Is 1 (Ethiopic Apocalypse of) Enoch Authentic?

[Seeker of the Truth]

Shalaamu everyone,
    Could the book of 1 (Ethiopic Apocalypse of) Enoch be authentic? Could it really have been written by Enoch, the 7th from Adam, who walked with God; and he was no more, for Elohim took him (ברשית Genesis 5:21-24)? The ُالقُرْآن ʔAl-Qurʔān(u) (the Quran) mentions one إِدْرِيس ʔIdrīs (Idrees), who had prophetic status, and his story is mentioned in there, thus:

وأذكر فى الكتـب إدريس إنه كان صد يقانبيا ورفعنه مكانا عليا "And mention in the Book, Idrees. Indeed, he was a man of truth and a prophet. And we raised him to a high position."

-- َسُورَةُ مَرْيَم Sūra(tu) Maryam(a) verses 56-57 (القُرْآنُ ʔAl-Qurʔān(u) 19:56-57; English from the Sahih International Version)

    Islamic genealogies say that إِدْرِيس Idrees (or Idris) was the son of Yarid (Jared), father of Matusalikh (Methushelah) and great-grandfather of نُوخ Nūḫ (Noah) son of لَمْك Lamk (Lamech), thereby unmistakably making Idrees the same as Enoch. The reference to the fact he was raised up (رفع) to a high position (علي, derived from the same Semitic root as Hebrew עלה "to ascend"), he definitely corresponds to Enoch. Therefore, when was he given prophethood? Jude (or Judas) the brother of James and יהושע Yahushu/Jesus (Matthew 13:25 & Jude 1) also calls him a prophet in his letter, even containing a quote of his (Jude 14-15).

    Was this quote derived from a Book written by Enoch himself? The Christians of Abyssinia (Ethiopia) say yes. In their canon of the Old Testament, they have a Book attributed to this same Enoch of Genesis 5:21-24, Jude 14-15 and Idrees (or Idris) of القُرْآنُ ʔAl-Qurʔān(u) 19:56-57. It is called by the scholarly community 1 Enoch (also called Ethiopic Apocalypse of Enoch) to differentiate it from 2 Enoch (Secrets or the Slavonic Apocalypse of Enoch) and 3 Enoch (or the Hebrew Apocalypse of Enoch). The Abyssinian church have ground to stand on, for fragments of an Aramaic version of 1 ("Ethiopic" Apocalypse of) Enoch in the Dead Sea Scrolls. So it is most definitely old. In fact, a couple centuries older than 3 Enoch, also called the Hebrew Apocalypse of Enoch, and almost 1,000 years older than the oldest copy of 2 Enoch or the Slavonic Apocalypse of Enoch.

    The quote of Jude 14-15 and 1 Enoch 1:9 are so identical that it must be said that one drew from the other. Since 1 Enoch predates Jude at least by a hundred years (having been found in the DSS), it may be safe to say that Jude drew from Enoch. If Jude (-as) really was the brother of James, therefore a half-brother of Yahushu, wouldn't it be safe to say that 1 Enoch is authentic since he quoted from it has the Truth? Anyway, here's the comparison of the verses:

1 Enoch 1:9 (Charles Version)	Jude 14-15 (ISR Version)
And behold! He cometh with ten thousands of His holy ones To execute judgment upon all, And to destroy all the ungodly: And to convict all flesh Of all the works of their ungodliness which they have ungodly com- mitted, And of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.	See, יהוה comes with His myriads  to execute judgment on all, to punish all who are wicked among them concerning all their wicked works which they have com- mitted in a wicked way, and concerning all the harsh words  which wicked sinners have spoken against Him.

It seems very obvious that Jude quoted directly from the Book of Enoch (1 Enoch, "Ethiopic" Apocalypse of Enoch). What are your thoughts?

Blessings to y'all in your studies.
Shalaamu

-- Seitz (הלתואם Hal-Tawʔam)

[Dave]

In my own witness - it was the Book of Enoch that gave new life to my walk toward the Lord.

Let me first establish my view of ancient text - I am not a linguist

When Paul wrote that all writings were valuable for instruction - he could not have been referring to Rome's 'one book' - it was completed for another 1500 + years after Paul. Paul also wrote - test it all and keep the good. Scripture also tells me that God's handiwork is on full display in nature just waiting for us to discover Him there, and everywhere we look. Remember - my audience is the science says there is no God group.

For example - Einstein said, time is relative dependent upon the perspective of the viewer - Peter says - a is as a 1000 yrs, and a 100 yrs is as a day, onto the Lord. Which validates which?

Physics tells us that we exist in a duality between thing and non-thing
In fact, physics tells us that thew things is base upon and supported by the non-thing
and at the begging of it all it happened by an "unexplained mechanism"

But in every scientific way to describe this beginning it always comes out that everything we know began as

A single point singularity that had to include all of the E of the entire universe before it - expanded - and then became 3D
add a galactic consciousness to the equation and that singularity was not only omnipotent , but also omniscient
and if science isn't talking about the Judeo-Christian Creator - then they just don'y knot the bulk of scripture

Enoch also declares that time is non-linear
Enoch also describes or 10-dimension reality as well as 10-dimensional science theory

My science doesn't conflict with Enoch - Enoch doesn't conflict with my science

Do I think / feel / believe that Enoch is inspired or special in some significant way?

I have no idea - nor do I care - this is what I do know: If this is Enoch's word's that survived the Flood that would truely be amazing - but regardless - this text is at least 350 BC. This qualify as an ancient text - period! How do this most ancient text by any estimation nail the science so well in abstract concepts?

As a science major - all the data must be considered, and then considered again weighted by the correlative quality of that data - what is the central them of that data. In this case Enoch fits not only my science, but my scripture as well

PS - I have no idea if the Epistle to Philemon was inspired or not - or if it was even written by Paul

1 Thessalonians 5:21 (CLB) ... examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good

Scripture says:

1 John 2:27 (NKJV) But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.

John 14:26 (NKJV) But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.

John 16:13 (NKJV) However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.

[Seeker of the Truth]

May 6, 2015 4:07:21 GMT -5 Dave said:

Let me first establish my view of ancient text - I am not a linguist

In fact, we are exact opposites, because I am NOT someone who studies science much. The only science I study is phonology (I think that is science; if not, then you know that I have very little I can offer on scientific research!). 



Blessings.

[Richard]

Personally, I think this is what makes this forum exciting.

Hi there, Seeker of Truth

Welcome - tell us why you accept the writings of Enoch

I find them fascinating because they are written for the last days and finally they are getting serious attention. Especially, as the text hints at (if it doesn't come right out and say it) but it hint at the personage of Jesus Christ

I haven't studied the text closely, but whrn I finally did give it a read, I wasn't as surprised as I imagined.

[Dave]

May 5, 2015 15:58:46 GMT -5 Seeker of the Truth said:

Shalaamu everyone,

    The quote of Jude 14-15 and 1 Enoch 1:9 are so identical that it must be said that one drew from the other. Since 1 Enoch predates Jude at least by a hundred years (having been found in the DSS), it may be safe to say that Jude drew from Enoch. If Jude (-as) really was the brother of James, therefore a half-brother of Yahushu, wouldn't it be safe to say that 1 Enoch is authentic since he quoted from it has the Truth? Anyway, here's the comparison of the verses:

-- Seitz (הלתואם Hal-Tawʔam)

Does a word for word quote validate all of the writing attributed to Enoch -- my answer = NO

This is why - thing are quoted "out of context" all the time - especially in a document from so long ago

The quote in Jude may be from another text that referred to a text that talked about Enoch. Like I am not quoting the Declaration of Independence directly if I quote the words of someone else's commentary who in turn quotes the original. So does one word for word validate the entire document - NO

However, if Jude is validated as inspired script - then also is that one phrase from Enoch -- So, 1 point for Enoch

As I have pointed out - how much I think Enoch agrees in concept with modern science - how did ancient man (if from before the flood or not) know this? So, another point for Enoch.

Enoch agrees much with the writings from the Zohar and several other non-scriptural Jewish text - So, at least we know that all had the same cosmomology - another point for Enoch

Enoch does suggest that a Messiah will come - another point for Enoch - there is a big point for me

To answer the particular question - does this one verse validate - NO, but it is just another of many factors that cause me to stop and consider the cosmology from Enoch.


One the surface - I agree with you - but why make it so complicated?

The book of Jasher is mentioned by name in the OT - why isn't Jasher considered scripture?