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Post by pieter on Jan 20, 2018 3:22:17 GMT -5
I have had a similar path to the both of you with some small differences. However I grew up in a very conservative Christian religious home where independent thought was a unknown concept. The church taught that we were all God`s creation and had to think the same way. In the middle seventies I started military service in the defense force. My eyes were slowly opening when we were taught to detest and kill the enemy who were my fellow countrymen. And this was supported by a Church. Wow. Is it possible. And we had people not of European descent there with us. That is when I realized that system (church and state) had no moral grounds for its existence but fear. which leads to hate. The moral teaching was faulty. I resigned from the Dutch Reformed Church and joined the Baptists who had a more scripture based teaching. Completed my studies (complements of the system) and became a Radar Technician. I resigned from the defense force and carried on with my life, including an interlude of evangelizing Muslims ( outreach). THAT was difficult with no hope of success. In the church I learned about doctrine and dogma. Then in the middle 90`s I realized that doctrine and dogma was an insidious system to brainwash and keep us subservient to the religious industrial industry. ( RII) Even though the Baptists did not engage in this evil industry they were limited by it. Then one day my Bible class asked me to explain the trinity. I could not find a scripture based explanation. Shot down in flames! CONFUSION. I, who had a very good bible background and knowledge was totally without excuse. And no one else could provide an answer either. I don`t suffer from depression but have an attention span problem so I need to concentrate on something else for a while.
I shall continue.
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Post by Dave on Jan 20, 2018 12:13:13 GMT -5
Welcome pieter
Teach us what you know - there are no taboo subjects here and - in theory - you cannot offend anyone here
an open and honest discussion about the Lord
religious industrial industry ( RII)
Man can I relate - I call this Corporate Christendom - or Romanology - same concept
This is my personal opinion
I believe in the contest established in Gen 3:15 I believe in an active unseen force (entities) - Eph 6
Christ came and His Gospel was spoken - not written once written - the faith flourished Eumetical Councils were held by the faithful to discuss which human dogma is appropiate Each of the fist four Councils were presided over by a POPE from ALEXANDRIA EGYPT Once Constantine merged Christianity with the Roman government - the EGYPTIANS walked out They retreated back to EGYPT and many retreated even farther by seeking the Lord in silence alone in the desert like John the Baptist or King David - monasticism By 200 AD they had a 6 language interlinear Bible The Coptics have never edited their texts - and they have saved the most text than anyone I always thought the Book of Jubilees was a Jewish Text - it isn't - it is found in the Coptic Broader Canon Today - the Copts are on Pope 119 - documented all the way back to Pope #1 John Mark And when Jesus returns - where does He return - EGYPT for his elect
In the meantime - The Roman Church found itself in a position of power The withdrawal of the Coptic Church - left a vacuum that Rome filled They back-dated their Popes so that Peter is the Pope in Rome at the exact time the Book of Acts says he was in prison in Demascus The next thing Rome did was to EDIT the writings of that Gospel - which generated the Roman Index (a list of writings a Christian must never read)
If you take the time to look at that editing process you will notice something really funny. Paul, Peter, Philip, Thomas, and James all have writing that were edited in and edited out How could these guys write inspired scripture one day - and heresy the next? A closer look at those edited texts reviles something else interesting Every text edited out - refers in some way to the ARCHON (what a roman christian would call a demon)
Almost - as if - the church was usurped by the enemy - and corrupted into a non-christian thing The Catholic Church has killed more people than any other force on the globe The Catholic Church is responsible for all of the predigest we have and as soon as any Protestants says they are not just a liberal version of Catholicism - ask them to do a Bible study and the text they turn to are all from ROME
Roman Christendom has preached a FEEL GOOD theology for years I have seen it myself - why does someone come to church mid-life? it is because something is wrong - cancer - divorce - eyc and what are they told - Roman 8:28 - turn it over and it will be well But - the cancer remains - or they still get divorced - and they leave the church and its empty message
The end result of this FEEL GOOD christianity - the entire legacy of Romanology is:
IF - there is a God, He is either not merciful or caring - or is weaker than the evil
and questions go unanswered - such as - why did innocent little 4yr old Jimmy have to die of cancer?
Romanology does not teach the enemy - in fact most modern christian doubt spirits at all - yet believe in ghost of dead people - but if you need an exorcist who do you call - a Catholic who has access to all that literature on the Roman Index that you and I are not suppose to read.
I have since declared myself as a Gnostic Christian - meaning a follower of Jesus Christ that is open to a whole lot more information / data / texts that what Rome allows
I views are more Coptic than Roman and I certainly have more respect for the Copts who have never harmed anyone saved all the literature edited nothing invented monasticism and is currently on Pope 119
Rome - Crusades / inquisition / 30 years war edited all the texts hid many texts who didn't even allow me and you to read scripture for ourselves for the first 1500 yrs and is currently on pope 267
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Post by Dave on Jan 20, 2018 12:30:36 GMT -5
Explaining the TRINITY
Trapped by scripture alone - so much has to be taken on faith to explain away the trinity
However - if you leave all scripture out of the conversation - my example goes like this
Mathematically speaking, the most current science theory (String Theory Physics) says we are living in a multi-verse of 10 dimensions of space and one of time.
We are a 3 dimensional creature living in a 3 dimensional reality By the strictest math or science definition those 3 dimensions are:
The First Dimension - a singularity, a single point that cannot be located or identified, a single point that contains all data, all energy The E of the E=mc2 Making that singularity both OMNIPOTENT and OMNISCIENCE
God to Moses - no man can see the face of God
The Second Dimension - is a plane - it is OMNIPRESENT - the Holy Spirit every version of the Big Bang theory - includes EXPANSION and the 2nd step in creation
The Third Dimension = US and where we are - Christ
**************
Interesting correlations In the Book of Enoch - Enoch saw 10 heavens and to be face to face with God he saw heavens 8, 9, and 10 simultaniously In the Letter of Paul (almost the 3rd letter to Corinthians) - Paul saw 10 heavens There are 10 Hebrew words for heaven There are 10 Hebrew words for the Creator Islam has 7 heavens - add these 3 dimensions to them and you get 10
*************
Only the Trinity of Christianity satisfies the science
There is only one primal theology - not the science way or the scripture way - but both must testify to the Creator - Psalms 19:1
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Post by Richard on Jan 22, 2018 12:26:55 GMT -5
Then one day my Bible class asked me to explain the trinity. I could not find a scripture based explanation. Shot down in flames! CONFUSION. I, who had a very good bible background and knowledge was totally without excuse. And no one else could provide an answer either. Welcome I am a lay paster at the Friend's Church in Buena Vista Colorado Working with the youth this seemingly Christian paradox of the Trinity is often picked upon Some evidences must be experiential and these are my examples There is no way anyone can understand what it feels like or sounds like to launch a rocket to the moon, by simply staring at and discussing the chemical equation of the rocket fuel There is no way anyone can understand what it feels like or sounds like to be in a high tech racing car, by studying the mathematical torque of the engine There is also no way of finding the answers we seek by mathematically understanding scripture first, but once you have found your Savior, confusing text become more clear. Or at least, least complicated.
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Post by pieter on Jan 22, 2018 15:54:16 GMT -5
Thank you all, but for now I need to continue. Starting over I realized that every time God is mentioned in standard western bibles He is called by a title and not by name, yet in Exodus 3 v 16 God clearly gives Moses a name for Himself.God continues and say, This is my name forever. I became involved with the Sacred Name movement. For couple of years it went well and we grew. Then the babes who only wish to drink milk that Paul was upset about, reared their heads. At that time God gave me a piece of land and I endeavored to become a farmer producing essential oils. I drifted further from the fleshpots of RII but found a more complete and profound experience of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. He who sent Jesus to recall His children to Him. I have no problems with the churches but have discovered that in the mainstream the members/adherents have largely left the responsibility for their souls in the hands of others. That is frightening. The most precious gift that God gave mankind, in fact, that which sets mankind apart from the rest of creation, is treated with indifference. Is this the bitter fruit of Calvinism. At present I lean more towards Unitarianism, but I know that God is not done with me. The chorus of a Carly Simon song that is part of a poem by a Methodist minister: Life is eternal and love is immortal and death is only a horizon and the horizon is nothing but the limit of our sight.
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Post by Dave on Jan 24, 2018 13:54:48 GMT -5
I have no problems with the churches but have discovered that in the mainstream the members/adherents have largely left the responsibility for their souls in the hands of others. That is frightening. The most precious gift that God gave mankind, in fact, that which sets mankind apart from the rest of creation, is treated with indifference. This is a most constant theme here at PC The Jews say - from God we come and to God we return We are spiritual creatures having a souljourn in physical reality Gnostic literature all say that the Archon / the powers and principalities of Eph 6 make us forget who we are The basic concept of the Gnostic 'Great Contest' are the choice we make daily / moment by moment between the good and evil - which in Hebrew is TOV and RA - which is conceptually understood as FUNCTION and DYSFUNCTION Function - moving toward you Creator Dysfunction - not Psa 51:16 (ASV) For thou delightest not in sacrifice; Else would I give it: Thou hast no pleasure in burnt-offering. 17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: A broken and contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.
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Post by Robert T on Sept 6, 2019 16:21:25 GMT -5
This thread is a powerful and moving testimony
Learning to appreciate the upswing, when your pet sinning rubs you in the gutter... yes I have this too.
Gospel of Thomas 114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't deserve life." Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven."
What does this passage mean?
I take Gnostic Theology allows you to see the book of Thomas as inspired as other books of the traditional Bible? The gospel of Thomas was originally written in what? Greek perhaps? And when? How do you know it's reliable? What are these words "male" and "female"? in the language it was recorded?
What does Gnostic theology mean anyhow? The www gives strange definitions and beliefs? I am new to all this sorry...
Not sure if I can trust books outside of Hebrew... This passage seems to suggest responders cannot be providers, until their personality allows them to become providers.
For example:
Ro 16:1 ¶ I commend unto you Phebe our sister, which is a servant of the church which is at Cenchrea:
And this Greek word s used also in:
Ro 13:4 For he is the minister of God...
So if there are no natural providers around in an assembly, it is OK for a responder to become a provider.. is what Paul is saying here.
If a family comes to an assembly, the provider of love should speak (ie the gender male) should provide the providing and allow His responder to respond as required. If one breaks over and ahead of the other unit, than love is not unified, and this family is dysfunctional. Love is also relational but in cases where women are unmarried, than one who is naturally a responder, can become a provider. I see this is what Thomas 114 is saying here?
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Post by Dave on Sept 6, 2019 23:38:07 GMT -5
Gospel of Thomas 114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't deserve life." Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven." What does this passage mean? I take Gnostic Theology allows you to see the book of Thomas as inspired as other books of the traditional Bible? The gospel of Thomas was originally written in what? Greek perhaps? And when? How do you know it's reliable? What are these words "male" and "female"? in the language it was recorded? What does Gnostic theology mean anyhow? The www gives strange definitions and beliefs? I am new to all this sorry... Not sure if I can trust books outside of Hebrew... This passage seems to suggest responders cannot be providers, until their personality allows them to become providers. Women in ancient day - were kept out of the loop - because of nature As women bore children - they were continually occupied with the nest / home Men dominated the culture Sure there are exceptions! - there always are It is the role of the Jewish father to teach his family - if he went to hell - so did his family Sins of the father were visited upon the sons - even genetically (alcoholism) Christ changed all that - Women become Men - when they step up and take responsibility for their own salvation - their own walk with God - their own Pentecost - Regardless of their husband's pursuit of RA. Today we have women as - head of house hold - single parent mothers - running for president - and fighting in foxholes making their own decisions - as to life - and therefore - as to Christ. Gnostic = knowledgeThere is only one Gnostic Formal Church - it is a library of many esoteric texts Who is to say what is inspire writing The Catholic Bible is different than the Bishops bible is different than the KJV The Jewish ahl - is different than the OT The first century writings of Paul, Peter, James, and John all made it into the Roman canon Yet - many of their words were placed on the index of heresy? There are more quotations of Jesus Christ outside the agl than within? Who gets to edit this stuff? -- ROME! Jews didn't even organised the OT as it is - Christians did When I stand up in Church and say - I am a Gnostic - I meanI am not a Protestant or a Catholic You want to talk physics - I'll show you how I see God in every equation Biology - Genetics - bring it on - and I'll make every one of these separate things just seem like the hand of God - because it is all relevant, because it is all inter-connected Trusting books outside of the HebrewEinstein said - time is not linear - it is relative 2 Peter 3:8 says - Einstein's theory is scriptural Einstein = Gnostic thought - is it scripture? Is it valid? Does it point to the Creator? Is it validated by other scripture? Books of Jubilees, The Book of Enoch, and the Book of Creation, are all apart of the Coptic Broader Canon - of 81 books. The Jews do not consider them scripture - but just ancient writings - Mid Rash. Rome says they are banned!and should be burn't whenever and wherever found! Who is right - how about the Testament of Solomon? Wouldn't Solomon be a great source of theological thought? This is what I do - I pray about it - it is all I ever do - teach me oh Lord - help me to understand Then - there is weight of authorship If God said it - or Moses said it - or Isaiah said it How about if Jesus said it - Peter, John, Phillip, Thomas, Mary, or James said it? I weight it more than Saint anybody in the Catholic Church Some of these authors get into the Roman canon - some don't Those that get in - are also guilty of writing heresy at the same time they wrote the Gospels Even - Romes favorite Paul has writing in the index - you are not allowed to read Why not? - because all edited text speak of a larger reality and the demons / archons who oppose our spiritual awakening. 1Th 5:21 (KJV) Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. Prove = examine - try - test - discern all things = the whole - thoroughly - as many as (possible) hold fast = keep - retain - keep in memory - seize on - withhold that which is good = beautiful - valuable - honest Regardless of source - ahl - agl - Coptic Broader Canon - History - biology - etc My most favorite quotation by my most favorite scientist and mentor J. Marvin Herndon - when your on the right track - the pieces simply fit together Gospel of Thomas - is a question ans answer book. The disciples asked the dumbest questions and Jesus gave vague answers - some of it taken out of context is questionable - but when you remember it is simply a Q&A - you expect that. Is the Gospel of Thomas Inspired - does it have to be to contain good information from a guy who walked along side of Jesus?
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Post by Dave on Sept 7, 2019 12:29:14 GMT -5
The Coptic Broader Canon The Copts are the elect that Jesus returns to save They have saved every sacred book they could find They never translated any of it If you want to read the library - learn Coptic Rome - edited and edited - polished the agl into a nice smooth read - resulting in the many marginal readings. Many texts were used and they all differed = marginal texts Then Rome forbade anything they edited out The only surviving records of Valentinius - is of the churches criticism of him and his crazy ideas such as - God exists in three persons. The Dead Sea Scrolls - Found 1945 - I remember how excited my mother was back in 1961 - when it was announced that Isaiah was word for word and validated the Holy Scriptures - more news to follow. But, since then the Dead Sea Scrolls have been in a battle of ownership. The Jews hate them because they have Christian attitudes. The Christians hate them because it would seem that this group were UFO contactees. The Nag-Hammidi text - found 1947 - written in Coptic, by first century Christians. John, Peter, Paul, and James are all represented - interesting group of authors Jesus walked and talked with these guys for 40 days before Pentecost This period is missing from the Christendom record - what was said? The Apocryphon of James Translated by Francis E. William s Since you asked that I send you a secret book which was revealed to me and Peter by the Lord, I could not turn you away or gainsay (?) you; but I have written it in the Hebrew alphabet and sent it to you, and you alone. But since you are a minister of the salvation of the saints, endeavor earnestly and take care not to rehearse this text to many - this that the Savior did not wish to tell to all of us, his twelve disciples. But blessed will they be who will be saved through the faith of this discourse.
I also sent you, ten months ago, another secret book which the Savior had revealed to me. Under the circumstances, however, regard that one as revealed to me, James; but this one ... [untranslatable fragments]
... the twelve disciples were all sitting together and recalling what the Savior had said to each one of them, whether in secret or openly, and putting it in books - But I was writing that which was in my book - at the end of this text James says: the other disciples called us and asked us, "What did you hear from the Master. And what has he said to you? And where did he go?"
But we answered them, "He has ascended, and has given us a pledge, and promised life to us all, and revealed to us children (?) who are to come after us, after bidding us love them, as we would be saved for their sakes."The Apocryphon of John Translated by Frederik Wisse The teaching of the savior, and the revelation of the mysteries and the things hidden in silence, even these things which he taught John, his disciple....
"And behold, now I shall go up to the perfect aeon. I have completed everything for you in your hearing. And I have said everything to you that you might write them down and give them secretly to your fellow spirits, for this is the mystery of the immovable race."
And the savior presented these things to him that he might write them down and keep them secure.The Gospel of the Egyptians Translated by Alexander Bohlig and Frederik Wisse The great Seth wrote this book with letters in one hundred and thirty years. He placed it in the mountain that is called 'Charaxio,' in order that, at the end of the times and the eras, by the will of the divine Autogenes and the whole pleroma, through the gift of the untraceable, unthinkable, fatherly love, it may come forth and reveal this incorruptible, holy race of the great savior, and those who dwell with them in love, and the great, invisible, eternal Spirit, and his only-begotten Son, and the eternal light, and his great, incorruptible consort, and the incorruptible Sophia, and the Barbelon, and the whole pleroma in eternity. Amen.All of these text - say they were hidden - to be recovered by the generation of the end times For the purpose of educating the faithful for the Contest ahead - against the Archon Are we in the end times ? follow me here - "End Times" Read more: ponderingconfusion.proboards.com/thread/349/end-times#ixzz5yrSchLm3
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Post by Richard on Sept 8, 2019 22:00:30 GMT -5
Not sure if I can trust books outside of Hebrew... God is omnipotent! The scripture we have today is exactly what God intended. Reading these other scripts requires a lot of tolerance as to doctrine. But I do admit that even with the accepted scripture there is a range of acceptability. Sometimes these other scripts say the most bizarre things. Makes me wonder.
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Post by Dave on Sept 8, 2019 23:04:16 GMT -5
The scripture we have today is exactly what God intended. Reading these other scripts requires a lot of tolerance as to doctrine. But I do admit that even with the accepted scripture there is a range of acceptability. Sometimes these other scripts say the most bizarre things. Makes me wonder. Here is the most honest comment about any scripture, ahl, agl, Coptic, Gnostic – any: Ponder Modern Scripture as you read this Nag Hammadi Library, Introduction, by James Robinson “… the text are not to be thought of as coming from one group or movement… … one of them, The Gospel of Thomas, begins with a word to the wise: ‘Whoever finds the interpretations of these sayings will not experience death.’ Thus the text can be read at two levels: what the original author may have intended to communicate and what the texts may subsequently have been taken to communicate. … … The texts were translated one by one from Greek into Coptic, and not always by translators capable of grasping the profundity or sublimity of what they sought to translate. The translator of a brief section of Plato’s republic clearly did not understand the text. … Fortunately, most text are better translated, but when there are duplications one can sense what a difference the better translation makes in comparison to a poor translation – which leads one to wonder about the bulk of texts that exist in only a single version. There is the same kind of hazard in the transmission of the text by a series of scribes who copied them, generation after generation, from increasing corrupt copies, first in Greek, then in Coptic. The number of unintentional errors is hard to estimate, since such a thing as a clean control copy does not exist; nor does one have, as in the case of the Bible, a quantity of manuscripts of the same text that tend to correct each other when compared.” Thank you Rome! To this I will add – Roman Edit – and Roman Polish so that it all reads nicely
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Post by Robert T on Sept 11, 2019 13:10:26 GMT -5
Thank you Dave and Richard for your comments. I understand the nature these Gnostic texts come to us. And they are interesting.
So where do I get the best electronic copies of these writings from, so I can study them in detail myself?
Our new member who has a mystery understanding of Elohiym? I would not use the invented word "trinity". I would use the picture "Family" instead.
Only one Scripture explains "elohiym" as "family":-
Eph 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God (elohiym) , who created all things by Jesus Christ: 10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God (elohiym), 11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord: 12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him. 13 Wherefore I desire that ye faint not at my tribulations for you, which is your glory. 14 ¶ For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named, 16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
Elohiym is a simile of family with Provider, Responder and the Son of God. The Hebrew word "Son" (BN) means "the HOME (B) continues over the NATIONS (N)." That's what Jesus did, He forever shows the love from the heavenly parents over mankind, especially to those who support Jesus correctly with their faith. Shalom
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Post by Dave on Sept 12, 2019 13:07:50 GMT -5
So where do I get the best electronic copies of these writings from, so I can study them in detail myself? There is only one real Gnostic church - www.gnosis.org/eghome.htmThey have a temple in Seattle and I was able to visit there Their Library was impressive They do hold masses - don't know anything about them It was open to me - welcome - study (No group studies with leaders available - just individual) Their Library website = www.gnosis.org/welcome.htmlIMO -- There are 5 basic types of Gnostic literature(1) 3 Abraham religions -ahl + agl + Koran (2) The Coptic Broader Canon - 81 books that including The Book of Jubilees and Enoch These are Christian Books outside of Western Roman Christendom (3) Literature from the Jewish Mid Rash - The Forgotten Books of Eden. The Books of Adam and Eve, The Book of Creation, The Testament of Solomon, The Wisdom of Solomon (4) Literature generated as Christ walked with the disciples after the Resurrection. The Gospel of James, Peter, Philip, some of Thomas, -- (5) Everything else that gets thrown in there - Things outside of Romes reach - American Navajo - Norse Folklore 1- There is an entire Chapter #72 (Suran#72) in the Koran - that talks of the Jinn There are many passages that describe Allah as the Christian Deceiver, who is a very one dimensional being - outside the Trinity Father Israel - giving rise to Christ and His Christians, as well as, Allah his followers (that are not promised heaven with God - but paradise - under Allah) As A Multidimensionalist - in Physics - I see the terminology Trinity to represent exactly what I mean Three forms - but a duality of expression Even in the Middle East - Israel is to focal point - but it is the Christians that are being beheaded 2- The Early Christian Church was Egypt not Rome - the first four Ecumenical Counsels were presided over by a Pope from Egypt - until the official marriage of church and state - where the Coptic walk away. They have kept every thing in its original form - without edit 3- Hebrew writings from so long ago - Adam and Eve are a good read - I enjoy them a lot. In my book I quote from the Book of Creation. There is a secular book called - The Legends of the Jews, written in 1911 - www.amazon.com/Legends-Jews-Four-Volumes-Complete/I use this Book and it references as my Mid Rash - stories about construction workers on the tower of babel shooting their arrows into the heaves - comes from these old stories Here is the online source I use - www.sacred-texts.com/index.htm4- First century Christianity - There are two major types - those that survived - Rome tried to stamp out a lot, but some did survive via Eastern Christianity -- then there and those that were deliberately hidden I'll focuses on the hidden - some of these text say they were deliberately hidden for the generations of the end times Dead Sea Scrolls found 1946 and The Nag Hammadi Library found in 1945 - interesting timing During the time of Christ - spiritual things were happening all over - possessions - Christ cast out how many demons? Christ had a sit down with the Accuser in the wilderness. The Dead Sea cult were spiritualist - they interacted with angels that flew vehicles (UFOs?) The Nag Hammadi Text say they were hidden for the children of the last days Why hidden? To prepare that generation for the oncoming battle against the Archon Rev 9 and 13 My copy of the Nag Hammadi - 'The Nag Hammadi Library, Harper San Francisco. 1988. Paperback – 1988 by James M. Robinson (Author)' When I am at - www.gnosis.org/naghamm/nhlalpha.htmlI always choose the CGLP translations, because they are the versions in my copy The Coptic Gnostic Library Project (CGLP) was funded by UNESCO, the National The leather-bound codices found at Nag Hammadi in 1945 ... Endowment for the Humanities, and other Institutions.5- other stuff that gets thrown in - always be on guard I use authorship first - if God said it - OK Then Christ and Holy Spirit -- again I cannot separate the three Because God spoke through both Even during separation - Christ on the Cross - God led them alone What ever they said is the next best witness - or same as Prophets that God obviously spoke to and through Then there are those people who knew these people - walked with these people - the maternal brother of Jesus - the people that Jesus spoke to in private However - have you ever heard of the documentary - Caesar's Messiah? Obvious plating of false scriptural themes by Rome So not only to you have to be on guard for mythology - you have to watch for deceiving themes My Ministry I am a believer - I see Christ in everything because all things are related So as I read things and then pray about them - meditate on them - I hope for guidance Not from Bozo the clown - modern visual media - or any charismatic human leader But guidance from the ultimate teacher Example - even as you read Thomas and Phillip and even Peter that I have presented - we all see the truth in what they say When the Gospel of Judas was found - I quickly bought a very nice copy I have tried to read it over and over - but GAG - I read 3 pages and want to toss it out In statistical speak - it is not consistent with the mean - it is an outlier - way out there Being so very disenchanted with corporate Christendom - my studies expanded
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Post by Robert T on Sept 13, 2019 11:15:22 GMT -5
Thank you Dave for Gnosis.org website. First I note it is more or less run along Catholic culture?? Why sacred services on Sunday, rather than Saturday, the sacred Ceasing-Day in the Hebrew Bible?
Quote: "The Ethiopian Church and the Sabbath.—Until rather recent years the Coptic Church of Ethiopia observed the seventh-day Sabbath. The Ethiopians also kept Sunday, the first day of the week, throughout their history as a Christian people. These days were marked by special services in the churches. The observance of the seventh-day Sabbath has, however, virtually ceased in modern Ethiopia"
I note that perhaps the Coptic writings have been hijacked by the Catholic teachings, like everything else?
I like the advice you give to pick and choose where to read and what to read.
What are your thoughts on the Sabbath and it's purpose? For example its Ceasing-Day as I write. so Shalom Shabbath my friend, may the special day bring you thee peace Jesus wants to give us. Most people ignore Creation and say all things were created in six days, but forget the special creation of "time" itself. Sabbath is a special clock built into our DNA for a reason, so we spend time with GOD and our fellow man.
It's going to take quite a while to read these books, but I like your advice and will read them as you suggest.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Sept 14, 2019 12:45:08 GMT -5
I note that perhaps the Coptic writings have been hijacked by the Catholic teachings, like everything else? What are your thoughts on the Sabbath and it's purpose? Hijacked by Catholic teaching - Rome has been such an absolute authority on thought policing - it is hard to escape out of our own heritage.Also - if you watch the videos on the Gnostic web-site - you will hear some pretty outrageous stuff. Gnosticism can lead you down a wrong - very wrong - path, if you do not approach it from a Christ centered perspective. The ahl was edited as to what is and what isn't scripture The agl was edited as to what Rome considered scripture or not Gnostic literature is a collection of the rest - without edit A lot of Gnostic literature is NOT scripture but commentary A lot of Gnostic literature has nothing to do with the ahl or agl Free Will - and Gnosticism Here is the refreshing thing about Gnosticism - you are free to express yourself Isn't it nice to be appreciated for comments like - provider sustainer Rather than have some loud voice of Doctrinal Correctness saying your wrong Sabbath = Communion = do this in remembrance -Keep it (therefore yourself) holyMy family has a Friday night meal - with a family communion We choose Friday - to obey the call of the Lord Sunday - is a paganization of the religion - have you read the decree? To un-Jew the Christian. Sun - day is a pagan worship day - Rome did it to fill the seats. Sometime we attend Sunday Church seeking fellowship and I do it to keep my children in a Sunday School program - just so they have a Judeo-Christian heritage. My girls are nice and polite - then we discuss what ever they learned at home. We don't do this because it is the Sabbath - we just do it to seek Fellowship - like we do on any day of the week. The older I get - the more Messianic Jewish I become Paul's sabbath - IMO - there are 5 Gospels - Mathew, Mark, Luke, John, and the Revelation of Jesus Christ through John Then, there is the CONFUSION of Paul Paul single handedly canceled the Torah with his 'new covenant' I have translated from the four Gospels and it is all pretty straight forward. Paul was a lawyer and wrote like a lawyer and even you just asked - what did Paul mean? Acts of Peter and James reprimanded Paul for his teaching against circumcision. Paul gave us the 'New Covenant' - yet he was a practicing Nazarite? Heb 4:9-11 Paul indicates that the Lord's 7th day of rest continues Still going on - along side of our 365 day, years, and centuries (Time from man's perspective - linear -- Time from God's perspective - different scale) If we forget the 24 hr day idea - and adopt a more non-linear perspective of time aeon = Greek = time period - just like circa 1920 = in the aeon of the 1920s From this argument we get - I can any day that fits my schedule as my Sabbath The 7th day is eternity - a never ending day Actually - Paul's version = Sacred geometryThe Star of Solomon = a Pentagon The Star of Israel / David = a Hexagon - a six pointed star the six days of creation via sacred geometry = as the six days (represented by David's hexagon) - the Seventh Day is automatically formed without any additional effort. Each day is in full communion with the 7th day - yet - alone - separate (again this theme) Jesus kept a Jewish Friday Sabbath All of the disciples were practicing Jews The Law of Moses says - do this -- it doesn't say do it until the Messiah comes So - on Fridays we do our best to have a family meal and we remember our Creator Sometimes we discuss the crap we learned in Sunday School Family discussion are so important for the kids What did Richard say - grown men sitting around discussing the Holy SpiritNo Work on the SabbathConfusing - full of commentary by men - Jesus did stuff on the Sabbath - even healed on the Sabbath All Ok - because it was the Lord's work Even for Aaron - it was proper to preach on the Sabbath I worked every weekend for 13 years - having my Sabbath meal before I went to work. Did I sin? I am a father, I live in the pagan American economic system. Jesus said - He will send us out as Sheep among the wolves. If we go to a pagan house to preach the Word - don't be offended by their culture - all food is clean to eat. What is my witness - if I am not a functional American? I would, and have, justified it for myself - because I work in medicine I grew up in Shipshewana, Indiana. Tourist come there to see the Amish. 1/2 of my family is a Yoder. There is not a God fearing Amish-man or woman that will work on Sunday. Yet, if you go to their farmhouse they will sell you produce or weld your bumper for cash. I have done both. I have a catalog here that I used in Adult Sunday School. The book is filled with devices for the Orthodox Jew. Step on a pedal and a mechanical arm will answer the phone for you - - is my favorite. Orthodox Jews in Israel today, try to shut down highways and Shopping Malls. No work on the Sabbath = I cannot make my own breakfast = NO!No work on the Sabbath = I cannot open my store and FOCUS on business (or anything other than the Creator)
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