TOV and RA – Yin and Yang – whatever
23:30 – What the Rabbi’s teach about satan 24:12 – satan is a blessing! ID vrs Ego – cool – very modern psychology – I like it – Shia Islam calls this Jihad – the inner struggle (Sunni think it an outer struggle against the world – ISIS) 25:30 – satan allows virtue
26:50 Mitzvah = Virtue 27:15 – The Jewish New World to Come Jewish rewards in heaven = a score of your life – Mitzvah 0 – Sin 1 – is all it takes to be a sinner 28:00 – The Bread of Life from the Kabbalah
Christianity 28:40 – misstates Christianity as I see it Jews work and earn their reward in heaven – they grow their spirit within He says Christian say it is a free gift - AH – but the free gift only comes if you work for it
30:25 – Rabbi really bashes Christianity I see his criticism – but as a Christian I was confused As a Gnostic – we have the archon In the sliding scale between TOV on the way down to RA – I see James 1:13 – God doesn’t do it directly – He has a staff for that – a department for that – a sub-department – like the sanitation department of a much larger government Christians have a large TOV department staffed by many angels – host Gnostics have a RA department – with its own staff (an indirect byproduct of creation) Does satan have FREE WILL – he is not stupid – he is intelligent enough to run an entire department of creation. Within that department he has the ability to govern his own staff – with limits set by God Gnostics see the ‘overseer’ job is to make sure his staff doesn’t cross God’s boundaries – he restrains the RA – Rust still happens and will overtake the car – unless it is restrained
This link goes to a video I did watch about Jewish view on Job.
Jews have a concept of Ha-satan as a good angel doing a bad task of running negative aspects an attorney would do in the heavenly court.
They also say the "yester ha ra" and the "Yester hara tov" is built into the body from Creation, as GOD created both TOV and RA.
If you read my commentaries, I have learned a lot about Jewish views.
I do not agree with these views in the Hebrew torah, but I do see why and how they came up with their views. There is not much written in the OT, so its easy to see a different view.
One question I could NOT get answered by the Jews is this:-
1) If God disdains the RA but created RA with TOV, why create RA at all?
I have read in Jewish material if one is hungry bad enough they would steal. There is a text for this in Proverb. Jews do NOT have a concept of original sin, hence they see RA and TOV always in Creation.
2) So GOD isn't almighty enough to create a universe without RA?
Jews may not have answered this question. For one thing, it would create an origin of sin, which Jews do not have in their theology.
Now for Gnosticism
1) Now not sure about Gnostism, so I have asked you about the Archon. You mention archon mentioned in the Solomon book, can you show me the verse and book please? I want to check out the actual Hebrew of this word.