Perhaps we can start again.

[Richard]

A little harsh my brother. If we are starting again we should let Robert speak for himself. Most of what he used to argue was just to argue. It is hard to grasp what he believes until he tells us honestly. He is still searching. Don't make it hard for him.

[rob]

Greetings Gentlemen, so many comments, where do I begin?

Overwhelming to say the least. I watched the two videos, very nice presentations on faith.

Greetings Richard

Richard says " Scripture makes it perfectly clear, belief in the truth is not an intellectual exercise. It is an action of the heart.

Rob asks "What do you mean by "Faith is an action of the heart, and not a belief concept?

Richard says "What you believe with your heart influences what your head is able to understand. No one here or anywhere will ever say the right word or words that will instill belief within your heart, because we can only speak to your head. Only God can speak to your heart.

Rob replies " I do not understand what you mean by "believing with your heart"? Can you provide a daily example of how your faith works please?

Richard says: " Please, stop and consider that you have been taught so many head reasons to reject the truth. God cannot speak to you, if your do not let him. How can the Holy Spirit comfort your spirit, if you doubt it is even possible?

Rob replies: "My understanding is , we reason together with God within our minds, where GOD also reasons with us within the conscience. The still small voice of God within the conscience speaks impressions to us. Is this not listening to God, within the heart? Is this not some idiom, for the communication process via the HS via the conscience of our mind, also referenced as the heart? God speaks to me often in this way.


Greetings Dave

Dave says "Here re the 49 uses of the H530 – where do you get your support idea?

Rob replies" I agree Dave, my use of H530 is my own, does NOT mean the other translators are correct. It gets back to the premise, how does anyone evaluate the meaning of a Hebrew word, using sola Scriptoria alone? What is the process, that Scripture teaches?

Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

This chapter teaches us that we must look at all the verses for a single command that fits all the verses of context.

The first video suggested that Moses had his hands in the air as an act of faith, and that Aaron and Hur with firmly making Moses act of faith so. I see this as a possible statement, but also I see another statement. Moses and Hur were supporting Moses arms. Pure and simple. Faith means supporting something.

Other verses verify my understanding is correct, not just an act of firmness, steadfastness.

Some say faith comes from the word eman, meaning craftsman. Hmm? I beg to differ. 

www.ancient-hebrew.org/definition/faith.htm

Jeff Benner speaks of Faith as "The Hebrew word for faith is אמונה (emunah - Strong's #530) and is an action oriented word meaning "support".

I agree with Jeff on this, as a result of my own studies, as well.

The root word for amanah ( I pronounce the word as Arr-man-Hey ) is man, the Hebrew word for the bread that fell from heaven, in Greek it is the word manna.

Jeff Benner does not seem to speak of this idea? Not sure why?

Perhaps we should watch a video on how Hebrew meanings are obtained using the Hebrew torah only, not scholars, not a dictionary, not anything, except what God wrote through men.


Dave says " It is not what you say – it is who you are

Rob replies " Please explain what you mean by this, you say faith is a belief concept.
The videos presented faith as something you see in your actions. So please explain how your view fits into the videos you presented.

Dave says " There is nothing new here that Robert has not heard from this ministry before, but there is so much scripture Robert is on the record NOT BELIEVING that faith has become a religious practice - a thing to do - difficult to understand - something he just doesn't get

Rob replies " I cannot reply until I truly understand what you mean by your view of faith, I will never misapply your view, but you simply have not explained what you mean.

Please provide daily examples of your faith. I will not make my comments until I fully understand what you mean by your views of faith. Please explain.

I am also interested in how your faith view, has actions of faith, so others see you are a true Christian in love with Jesus.

You can read my views in greater detail anytime you want, on my website. Sure I might be unique in my understanding, but I believe it to be true.

Greetings Dillon

Dillon says "Robert has made it clear that he rejects scriptural teaching in favor of Ellen White. No wonder he cannot understand what it means to have faith. His faith is in Ellen White not the word of God.

Rob replies" My friend, the word "faith" in Scripture is a power from God, not from humans, or prophets, or angels. Sure you can have "faith in people" in a secular manner, you are supporting their ideas. Maybe.

My understanding of Faith, is when you support God's word, His powers from when you seek that flow embedded in the words. And from that flow of God, comes actions, the fruits of faith. Not your works, but His works completed in you, because you asked God to do so.
That is my understanding of faith in daily life. It is not a ritual, you fight the good fight of faith. Why is it a fight? Because you have to continually ask for power by speaking the words of God as you need them. If I do not ask, that flow of God does not come, because God respects my free will. And so I miss daily in forgetting to ask of Him, to take His words and return to Him. Often I rise in self-exaltation and miss the speaking of His words. Scripture terms this "chata" or missing.

If faith is simply who you are? Does this mean you just do nothing all day with God and His awesome powers? How does God function with you Dillon from day to day?

You mention Ellen White, yes Ellen White agrees with me perhaps, that faith means to support. She is the only one to write about Exodus 17:12 correctly, yet she also writes other things using King James translations. I do not reject Scripture understanding of faith. Have you read my own study?

Now gentlemen, I simply want from all of you, your own views of faith and how that view functions with you and your God in daily life.

A simple request, and once I understand your view correctly, than shall we compare your view with Scripture.

The other doctrines do not matter really, because without faith it is impossible to please God, so this is a big theme.

Shalom

[Dave]

Richard says: " Please, stop and consider that you have been taught so many head reasons to reject the truth. God cannot speak to you, if your do not let him. How can the Holy Spirit comfort your spirit, if you doubt it is even possible?

Rob replies: "My understanding is , we reason together with God within our minds, where GOD also reasons with us within the conscience.

The truth is the truth – not something you reason with, you either accept the truth, or you argue about it. Stop trying to rewrite scripture to fit your own view, your view should be scriptural
---------------------

Rob replies" I agree Dave, my use of H530 is my own,

Jeff Benner speaks of Faith as "The Hebrew word for faith is אמונה (emunah - Strong's #530) and is an action oriented word meaning "support".

I agree with Jeff on this, as a result of my own studies, as well.

Your entire concept comes from the article written by Jeff Brenner. Too bad you do not understand his point.
------------------------------------

does NOT mean the other translators are correct.

There you go – the whole world and the entire history of Judeo-Christianity is error according to you
Your denial of scripture is obvious – all translations are incorrect except your own version
------------------------

It gets back to the premise, how does anyone evaluate the meaning of a Hebrew word, using sola Scriptoria alone? What is the process, that Scripture teaches?

Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

This chapter teaches us that we must look at all the verses for a single command that fits all the verses of context.

It is not about a single word – it is about the singular message
-----------------------------------------------------

Dave says " It is not what you say – it is who you are

Rob replies " Please explain what you mean by this, you say faith is a belief concept.

If you believe that Jesus Christ is real and standing next to you – it forces a change in behavior

If you truly believe scripture and understand what God has done for you – you will want to please God – you will want to honor God – you will confess the truth of scripture – not rewriting it to fit your own version
---------------------------

Dave says " There is nothing new here that Robert has not heard from this ministry before, but there is so much scripture Robert is on the record NOT BELIEVING that faith has become a religious practice - a thing to do - difficult to understand - something he just doesn't get

Rob replies " I cannot reply until I truly understand what you mean by your view of faith,

You do not want to understand – you want to make faith complicated

I am also interested in how your faith view, has actions of faith, so others see you are a true Christian in love with Jesus.

What do you do each morning to prove to yourself that you are Australian?

By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth 



May the words I say
And the things I do
Make my lifesong sing
Bring a smile to You

Let my lifesong sing to You

I wanna sign Your name
To the end of this day
Knowing that my heart was true
Let my lifesong sing to You

Lord, I give my life
A living sacrifice
To reach a world in need
To be Your hands and feet
So, may the words I say
And the things I do
Make my lifesong sing
Bring a smile to You

Once you stand as a Christian - your witness is on full display and you will be judged for it.

Do we all have to look and speak as Rabbi Friedman - or Chuck Missler - or saint somebody - NO
You will always be you - we are each judged singularly - alone - your witness is on
Your witness is loud and clear - you doubt the word of God because you do not believe scripture is real

You witness against the truth of only one true God - there is no other
You witness that Jesus Christ could not be God - therefore a different God or not God
You witness against the spirit

Your witness is on full display and you will be judged for it.
-----------------------------------

Dillon says "Robert has made it clear that he rejects scriptural teaching in favor of Ellen White. No wonder he cannot understand what it means to have faith. His faith is in Ellen White not the word of God.

Yes - I agree with what D says here. We have discussed many topics here once before - You do not accept scripture as the truth- if you do not believe in the truth then you are supporting a lie

If faith is simply who you are? Does this mean you just do nothing all day with God and His awesome powers? How does God function with you Dillon from day to day?

What do you do each morning to prove to yourself that you are Australian?

Repeat - if you believe - it forces a change in behaviour 

The other doctrines do not matter really, because without faith it is impossible to please God, so this is a big theme.

Correct - without faith in the word of God - as the truth - if you do not believe it to be real and alive - you will not please God
All doctrines are important because it is the word of God – either you support the word of God or you don’t – your choice

[Dave]

Why Religion Is Bad For You

Spiritual Jews understand Christianity better than Christendom

Its not about you - it is all about Him

Be Jewish / Christian - Not Religious

[rob]

Greetings Dave

Where are your friends, who I invite to reply to my questions as well?

I categorize your posts into sections as you posted them.


-----1------
Rob replies: "My understanding is , we reason together with God within our minds, where GOD also reasons with us within the conscience.

Dave replies" The truth is the truth – not something you reason with, you either accept the truth, or you argue about it. Stop trying to rewrite scripture to fit your own view, your view should be scriptural


Rob asks Dave" If truth is so easy to obtain, why is truth so difficult to fathom from Scripture?

Mt 13:10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

These Scriptures as well as others tell us that "truth" is hidden, locked away, and unless you ask of God, God will not reveal "truth" to you.

-----2--------
Rob: "I agree with Jeff Benner on this, as a result of my own studies, as well.

Dave replies" Your entire concept comes from the article written by Jeff Brenner. Too bad you do not understand his point.
Rob asks Dave" you did not read my words, "as a result of my own studies"

------3--------

Rob" does NOT mean the other translators are correct.

Dave" There you go – the whole world and the entire history of Judeo-Christianity is error according to you
Your denial of scripture is obvious – all translations are incorrect except your own version


Rob replies: "

Mt 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
15 ¶ Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Truth is difficult to find in Scripture, and Scripture tells us many do not find truth.

Scripture also says

Php 2:12 ¶ Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

God will reveal truth to you, if you ask in faith, and speak to the HS who leads us to all truth.

Jeff Benner translation of Exodus 17:12, sadly uses the word "firm"

and {the} hands {of} “Mosheh Plucked out” {were}
heavy, and they took {a} stone and they
placed {it} \underneath/ him, and he settled
upon her, and “Aharon Light bringer” and “Hhur Cistern” upheld his hands, from this (one) and
from (that) (one)*, and his hands (were) firm
until {the} coming† {of} the sun,†

At least this is ONE possible meaning that fits this context.

The meaning of "BELIEF" will not fit, will it Dave?

To see if "FIRM" fits all the contexts, we simply go to another context.


Mt 8:8 The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.
10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
Now in this passage, what "FIRMNESS" does the centurion speak about? None I see.

I see more the context the soldiers under him supporting the centurion, by obeying his commands.

In other words the words of the centurion have power, and things get done on his word.


----------4----------
Rob" This chapter teaches us that we must look at all the verses for a single command that fits all the verses of context.

Dave" It is not about a single word – it is about the singular message


Rob replies" You speak so briefly again? So you agree every context of using this word has to fit every context? Good . Thanks for your confirmation of the process of finding "truth" .

Sentences of truth come from words of truth, and words of truth come from letters of truth.

The root word MN, means the "flow over the nations". An example of this was manna, the food from heaven that biologically supports the cells of your body.

AMNH, is the word faith, and means "The strong flow over the nations from the DIVINE PERSON, of GOD."

Again, if you claim faith, the strong flow of power from GOD, supports you and the request you seek.

For example, if I ask Lord keep my eye single, there is an immediate flow of power to prevent my eye seeing "eye-candy" and falling from His grace.

For example, if I speak Lord, control my words, place your words on my mouth, there is an immediate flow of God's words so others hear the correct words they need to hear.

For example, if I don't speak "deliver me from things dysfunctional" I will eat what my stomach desires, and so in my missing to claim his faith powers, I sin and eat fatty foods, or other foods not functional to me.

----------5-----------
Rob replies " Please explain what you mean by this, you say faith is a belief concept.

Dave" If you believe that Jesus Christ is real and standing next to you – it forces a change in behavior
If you truly believe scripture and understand what God has done for you – you will want to please God – you will want to honor God – you will confess the truth of scripture – not rewriting it to fit your own version
Rob replies" The disciples had Jesus standing next to them for 3 years, did this cause a change in their behaviour? No not really...They still had pride, still did sins, and still showed a lack of faith.

DAVE" If you truly believe scripture and understand what God has done for you
Rob" so to you faith is some sort of mental assent?

DAVE: "you will want to please God – you will want to honor God – you will confess the truth of scripture
ROb "so this flow of honour and praise and speaking the truth, comes from your own human powers I take it?

For example, if I speak Lord, control my words, place your words on my mouth, there is an immediate flow of God's words so others hear the correct words they need to hear.

So we both agree "works are the fruits of faith", but for you after doing this "mental assent", you begin to speak truth and honor God, in your own human strength?

In my view, the works flow from the faith I seek from GOD. There is no flow of human works, no flow of human strength. It is always wholly God, I am merely a partner, a vessel, A jar of clay in which this flow occurs in, and all glory and honor is God's.

-------------6---------

Rob replies " I cannot reply until I truly understand what you mean by your view of faith,

Dave" You do not want to understand – you want to make faith complicated
Rob summaries Dave's view" So you see Faith as a "mental assent concept" in which by cognitive processes alone, your mind is fully convinced of God, that you seek to do His commands, and speak his truth, fully in your own human powers.

What does Scripture speak of this ?

Ga 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ,
Ga 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works,

Rob asks" If we are created in Jesus to do good works, how do we do them ?

Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Our works of Jesus come when we have faith in Jesus, so that Jesus performs them in us, when in faith, we seek Jesus to perform those works, when we request them through us.

Rob says, is this process so complicated that you cannot understand it Dave?

---------7---------
Dave speaks " By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth


Rob" wow Dave, how do you do all these things? through human powers alone, or through communion with Jesus powers?

Dave writes " Your witness is loud and clear - you doubt the word of God because you do not believe scripture is real
Rob" In contrast Dave, I seek the "truth" from Scripture and live according to the claims of the word. I have both Jeff Benner and Ellen White to verify the claims of Hebrew is correct, and listening to God speak to me, I bear witness to His truth. Surely truth can be found and dug from the torah?

You wander off the topic at hand, instead of mocking things you do not understand, speak and witness to what I ask. What is Faith Dave, and how does Faith work in your daily life.

---------------8------------
DAVE writes"
What do you do each morning to prove to yourself that you are Australian?

Repeat - if you believe - it forces a change in behaviour


Rob replies " When you accept Jesus as LORD of your life, you are not create a BRAND NEW person , but RENEWED daily by Jesus, as your will freely wishes for this process of growing in Jesus.

2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new

Look at the Greek words in this translation

The word here is "kainos", and if you look up all the contexts

Mt 9:17 Neither <oude> do men put <ballo> new <neos> wine <oinos> into <eis> old <palaios> bottles <askos>: else <ei de me(ge)> the bottles <askos> break <rhegnumi>, and <kai> the wine <oinos> runneth out <ekcheo>, and <kai> the bottles <askos> perish <apollumi>: but <alla> they put <ballo> new <neos> wine <oinos> into <eis> new <kainos> bottles <askos>, and <kai> both <amphoteros> are preserved <suntereo>.

Notice here both Greek words "NEOS" and "KAINOS" are used, with totally different meanings.

When you become a light for Jesus, that light is not brand new, but renewed every morning by the SON of light, poured into you.

Plants grow every morning basking in the SON of power, and grow renewing their bodies every morning under this power.

DAVE writes" Repeat - if you believe - it forces a change in behaviour


ROB replies Hmm? Take Peter fearful in the boat as a fisherman in a terrible storm, and says to Jesus

Mt 14:28 And Peter answered him and said, Lord, if it be thou, bid me come unto thee on the water.
29 And he said, Come.
Peter was with Jesus, but this act is more about Faith, than "mental assent".

Why did Peter begin to sink in the sea? A lack of faith? Doubt?

The Greek is poorly translated. Peter broke faith with Jesus. His faith was there, Peter did not doubt Jesus could do what He claimed could do, but Peter broke off His faith. He stopped supporting Jesus and His word.

James explains

Jas 1:6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
Jas 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
Peter's mind was double minded, he had his own powers as a strong fisherman, and he had the powers of Jesus via faith. Peter broke faith. Peter did not doubt in Jesus words of Jesus ability.

DAVE writes" Repeat - if you believe - it forces a change in behaviour
Rob replies " So you have this obstacle, one has to believe first before the change of behaviour?
Scripture does not bear this out.

Mt 9:28 And when he was come into the house, the blind men came to him: and Jesus saith unto them, Believe ye that I am able to do this? They said unto him, Yea, Lord.
29 Then touched he their eyes, saying, According to your faith be it unto you.
The blind men knew of the torah that spoke of this promise

Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

How much did these blind men KNOW of this MESSIAH? But they did hear of this torah promise, as Levi read the words during the reading of the torah. That is all they really knew.

Jesus asked them, do you support the idea I can do as you truly support the words in this torah promise to do? And they said to Jesus, we do.

So the promised flow of power to make the blind see, flowed as the blind men requested.

---------9----------
Dave asks me to watch a video

As a grandfather, you have to eat kosher candy
I don't need any of that...why do I need to...
If I was religious, I would say, if have to
Now I am bullying him,
religion bully's you, it used to work, it's not working
not only religion, society
You have to go to school, get good grades, get a house, pay the mortgage
People say today, guy suing his parents for giving birth to him without his consent
Now I have to pay the mortgage?
You made me so you pay for me.
Both parents are lawyers, so they through the case out. Funny
I didn't ask to be born...
Parents panic so put the kid on medicine.
Neither did I ask to be born.
Because we are not born
Parents say you have to, get a job, grow up
Things you don't have, you have to have.
Commercials tell you what you need.
Religion does not give you comfort.
Piles on, more needs
Judaism says, God created heaven and earth.
What a relief.
Relax, you don't have a problem.
God created a world that does not co-operate.
A child who says I didn't ask to be born, agree with him
Creator has a need, we don't.
All needs we do have are not ours.
Why do I eat, I don't know, not my idea.
God needs me to eat.
We simply need to fit in.
God has valid needs.
The Fullment of His needs depend upon us.
God depends on you to get things done
We have no problems.
Not my needs.
Makes our burdens so much lighter
You can fulfil his Need, not your needs.
Religions start wars.
Serve God with joy.
If trying to be religious there will be no joy.
If your religious you are serious, border line depressed
Anybody happy, you must have sinned.
Serve Him, do what He needs, that is a pleasure.
Marriage couple, brilliant in their evil.
When we Relieve ourselves of these needs, others exist
God has needs, God is not there to serve you
Are you needy or rather be needed?
I did not ask to be born, but am born
If I didn't need this, who does?
Somebody needs me.
Get Godly.

Rob replies" That was brilliant, so funny and serious and extremely well done.

So why do plants have to drink water and receive sunshine and breath in air?

Because God made them they way, because God is needy and require His Creation to respond to His needs to be a provider of love and the plants a responder to that love.

A plant that does not respond, dies.
A plant that responds joyfully to God's love, lives.

It is not a religious ritual, but simply being what you were created for.
We grow as the tree by the river grows. We are created to bask in his love and to respond to that love. Because we have free will, God does not impose Himself upon us, unless we ask Him to come into our lives.
--------------------------------10--------------

youtu.be/kEcfwMNodbM

Listen to this 38 minute by Elder Randy Skeete

We owe God everything
He cares for us every moment
God keeps the machinery going every moment
God is the fountain of life
We are dependent upon God for life
We are dependent on God for everything
We cannot exist without the Sun, foundation of life.
Cut off the sun, we cease to exist.
Light is life. John 8:12
Functions of the sun, to divide the lights upon the earth.
All light the earth needs is not found on the earth.
Outside of itself.

Your source of life is not you, but me (GOD).

A life without God has no meaning.
Life only takes on meaning when you inhale me.
Look unto me, says God.
Principle of dependence, God has built into our rthymn.
Remember on Sabbath, I gave you things, providing for you.
Humble yourself before the Creator.
I can take it, because it is mine, including your health.
Weekly reminder. Principle of dependence goes everyday.
Look unto God every waking moment

Two choices, looking unto self.
Let's stop ignoring God.

Renew that spirit in everything I do
That principle of dependence
Even though Jesus was God in human flesh, He could do nothing without His Father

---------------conclusion------

If we are dependent upon God for everything, because God is needy, and wishes a response from us because of His love, how do we respond? What does faith look like? Faith must be both the request for GOD and a response to GOD.

Shalom

[Dave]

Rob replies: "My understanding is , we reason together with God within our minds, where GOD also reasons with us within the conscience.

Dave replies" The truth is the truth – not something you reason with, you either accept the truth, or you argue about it. Stop trying to rewrite scripture to fit your own view, your view should be scriptural

Rob asks Dave" If truth is so easy to obtain, why is truth so difficult to fathom from Scripture?

The discussion is belief in God as Creator and Savior
This truth is NOT hidden or difficult to obtain

Mt 13:10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?

These Scriptures as well as others tell us that "truth" is hidden, locked away, and unless you ask of God, God will not reveal "truth" to you.

Joh 3:16  “For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life. 

Rom 10:9  For if you confess with your mouth that Yeshua is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 
Rom 10:10  For with the heart it is believed for righteousness, and with the mouth it is confessed for salvation.

These verse are NOT parables – you are mocking scripture - your attempt to make faith complicated and difficult to obtain is rejected
--------------

Rob" does NOT mean the other translators are correct.

Dave" There you go – the whole world and the entire history of Judeo-Christianity is error according to you
Your denial of scripture is obvious – all translations are incorrect except your own version

Rob replies: Truth is difficult to find in Scripture, and Scripture tells us many do not find truth.

If you spend your time rejecting scripture I imagine the message is difficult

To see if "FIRM" fits all the contexts, we simply go to another context.

Mt 8:8 The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.
10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
Now in this passage, what "FIRMNESS" does the centurion speak about? None I see.

Why don’t you understand? It is very simple - Faith – belief in the truth that Jesus Christ is the Messiah held firmly without wavering –

---------------------
Rob replies " Please explain what you mean by this, you say faith is a belief concept.

Dave" If you believe that Jesus Christ is real and standing next to you – it forces a change in behavior
If you truly believe scripture and understand what God has done for you – you will want to please God – you will want to honor God – you will confess the truth of scripture – not rewriting it to fit your own version
Rob replies" The disciples had Jesus standing next to them for 3 years, did this cause a change in their behaviour? No not really...They still had pride, still did sins, and still showed a lack of faith.

So the disciples were not believers according to you – what a strange teaching you promote – if there was no change in their behaviour why did each disciplke die a martyr?

DAVE" If you truly believe scripture and understand what God has done for you
Rob" so to you faith is some sort of mental assent?

STOP putting words in my mouth or you will not be welcome here
------------------

Dave speaks " By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth

Rob" wow Dave, how do you do all these things? through human powers alone, or through communion with Jesus powers?

Your disrespect knows no bounds
-------------------

Dave asks me to watch a video

God has valid needs.
The Fullment of His needs depend upon us.
God depends on you to get things done
We have no problems.
Not my needs.
Makes our burdens so much lighter
You can fulfil his Need, not your needs.
Religions start wars.
Serve God with joy.
If trying to be religious there will be no joy.
If your religious you are serious, border line depressed
Anybody happy, you must have sinned.
Serve Him, do what He needs, that is a pleasure.
Marriage couple, brilliant in their evil.
When we Relieve ourselves of these needs, others exist
God has needs, God is not there to serve you
Are you needy or rather be needed?
I did not ask to be born, but am born
If I didn't need this, who does?
Somebody needs me.
Get Godly.

Rob replies" That was brilliant, so funny and serious and extremely well done.

Yet – you fail to understand his message - what religious practice does he mandate?

[rob]

Greetings Dave

Dave" The discussion is belief in God as Creator and Savior
This truth is NOT hidden or difficult to obtain

Rob " Belief in GOD as a Creator, you are correct. Not hidden or difficult to obtain.

Ro 1:19 ¶ Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

No man has no excuse for NOT knowing GOD. This truth is made known in simply studying Nature.

But you are off topic, the current topic is Faith.

Dave" Rom 10:9 For if you confess with your mouth that Yeshua is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart it is believed for righteousness, and with the mouth it is confessed for salvation.
These verse are NOT parables – you are mocking scripture - your attempt to make faith complicated and difficult to obtain is rejected


Rob" If what you say is true, why did so many of Israel fail to enter the promised land?
Only Calub and Joshua entered the promised land.

Notice how GOD Himself explains His salvation to Israel

De 30:11 ¶ For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.
12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

God's salvation is not hidden or hard to fathom, so why do most of us not fathom such salvation that is so easy to receive of GOD? And obviously NOT complicated.

Yet in Deutronomy, the word "faith" never appears? Why is that?

Yet Paul speaks of "faith" regarding the same verse, and the theme of salvation by faith.

Ro 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

SO if Israel was ignorant of God's salvation, why does Paul speak Israel sought to establish their own version of salvation?

And where in the Old Testament, does Scripture speak of faith and righteousness? Only one place.

Hab 2:4 Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

So again, why so little mention of such a vital theme ?

Hab 2:5 ¶ Yea also, because he transgresseth by wine, he is a proud man, neither keepeth at home, who enlargeth his desire as hell, and is as death, and cannot be satisfied, but gathereth unto him all nations, and heapeth unto him all people:
6 Shall not all these take up a parable against him, and a taunting proverb against him, and say, Woe to him that increaseth that which is not his!

And you say God does not speak in parables?

Dave" Why don’t you understand? It is very simple - Faith – belief in the truth that Jesus Christ is the Messiah held firmly without wavering –

Rob " if truth is so easy to explain, explain it again to me Dave? The soldiers under the Centurion, believe in His words and are firm with what exactly?

If the centurion says

"Go to the the house called straight and arrest a man called Saul and bring him to me alive".

What exactly in this sentence, has the concept of belief? Or firm? The soldier is simply supporting the Centurion, and His words, obeying the Centurion, and supporting Him and his words? The soldier may personally hate the superior as his boss, but nevertheless is willing to support him.

Where are there words of truth in this command of the Centurion? I see none, only a command to do something. The soldier does what is spoken because the soldier supports His superior and does what he is told to do.

You need to explain yourself better Dave, I do not see anything about the Centurion that involves truth or firmness in truth.

Or take the context of Aaron and Hur supporting the arms of Moses, held upwards towards God in the battle. What firmness of truth is in this context? None I see. The context is simply the idea of supporting Moses arms.

Dave" So the disciples were not believers according to you – what a strange teaching you promote – if there was no change in their behaviour why did each disciplke die a martyr?
Rob replies" You can support and army officer because of his office, and yet hate his character or values as a person. The disciples were chosen by Jesus to be their master tutor and Lord. But receiving the powers of faith is a daily matter, that happens hour by hour. Often over the 3 years the disciples did things in their own human powers, and sometimes they functioned using the powers of faith, as Jesus directed them. Developing a deeper faith takes time and a true understanding of the will of the mind to choose and remain firm to the decisions to support Jesus always. Such a process battles with pride and our carnal natures of self. Only in the future, did the disciples show deeper faith as martyrs as you post.

Faith is not an event, its a process, and you can learn to develop faith in Jesus, taking in deeper drafts of His power.

Dave" STOP putting words in my mouth or you will not be welcome here
Rob" you say faith is a belief concept, so this means to me some mental assent in the cognitive mind? If I am wrong in my assessment, explain yourself.

------------

Dave speaks " By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth

Rob" wow Dave, how do you do all these things? through human powers alone, or through communion with Jesus powers?

Dave replies again" Your disrespect knows no bounds


Rob" I am not disrespecting you Dave. I am trying to understand your views of faith and how faith works day to day in your life, but you do not explain your view to me?

Dave" Yet – you fail to understand his message - what religious practice does he mandate?


Rob" Maybe I missed the parables in the video, can you explain what my dull mind missed?

You did not watch my video of Elder Randy Skeete?

You say "" By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth" so my question to you is, how do you achieve these things you say? DO you do them using human powers? Or do you do them using the powers of Jesus working in you? I am not being disrespectful, I am simply asking you a question about faith and how faith works in your view.

---------------------
Here is a short 9 minute video, that is typical of what I call "mental assent".

The video is always depicting the head, looking up into the heavens, the head theme of belief.

youtu.be/yvhQxFIGCP4


DO you walk by sight or by faith ?

We walk by faith, not by sight.

We believe but we do not see. Once we see it, it's not faith anymore.

You have to make the choice.

One reason why we don't take the first step.

Be willing to listen to God and learn to trust him

Trusting when you don't understand.

Before you were ever born, God ponder plans for you.

Jer 29:11 For I know the plans I have for you.

You are not God, but He is.

God is in control of your life.

Abraham made mistakes but God still forgives.

Trust the Lord in all your ways, and He will direct your path.


Rob" Some of the presentation is good, but most is confusion.


SHalom

[Richard]

Mat 10:12  And as ye enter into the house, salute it. 
Mat 10:13  And if the house be worthy, let your peace come upon it: but if it be not worthy, let your peace return to you. 
Mat 10:14  And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, as ye go forth out of that house or that city, shake off the dust of your feet. 
Mat 10:15  Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment, than for that city. 

You asked for an opportunity to start over and I did respond.
You can choose to believe or not, it is entirely up to you.
Your disrespect for the word of God is insulting.
There is no value in arguing with you.

[Dave]

Dave" The discussion is belief in God as Creator and Savior
This truth is NOT hidden or difficult to obtain

Rob " Belief in GOD as a Creator, you are correct. Not hidden or difficult to obtain. No man has no excuse for NOT knowing GOD.

Please make up your mind – you just argued the opposite

Rob asks Dave" If truth is so easy to obtain, why is truth so difficult to fathom from Scripture?

Mt 13:10 -13 - These Scriptures as well as others tell us that "truth" is hidden, locked away

Proof that you are NOT serious – you will just say anything to be cantankerous – your respect for the word of God is obvious

This truth is made known in simply studying Nature.

WOW – what a change from last year – you argued that nothing of God perfect creation remains – your satan god changed it all and we live in a fallen world of satan's design

Please make up your mind – is reality proof of the Creator or your satan?

But you are off topic, the current topic is Faith.

Dave" Rom 10:9 For if you confess with your mouth that Yeshua is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart it is believed for righteousness, and with the mouth it is confessed for salvation.
These verse are NOT parables – you are mocking scripture - your attempt to make faith complicated and difficult to obtain is rejected

Rob" If what you say is true, why did so many of Israel fail to enter the promised land?

You seriously do not understand the difference between the OT and the NT? You should take the time to read scripture.

De 30:11 ¶ For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.
12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

God's salvation is not hidden or hard to fathom, so why do most of us not fathom such salvation that is so easy to receive of GOD? And obviously NOT complicated.

Because we are animals – we are a beast – and loving your fellow man as Christ loved us is difficult – so difficult that many people don’t even try. Do the Russians love the Ukrainians? Do the Ukrainians love Russians? You come here and attack Christianity with vigor – I have been patient – cared enough to engage you – yet your disrespect abounds.

You have admitted before that employers don’t appreciate you – was your Christian witness to them the same as Joseph? Or stubborn and cantankerous as you are here?

SO if Israel was ignorant of God's salvation, why does Paul speak Israel sought to establish their own version of salvation?

Beacause man is an animal – a beast – and desires instant gratification – desires something tangible

Exo 32:1  Now when the people saw that Moses delayed coming down from the mountain, they gathered around Aaron and said to him, “Get up, make us gods who will go before us. As for this Moses, the man that brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we do not know what’s become of him!” 

Rob " if truth is so easy to explain, explain it again to me Dave? The soldiers under the Centurion, believe in His words and are firm with what exactly?

Mat 8:7  Yeshua said to him, “I’ll come and heal him.” 
Mat 8:8  But the centurion said, “Master, I’m not worthy to have You come under my roof. But just say the word and my servant will be healed. 

What exactly in this sentence, has the concept of belief? Or firm?

Seriously – are you that ignorant

Where are there words of truth in this command of the Centurion?

Mat 8:8  ... But just say the word and my servant will be healed. 

You need to explain yourself better Dave, I do not see anything about the Centurion that involves truth or firmness in truth.

Then you need to learn to read English
Did the centurion require Jesus to come and perform some magic – did the centurion require Jesus to say a prayer – wave His hand – or even say a blessing – did the centurion have to see the miracle for himself – or did the he just trust – without doubt?

Dave" So the disciples were not believers according to you – what a strange teaching you promote – if there was no change in their behavior why did each disciple die a martyr?
Rob replies" You can support and army officer because of his office, and yet hate his character or values as a person.

Now you want to teach that the disciples hated Jesus, didn’t believe Jesus, doubted Jesus – then why did they forsake their current lives and livelihoods to follow Jesus?

Only in the future, did the disciples show deeper faith as martyrs as you post.

Of course faith grows – duh?

Dave" STOP putting words in my mouth or you will not be welcome here
Rob" you say faith is a belief concept, so this means to me some mental assent in the cognitive mind? If I am wrong in my assessment, explain yourself.

Psa 51:17  O Lord, open my lips, and my mouth will declare Your praise. 
Psa 51:18  For You would not delight in sacrifice, or I would give it, nor be pleased by burnt offerings. 
Psa 51:19  The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit. A broken and a contrite heart, O God, You will not despise. 

Rom 10:10  For with the heart it is believed for righteousness, and with the mouth it is confessed for salvation. 

What the heart knows to be true affects the way the head thinks – Not the other way around

------------

Dave speaks " By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth

Rob" wow Dave, how do you do all these things? through human powers alone, or through communion with Jesus powers?

Rob" I am not disrespecting you Dave. I am trying to understand your views of faith and how faith works day to day in your life, but you do not explain your view to me?

I shared Rabbi Friedman's video with you
Yet – you fail to understand his message - what religious practice does he mandate?

Rob" Maybe I missed the parables in the video, can you explain what my dull mind missed?

Watch it again - try to listen with an open mind

You say "" By being a Christ here on earth – witness the truth – defend the truth – defend scripture - confess the truth - supporting the truth" so my question to you is, how do you achieve these things you say? DO you do them using human powers?

Richard asked you once – Do you know the difference between right and wrong? You did not give him an answer.
In all situation do right – by God’s definition
How do you do that? Love your fellow man as Christ loved us. He cared enough for us to witness the truth – lived the truth – even when rejected.

Or do you do them using the powers of Jesus working in you?

What your heart knows to be true affects the way your head thinks
---------------------

Here is a short 9 minute video, that is typical of what I call "mental assent".
The video is always depicting the head, looking up into the heavens, the head theme of belief.
youtu.be/yvhQxFIGCP4

0:55 – We make decisions every day – those decisions determine who we are. It has nothing to do with your religious practice and everything to do with who you are – your Life Song

We believe but we do not see. Once we see it, it's not faith anymore.

2:04 – Once you see it – you have it in your heart – but you still have to trust God

This is the Gnostic message - Recognise what is in your sight

Many people say they would believe if they could just see a sign - but those of us that believe see signs around us every day

You have to make the choice.
One reason why we don't take the first step.
Be willing to listen to God and learn to trust him
Trusting when you don't understand.

It is hard to trust when you don’t understand why – when you cannot see God’s plan
Why did 6 million Jews have to die in the Holocaust? Did any of them understand the why? Just how many of them stopped being Jewish?

It is hard to trust if you cannot see the reason.

Before you were ever born, God ponder plans for you.
God established your purpose before you were born

Jer 1:5  “Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you, and before you were born, I set you apart—I appointed you prophet to the nations.” 

5:00 – He says God only has good plans for you – no disasters are planned for you by God

This is Catholic Feel Good religion – Not scriptural

Ask Job if this is true – Jobs hardship was necessary to teach the rest of us to trust in the Lord.
Ask the 6 million martyred Jews if this is true on a personal level.

Rom 8:28  Now we know that all things work together for good for those who love God, who are called according to His purpose. 
Rom 8:29  For those whom He foreknew He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters. 

God’s plan are for God’s good – to facilitate God’s Will on earth - NOT your good

Ask people in church if they would gladly serve the Lord – and everyone will say yes. But assign them the role of Job, Judas, or Jonah and see how many volunteers you get.

This Feel Good message you and the Catholic teach is harmful. So many people come to church looking for comfort – their marriage is in trouble, grandma has cancer, sweet innocent little Jimmy has cancer. They still get divorced, grandma still dies, even little Jimmy dies – what happened to the Feel Good message? It is proven false – church is proven teaching a false message – and people walk away from the church.

5:55 – we have to continue to believe and trust even if the worst happens

Feel Good Christians pray for world peace - is world peace the scriptural plan for earth before the Second Coming? I could argue that every prayer for world peace is a prayer against God's Plan - Catholic Feel Good Christianity is a false teaching

Jer 29:11 For I know the plans I have for you.

Does not matter if you can see that plan, understand that plan, or even like that plan

Abraham made mistakes but God still forgives.

Man is an animal – man is a beast – but our selfish choices cannot alter God’s Plan

Trust the Lord in all your ways, and He will direct your path.

Just a moment ago he spoke of predestination -
You can loose your way – But God will bring you back to the His Plan
The Prodigal Son – left home and entered the world – got caught up in the world – became worldly – but also came to realize / see the error of his ways – and returned to God

Rob" Some of the presentation is good, but most is confusion.

I don’t understand why you would think so – the message is trust in God – why don’t you understand this?

[Dillon]

Dillon says "Robert has made it clear that he rejects scriptural teaching in favor of Ellen White. No wonder he cannot understand what it means to have faith. His faith is in Ellen White not the word of God.

Psa 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Robert and Ellen White have no spirit. They is unable to make this ultimate sacrifice. They are just a biological animals there is nothing more to them. No spiritual communion. No afterlife. Just death. Just like pigs and rats.

Eph 6:18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

1Co 14:15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

No spirit. No understanding. No personal relationship with God, just man-made religion

Mt 8:8 The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
I do not see anything about the Centurion that involves ‘WORDS’ truth or firmness in truth.

Robert is so focused upon the words that he cannot understand what is being said.

Do all Seventh Day Adventist have a low IQ? Is this why they fall for a replacement prophet and religion?

[rob]

Greetings Gentlemen

I will begin with Richard, seeing he posted first

Richard" You asked for an opportunity to start over and I did respond.
You can choose to believe or not, it is entirely up to you.
Your disrespect for the word of God is insulting.
There is no value in arguing with you.

Firstly Richard, I am not arguing with you, you hardly make any posts, so our communion together is extremely limited. I am not pushing anything unto you, I simply asked you what is faith, and how does faith work in a practical way in your life. Give me examples of how faith works daily in your life.

The rest of your sentences, I cannot answer because you would only get your back up, and I wish to remain friendly, so if you wish to respond, please answer the questions I seek. How does faith work in your life with Christ from day to day. Shalom

Dave, your response is very kind, so I will answer only the bits that are on topic.
The topic is about faith, and how faith works in one's daily walk with Jesus.

Dave" Because we are animals – we are a beast – and loving your fellow man as Christ loved us is difficult – so difficult that many people don’t even try. Do the Russians love the Ukrainians? Do the Ukrainians love Russians? You come here and attack Christianity with vigor – I have been patient – cared enough to engage you – yet your disrespect abounds.

You have admitted before that employers don’t appreciate you – was your Christian witness to them the same as Joseph? Or stubborn and cantankerous as you are here?

Rob" Your response here has many themes, some we have battled before.

I agree we have a carnal nature as a result of sin entering the world, and as a result of our own sinning. Most of our are empowered by self and do things using our own human powers. Scripture terms this effort, even if it is pious and full of commandment keeping effort, as filthy rags.

Isa 64:6 ¶ But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Now I am trying to read your response Dave, so do not attack me if I miss reading you.

Are you suggesting when you come to know Jesus, and believe with all your heart, that the carnal nature, the animal within us, changes thoughts and begins to praise God and seek God and we become changed, when the heart changes?

And my second question of your view, does GOD get involved in this process somehow, in order to help you, or do the change come entirely from yourself? After all you say we have an eternal spirit so maybe the powers of doing good come from this eternal spirit, that you claim is you within the animal body that leads the spirit of you astray.

Is this a fair assessment of your view?

So that the journey of faith, is a belief process of learning to trust God more. The powers of doing good come from the eternal spirit within you, ie YOU alone.

Is this a fair assessment of your view?

Dave" Psa 51:17 O Lord, open my lips, and my mouth will declare Your praise.
Psa 51:18 For You would not delight in sacrifice, or I would give it, nor be pleased by burnt offerings.
Psa 51:19 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit. A broken and a contrite heart, O God, You will not despise.

Rom 10:10 For with the heart it is believed for righteousness, and with the mouth it is confessed for salvation.

What the heart knows to be true affects the way the head thinks – Not the other way around

These verses you have posted are confusing to me, so you have to explain. And again if I get it wrong do not attack me, I am trying to understand your view of faith.

Ps 51:11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

The prayer of David has the rare use of Holy Spirit in it, and than the free Ruwach,
so one has to mean, does the Ruwach also mean the Holy Spirit, and to me it does.

The word salvation here is YASHA in Hebrew, the name given to Jesus. SO David was praying for Jesus and the free HS to enter into his heart and create a renewed attitude in him.

Ps 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Here the word ruwach is again mentioned, but is a broken HS... what does this mean?

What caused the HS in communion with David, to be broken? sin is mentioned in the prayer, and David is confessing his sin. Only when we freely confess our missing before God, can the HS begin restoring us to a full connection with God.

The opposite attitude to this verse is one of pride, mentioned here

Ho 13:6 According to their pasture, so were they filled; they were filled, and their heart was exalted; therefore have they forgotten me.

So the solution is to mourn what we have lost from sin, and with humility ask for the HS to restore us with a created right spirit that longs and knows God fully.

Ps 51:10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

Again the word ruwach means HS again, make a true connection to God, when we have a clean heart, not spoiled by sin.

Dave" Richard asked you once – Do you know the difference between right and wrong? You did not give him an answer.
In all situation do right – by God’s definition
How do you do that? Love your fellow man as Christ loved us. He cared enough for us to witness the truth – lived the truth – even when rejected

Rob" The law defines the right and wrong, and any mistakes we do is termed a transgression of the laws of God. As you come to read the writings of God, you also learn of the laws and directions for a functional life of living.

Dave" How do you do that? Love your fellow man as Christ loved us. He cared enough for us to witness the truth – lived the truth – even when rejected

ROb "My understanding is Jesus lived in the powers of His Father by faith, so yes we are to walk as the example of Jesus is given to us, by faith we walk in the powers of Jesus, just as by faith Jesus walked in the powers of His Father.

My question to you is, how does faith work in your daily living with Jesus?

Dave: "We make decisions every day – those decisions determine who we are. It has nothing to do with your religious practice and everything to do with who you are – your Life Song

We believe but we do not see. Once we see it, it's not faith anymore.

2:04 – Once you see it – you have it in your heart – but you still have to trust God

This is the Gnostic message - Recognise what is in your sight

Many people say they would believe if they could just see a sign - but those of us that believe see signs around us every day.

Rob" You say once you have it in your heart, the head will follow. What is this you are speaking of?

Let me give you an example of my walk at work and the work colleagues who work and talk to me.

When I pray this prayer promise in my mind "Psa 51:17 O Lord, open my lips, and my mouth will declare Your praise." there is an immediate flow of God's power that causes me to say the right things and so the work colleagues respond as their needs are met precisely.

Often instead, under stress my mouth speaks from my human powers alone, and I say things wrong and the work colleagues do not get what words they truly need. And so I do missing.

Missing is not so much a transgression as it is more NOT walking in the faith powers of Jesus. And in this example above, is how you support Jesus, and Jesus supports you.

Dave" (The) Feel Good message you and the Catholic teach is harmful. So many people come to church looking for comfort – their marriage is in trouble, grandma has cancer, sweet innocent little Jimmy has cancer. They still get divorced, grandma still dies, even little Jimmy dies – what happened to the Feel Good message? It is proven false – church is proven teaching a false message – and people walk away from the church.

Rob" Dave I do not teach a feel good message, nor is my teachings Catholic. However I agree with this post you placed here. Such so called pious ones are empowering their lives with human powers alone, which is nothing in the eyes of God. Catholics believe you come to Jesus and get sins forgiven, and than you walk in God using your own human powers that make you praise God fully. This teaching is wrong. It is a wrong concept of faith, and how faith works.

Dave "I don’t understand why you would think so – the message is trust in God – why don’t you understand this?

ROb" Thanks for watching Dave, now please watch Rabndy Skeete also. The video has images always of the head looking up. Hoping for .... faith.... things not seen....

In the example of faith I gave you, when you ask for His words to flow out of your mouth, the flow is immediate, and a sign of His grace over you. You cannot boast of the sign to others, for they will think you mad. Your miracles of grace are yours alone, proof that God via faith, is empowering everyday. Often God speaks to me of my exaltation of self, and my missing of claiming a faith flow from speaking His words. It is the good fight of faith, Paul speaks of. It is a daily battle with self, the animal within us and depends we do things using our animal powers of self.


Greetings Dillon

Dillon "Robert and Ellen White have no spirit. They is unable to make this ultimate sacrifice. They are just a biological animals there is nothing more to them. No spiritual communion. No afterlife. Just death. Just like pigs and rats.

Rob" my friend, you are so wrong. There are two Hebrew words within the creation of man

Ge 7:22 All in whose nostrils <'aph> was the breath <n@shamah> <ruwach> of life <chay>, of all that was in the dry <charabah> land, died <muwth>.

In this interlinear translation you will see a rare thing, behind the word "breath" are TWO Hebrew words, not one as is usual in translation.

These words are nashamah, the "spirit of man that is done by breathing, that is you"
and the ruwach, the HS, the divine powers of GOD that lives yoked with your spirit and allows your spirit to live, and do and walk and speak.

Both of these words are termed "spirit" in the NT, sadly the details are confused.

So yes Dillon we SDA people do have spirits, which is termed an idiom for our characters that develop from being partnered to God.

Dillon "No spirit. No understanding. No personal relationship with God, just man-made religion

ROb " You are correct, if we have no spirit, we have no understand and no relationship with God, just a man made religion. You are so correct.

Dillon " Robert is so focused upon the words that he cannot understand what is being said.

Rob " SO you think I have low IQ?

Mt 8:9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.

The centurion is speaking of secular context of faith, so has nothing to do with God of godly faith. This is the context of secular faith, the faith the soldiers have with their Centurion superior.

When do these soldiers do with the Centurions words?

DO they believe in them? Huh? No they obey them

Maybe the believe the words were spoken, but essentially they do as the commands direct.

The soldiers see in the command of words, powers from the Empire, and hence do them, because the Empire says to do them.

The soldiers are supporting their superior, because the penalty for insubordination is the death penalty, so maybe they also fear the powers of the Empire of Rome?

I hope you begin to see my view on faith. Now relate this to godly faith, and how does it work.

Shalom

[Dave]

Firstly Richard, I am not arguing with you,
It is what you do – You are confrontational – I told you before that I consider your personality type is cantankerous.

You do play games with scripture – it is disrespectful
You do your best to morph scripture so that it fits the Ellen White narrative –

Dave, your response is very kind, so I will answer only the bits that are on topic.
Still – only selective answers – avoid direct questions

The topic is about faith, and how faith works in one's daily walk with Jesus.

The honest answer = we are all not called the same
Each morning as I wake – I begin with God – it sets the tone for the day. I am reverent with meals – I am proud of my girls setting the example in restaurants. I love wearing my yammaka in Christian church. I love hat trivia and love to share it leading up to the why.

With great restraint – I have participated in many study groups – have lead Sunday School – have been good at youth ministry – all community church stuff – including paying the bills

Today, I bore church studies – hunger for more depth – For a while I thought I was call to a Masters Greek program – but then COVID hit and things changed - I have explored Pentecostal churches – there are several that I enjoy

I have been ‘religious’ with families in ER – ICU. The trauma of a four car pile up at 75mph with children – is something that sure teaches mortality Working with microbiologist and then PCR-DNA mapping, no one accepts evolution – they are just blocked from admitting biblical creation.

I have always been a space buff – I still remember staying up all night to watch the moon landing. I have been a member of more than one astro-physics forums

2005 I was introduced to Dr J. Marvin Herndon. His theory changed my life. I still remember being on fire as my theory came about – and then my book. It was a very validating time in my life – lots of positive feedback from people I respect.

It was the birth of this ministry and web-site

As I have admitted – 1974 I was introduced to a spiritual reality. I have listened to many that say they have experienced something.

2003 There were more than one UFO sightings in the area – 2018 just 10 miles east of me = cattle surgical mutilation and no tracks. I have listened to Paul Scheiver (Deuce NM).
I have met two people that have amazing stories – I believe it all – just too much to discount

I traveled for .gov with my family. I worked at the Indian Health Services – Coalvile Reservation. It was so interesting to speak to people that believe in spirits. I have so many stories. Big Foot Country. Lived 18 months in Coulee Damn and another 13 months in Omak – we have been to the suicide races. Been to several Pow Wows – all of it an education.

I have even been up front a few times – only because the pastor failed to show – snow – rock slide – large culvert washed out by a flash flood. AHHH Life in the mountains.

I sure have picked up my share of hitch hikers – and my wife hands out too much money

But I tire of corporate prayer churches – babbel on like the pagans do – Betty’s hip – soldiers in Viet Nam – My Aunt was a rebel hostage in Granada – now Ukraine.

Through it all – I have been known as the guy working on a Christian centered book – Everyone knew me as a preacher / teacher of the scripture. People have come to me with questions. I interact by email – this ministry – and my children. I have been sought out to write several COVID religious exemption letters.

I attempt to interact with local pastors, but they usually find me challenging – currently the only pastor that emails with me is the leader of the Pueblo Messianic Jewish church – I would attend if it wasn’t 70 miles away.

What do I do to be a Christian – I wake up and am a Christian. Have I felt the Holy Spirit in my life – absolutely. Have I been associated with miracles – absolutely. Have I dealt with demons (archon) in my life – absolutely. Do I believe the goal is to walk in the spirit 24/7 – absolutely.

This is my life song – this is who I am – if it is not Christian enough for you – judge away – I can take it
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Dave" Because we are animals – we are a beast – and loving your fellow man as Christ loved us is difficult – so difficult that many people don’t even try.

I agree we have a carnal nature as a result of sin entering the world, and as a result of our own sinning.

Jewish / Christian overlap =Mainstream view – my view – Gen 1 God created hominids adam (man)
Gen 2:7 Adam (Personal Name) Homo sapiens

Adam was adam (man) from the dust given a spirit – Adam’s spirit
Beast – adam (man) + (spiritual Adam) = Human being
Animal adam with all its wants and needs + the instinct for survival – all the nature of the beast – all the nature of nature

Spirit Adam – per-existed his birth
The Jewish argument = Creation is over – a new man is not created with each birth – that is just biology – the spirit within per-existed

It is the teaching of your orthodox Jewish Gerald Schroeder that you misrepresent on your web-site

From God we came and to God we return

I agree we have a carnal nature as a result of sin entering the world, and as a result of our own sinning.

You have it backwards – man was created as a beast and gifted with a spirit and a choice – sin was inevitable – cannot even keep one commandment
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Most of our are empowered by self and do things using our own human powers. Scripture terms this effort, even if it is pious and full of commandment keeping effort, as filthy rags.

Isa 64:6 ¶ But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

NOT DISAGREEING – many people pretend to be Christian -
but ponder the function of religious practice?

The parade of the Jews has always been – from the beginning – we need to ask ourselves, ‘do we need to atone for anything’ – God does tabernacle with man (2 separate celibrations – God dwelt with man twice (Jews once in a tent and once in a Temple) (Christians – once in a building and once as Jesus Christ) – salvation id only by the Lord – Passover (3 different celebrations) – followed 50 days later with Pentecost.

The Jews marched this parade for 1000 years before Christ
Through this parade they are lead to the truth – through this parade the whole world (the 99%) was witnessed to.

New Christians – need a place to turn to with their initial questions – However, Roman Christendom churches have become traps. You can check in but never grow – the message / teaching is limited to entry level discussions – growth is NOT promoted.
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Are you suggesting when you come to know Jesus, and believe with all your heart, that the carnal nature, the animal within us, changes thoughts and begins to praise God and seek God and we become changed, when the heart changes?

Man = animal with yester ra + spirit with yester tov
Man = animal with its wants and desires + spirit that knows better.

The animal within man never changes – Paul – Romans chapter 7 – that which I do not want – I do
Guilt – of not measuring up to God’s standard weighs on our soul – it forces a change in attitude – it forces a change in values – it forces an overwhelming appreciation for the gift of grace.

Rom 7:24  Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? 
Rom 7:25  Thanks be to God—it is through Messiah Yeshua our Lord!

And my second question of your view, does GOD get involved in this process somehow, in order to help you, or do the change come entirely from yourself?

Again – the honest answer = we are all called differently
The more time you spend leaning on the Lord – the more time you spend in honest prayer – the more time you spend with the Lord.

Can you sin – mid prayer – no
So all you have to do is stay in prayer 24/7 and your sinless
But the needs of the animal – prevent this from happening

Some are blessed with the baptism of the Holy Spirit – and they have a different calling – a different purpose

If you are looking for one answer to fit all people – you are looking in the wrong place.
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After all you say we have an eternal spirit so maybe the powers of doing good come from this eternal spirit, that you claim is you within the animal body that leads the spirit of you astray.

Correct – Christians are become in touch with their spiritual nature – the part of us that knows better. It is this part that desires to do better. It is this part that communes with the Holy Spirit – the Spirit of God

So that the journey of faith, is a belief process of learning to trust God more. The powers of doing good come from the eternal spirit within you, ie YOU alone.

Some come from yourself – because inside we all know better – sometimes the Power of the Holy Spirit flows through us as in speaking in tongues – healings – or prophesying

Yesterday, I spent 3hrs at a memorial for my neighbor - in his bio is reads = "In his forties, the Lord touched his heart and he has served Him the rest of days, describing himself as a bond servant of the Lord Jesus Christ."

Too bad you will find this confusing and difficult to understand
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These verses you have posted are confusing to me, so you have to explain. And again if I get it wrong do not attack me, I am trying to understand your view of faith.

Ps 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Here the word ruwach is again mentioned, but is a broken HS... what does this mean?

No such thing as a broken Holy Spirit
The broken spirit within David = David’s spirit in repentance

What caused the HS in communion with David, to be broken?

No such thing
Your teaching that the Spirit of God is broken is disrespectful to God

Ps 51:10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

Again the word ruwach means HS again,

You say this because you deny the spirit within man – the spirit of man
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Dave" How do you do that? Love your fellow man as Christ loved us. He cared enough for us to witness the truth – lived the truth – even when rejected

ROb "My understanding is Jesus lived in the powers of His Father by faith,

Christ is God – there is no other God

Hos 13:4  “Yet I have been Adonai your God since the land of Egypt. You should know no God but Me, and there is no Savior apart from Me. 
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My question to you is, how does faith work in your daily living with Jesus?

Dave: "We make decisions every day – those decisions determine who we are. It has nothing to do with your religious practice and everything to do with who you are – your Life Song

Rob" You say once you have it in your heart, the head will follow. What is this you are speaking of?

You deny the spirit – all you accept as real is the biology of the world – of course you cannot understand – you reject the teaching
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Dave" (The) Feel Good message you and the Catholic teach is harmful.
Rob" Dave I do not teach a feel good message, nor is my teachings Catholic.

Now you are just lying – you spent 2 years arguing that your god cannot do any harm. Did not command a genocide. Your belief in Ezk 28 is a 100% Catholic invention

Were you lying to me then – or are you lying to me now

I called you Mr Flip Flop because you have never presented a consistent theology – lack of seriousness as it pertains to the word of God
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Dillon "Robert and Ellen White have no spirit.

So yes Dillon we SDA people do have spirits, which is termed an idiom for our characters that develop from being partnered to God.

Another lie – just a few paragraphs earlier you mocked the idea of man’s eternal spirit – now you pretend that you believe in the spiritual

Mr flip flop – more confusion – more inconsistency

Creation is over - a new spirit of man is not created with each birth
all that is left is biology - procreattion 

Dillon " Robert is so focused upon the words that he cannot understand what is being said.

This is such a true statement – Mat 8 is a great example
Remember your deliberate corruption of καθίστημι
Remember your deliberate attempt to corrupt the word ἀρχή
and now you want to teach that the Spirit of God is broken

Repeat - You do play games with scripture – it is disrespectful

You do your best to morph scripture so that it fits the Ellen White narrative

Rob " SO you think I have low IQ?
I do not think Robert is the brightest guy on the planet – but as for his SDA teaching it is not a matter of IQ – but indoctrination / brainwashing

As for his promotion of the Creation Institute – specifically Don Patton – that does speak to a level of gullibility spawn of poor education

[Dave]

Ok Robert – I have answered you as best I know how. For many years I drove 1 hour or more to work – then home 3days a week 7pm – 7am. I loved this time – alone in the car – just me and the Lord appreciating His creation. The Sun Rises – the Snow Capped Mountains - waking up to 12 inches of new snow. Driving in it is the fun part – cleaning off the car is the hard part. Right now is has been thunder storming around here – the rivers are fulllll – the dirt roads have wet spots (I mean mud slide pits – 4x4 only) – through it all He was and is with me – because I am with Him.

Your turn – you left here owing us many unanswered questions –

Where to start? – Robert - so much of the theology presented by you is so outrageous that it is hard to take you seriously at times.

My Point – What was the theology of the disciples and other original Christians of the first century. All of the disciples and the Apostles were originally Jewish. Every one of them held Jewish theology as the correct backstory to the Messiah. Jesus even said – he didn’t come to change the Torah – not one iota. Mat 25

My Interest = the theology of those men – those Jewish disciples – those Jewish Apostiles – the Jewish men that experience the First Christian Pentecost – all of them were schooled Jewish – from a Jewish culture.

Jewish belief #1 – God is absolute – there is only one God – the Creator of everything – and His creation is exactly as He Willed – His Plan.

Joh 1:3  All things were made through Him, and apart from Him nothing was made that has come into being. 

Gen 1:1  In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 
Gen 1:2  Now the earth was chaos and waste, darkness was on the surface of the deep,

Darkness came into being – who created it – God did
Darkness always indicates ignorance of the truth – did God create it directly or allowed it?
The heavens are an invisible spiritual realm – earth of Gen 1:1 is visible physical creation – dirt – stars, planets, moons, etc – with it comes entropy – decay – as a necessary part of physical creation.

Entropy comes in many forms – rocks fall down – the stars consume fuel as they burn – plants feed upon their environment – water dehydrates or soaks into the ground – all of it an entropic event – ra – moving from higher order to lower

Isa 45:5  I am Adonai—there is no other. Besides Me there is no God. I will strengthen you, though you have not known Me, 
Isa 45:6  so they may know, from the rising to the setting of the sun, that there is no one besides Me. I am Adonai—there is no other. 
Isa 45:7  I form light and create darkness. I make shalom and create calamity (RA). I, Adonai, do all these things. 

Jewish belief #1 – God is absolute – Anything that has come into being was made by God for God. - and His creation is exactly as He Willed – His Plan.

Rev 12:3 the Beast appears ready to devour whatever creation had to offer.
The Beast of Rev 12:3 – came into being - who created it = God did

Did God create it directly – or allowed it as a function of the Darkness / ignorance

Col 1:16  For by Him all things were created—in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen, whether thrones or angelic powers or rulers or authorities. All was created through Him and for Him.

Rev 4:11  “Worthy are You, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, For You created all things, and because of Your will they existed and were created!” 

Jewish belief #1 – God is absolute – Anything that has come into being was made by God for God. - and His creation is exactly as He Willed – His Plan.

Question to Robert – why do you deny this truth?
You teach God is NOT absolute – your satan god has the ability to change God’s Plan against God’s Will
You aslo teach that your satan god created himself – against God’s Will
You also teach there was no RA in the universe until man sinned – then your satan god rewrote all DNA to be corrupt
You teach that RA is a result of your satan god Not the Creator

You claim a second creator and a second creation

2nd Question to Robert – Vegetarian sharks and other herbavours.
You claim that befor man sinned all creatures were herbavours – but also say there was no RA
Isn’t the act of falling trees for leaves – ripping plants up for their roots – chewing plants into a digestible slur an act of RA? How can you be a herbavour and do no ra?

3rd Question for Robert – Do you really believe that planet earth popped into existence fully formed as it is today – or did primordial earth undergo any growing pains of its own – how do you do that without any RA?

4th Question – all beast of the field were commanded by God to be fruitful and multiply – instinctive self preservation and the survival of the species (yester ra) – To man specifically he was commanded to be fruitful and multiply and have dominion over earth (yester ra)

How can you suggest Adam and Eve were different – and argue they had no carnal thoughts before man sinned?

www.patriotledger.com/story/lifestyle/faith/2012/08/16/romans-8-spiritual-vs-carnal/986069007/
If you’ve set your mind on the things of the flesh you are carnally minded. Carnal is where we get the word “meat” from. Carne is the Spanish word for meat and we see that to be carnally minded is to live after the things that animals live for, essentially. 

Dave" Because we are animals – we are a beast – and loving your fellow man as Christ loved us is difficult – so difficult that many people don’t even try.

I agree we have a carnal nature as a result of sin entering the world, and as a result of our own sinning.

You have it backwards – man was created as a beast and gifted with a spirit and a choice – sin was inevitable – cannot even keep one commandment

Rom 5:12  So then, just as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, in the same way death spread to all men because all sinned. 
Rom 5:13  For up until the Torah, sin was in the world; but sin does not count as sin when there is no law. 

The Question – you teach that all was TOV until man sinned and then everything changed – God’s creation is no longer as He intended – it became flawed / it corrupted

sin was inevitable – mankind cannot even keep one commandment – Adam and Eve are just the proof

There was sin in the world before that first commandment

sin was inevitable – mankind cannot even keep one commandment – Adam and Eve are just the proof

The Question – don’t you see the folly of your view - “I agree we have a carnal nature as a result of sin entering the world, and as a result of our own sinning.”

Ecc 3:18  I also said in my heart, “As for the sons of man, God tests them so that they may see that they are but animals.” 
Ecc 3:19  For the destiny of humankind and the destiny of animals are one and the same. As one dies, so dies the other. Both have the same breath—a human has no advantage over an animal—both are fleeting. 
Ecc 3:20  Both go to one place. Both were taken from the dust, and both return to the dust. 
Ecc 3:21  Who knows that the spirit of the sons of man ascends upward and the animal’s spirit descends into the earth? 

5th Question - spirit of man ascends upward
Why do you deny an eternal spirit – is not eternal life the promise – How can you believe in an enteral life without an eternal self

You teach that man spirit is a product of biological procreation – just our memories that the HS takes into heaven for safe keeping – until you biological body is resurrected and reunited with your memories to stand judgment – back to death or continued life from then on

What has your teaching do for eternal life? There is none – life begins at different times by procreation – then extinguishes – then comes alive again

6th Question – Why do you deny that man is a full part of the host of heaven – are we not called to be Christian soldiers

[rob]

Greetings Dave

I loved reading your walk and ministry with GOD, you have written of many good works and fruit that bears fruit of your kind heart and true spirit with the Lord. I feel a little mite next to your ministry, and do not deserve you to speak with me.

So since I am nothing, I will have to leave you, after all, I am not allowed to ask questions, nor am I allowed to question the translations of Scripture. I am supposed to accept what I read and listen and follow what others teach me? Since I have asked for a second start with you, I am not arguing my view with your view.  I am simply wanting to ask you about your view, and will leave things at that. I seek truth. Surely whatever view I come across will stand scrutiny?

I could and would love to know how you study Scripture and by what method do you do this, after all I asked God, long ago, where does the torah teach you how to study the torah in the first place? I have also asked GOD where does the torah teach you the steps to being saved of GOD, so the human understands the process of salvation? Surely there is a place, that is written in chronological order with simple child like understanding? These are questions I like to ask, I am not a human who blindly follows what I am told to follow, following the traditions and doctrines of men.

Why even our so called SDA church has no foundation doctrine on Faith, it is a forgotten pillar, and I am surprised why the Church does not understand such an important theme of salvation. Hence why I am asking for your understanding of faith in your life. It seems to me, that the entire world sees faith as some concept of "mental assent". I use a term given to me by U Tube videos, while I do not fully understand the term, it appears to be a theme based on belief. SO being saved is a believing process, whatever that means.

While your post is admirable, you do not answer my question :

1) How does your faith in God operate daily in your life? Please provide examples, so I can rationalize how faith works in you.

Instead, you raised questions that bother you... I am not interested in talking about things I do not fully understand myself.

Q1: You seem to suggest your one and only Strong Authority creates RA along with the TOV for this world. This is a Gnostic teaching, that God created a flawed world intentionally.
The Christian view is that RA came into our world as a result of sin. The planet of earth was formless and void, because angels banished there were already sinning. Hence GOD created a new creation over the earth, so the brand new innocent and sinless humans would bear witness to the sin problem, and GOD's dealing with the SIN problem, which existed BEFORE the humans existed.

I know you will not understand this, but you asked me for my view.

Q2: Isn't the act of eating leaves and act of RA? Hmm? Difficult question. Mrs White also speaks of flowers when picked never fade or die in though separated from the plant sap. Again the first creation , like the next creation is difficult to fathom. Scripture speaks of things beyond our understanding in the next creation.



Q3: Earth existed prior to the creation over it. Granite rocks added to the land, according to Robert Gantry popped into existence within 6 milliseconds according to the Plutonium halo decay rings. So yes God can speak things into existence, not as science wishes to make all things appear as a natural process.

Q4: Multiply and fill the land, is because of making more numbers of the species, I imagine the genes are switched off once the land is full of the numbers. But sin changed all this.
Again we speak of things we do not fully understand.

Q5: Why do you ask about the nature of man, if you did not fully show me your views of this? Neither does the Jew, they speak mixing terms and adding confusion?

You agree with me, all things come from God.

So how can GOD gift us a spirit, it this is not matter, but a part of GOD? And if it is a part of GOD, how does God allow us to have free will with it? I can ask you questions you cannot answer?
Question: Can GOD even grant a part of Himself to us as free will spirit?
Question: If this part of God (gifted to us as spirit) can talk without a mouth, and think without a brain, why does God enclose the spirit into a body subject to RA, knowing this causes the spirit to sin? To develop free will? Suddenly your idea of sinning is not a free will choice?

It is best to admit your archons are deceiving you, and to say as Scripture teaches that all matter comes from GOD. The Bible does not explain who God is or where God came from, only that He exists as the one who exists (YHWH). The term as a "spirit" is an invented idea from your archons. All creatures are composed of matter, ie created. Some created creatures such as angels are not the same as human creatures in terms of biology, but they are created, hence subject to God, and subject to losses caused by sin.

Secondly since the torah is written of GOD and penned by humans, surely the torah gives us clues to who and what GOD is? DO you agree with this idea?

My understanding the HS is partnered to the shaped clay, and the function of namashah (breathing spirit) comes to function as the human spirit. Our memories are recorded, yes, the DNA is only holy words and is also a grand recording machine, is it not?

What else would you require to make an eternal human fully human for ever? Only it's memories.


Q6: We are part of the host of heaven, as an army, yes, to witness against the agency's of sin, a great controversy you do not believe in, but now allude to?

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Is it too much to ask how faith works in your daily life ? I have given you examples of how faith works in my daily life. Driving home, the Lord answered some questions regarding to letter of the torah and the spirit of the torah.

Ro 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

There is one course one can understand this passage

De 30:10 If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul.
11 ¶ For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.
12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?
13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?
14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it

How are these two passages related to faith?

God showed me an answer to these two passages of faith, but you seem to think the animal within us always sins, and when God made the spirit captured by the animal, that sin was inevitable? If that is true, than GOD cannot make humans guilty of sin, that man sins because his makeup is flawed? I do not agree with your idea. The passages relate to faith, and while God gave me answers, you do not share with me, your views of faith.

In your reply Dave, speak to my questions about faith. I do not wish to speak of themes off topic, as you posted already. We already are very different thinkers, but I do appreciate you as a thinking person. Your ministry is certainly more grand than mine. I am blessed to be associated with you. I pray you enjoy our discussions as much as I do with you. I wish my own people would discuss, but they refuse. Many are invited but few are chosen. Jesus says when I come will I find faith upon the earth?

Shalom my friend

[Dave]

So since I am nothing, I will have to leave you, after all,
Too bad – was looking forward finally to an honest discussions - Evedenty it is beyond your capability

I am not allowed to ask questions,
It is all you do here – ask the same question over and over

nor am I allowed to question the translations of Scripture.
Bull shit – question away

I am supposed to accept what I read and listen and follow what others teach me?
No – you are supposed to defend your view with scripture with honesty and with integrity – like an intelligent man

I seek truth. Surely whatever view I come across will stand scrutiny?
You think Ellen White stands scrutiny in the light of scripture?

I could and would love to know how you study Scripture and by what method do you do this,
I first translated parts of the Gospel of John in 1972. I have taught NT Greek to a group of sailors and Japanese clergy. I have been apart of many study groups – in my house, the church basement, or another’s house. All serious students of the Word learn church history. The issue with Christian Education in America is that is does not include a full Jewish background. For that I spent time online with the Jerusalem Institute for Hebrew Studies – the classes are free to watch online. I have been to several ‘Ask a Rabbi’ web-sites. All really accommodating beginning with entry stuff – but when pressed for depth back off.

At first I was not sure why until I met Rabbi Friedman (online only) – Why do Rabbis not give simple straightforward answers to controversial topics? Answer – in Judaism there is up to 5 different answers to each quandary. Rabbi A says this, Rabbi B says something different, and from 1250AD Rabbi C said – etc etc – so instead of explaining the Jewish mindset to you they just don’t answer.

How do I study - after 50 years - I would say - theme studies 
In studies - often i am asked - what does it say in Greek - I do my best

Haven't for a while - but use to pick random NT Greek verses and translate them - only to know what verse it is for comparisson after Im done
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after all I asked God, long ago, where does the torah teach you how to study the torah in the first place?
You brought to the original discussion -

Isa 28:10  For it must be ‘precept upon precept, precept upon precept, line upon line, line upon line, here a little, there a little.’ 

pre·cept

1 - a general rule intended to regulate behavior or thought.
"the legal precept of being innocent until proven guilty"
Similar:principle, rule, tenet, canon, code, doctrine, guideline, law, ordinance, statute, command, order, decree, mandate, dictate, dictum, directive, direction, instruction, injunction, prescription, commandment, mitzvah, prescript
2. - a writ or warrant.
"the Commissioner issued precepts requiring the companies to provide information"

You miss the meaning – or pervert the meaning by playing your word games

Ps 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Here the word ruwach is again mentioned, but is a broken HS... what does this mean?

No such thing as a broken Holy Spirit
The broken spirit within David = David’s spirit in repentance

The same lessons are presented over and over – same themes over and over – because man is slow to learn

Your word games have failed you more than once
If I love you like a brother – I will speak to you as a brother
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I have also asked GOD where does the torah teach you the steps to being saved of GOD, so the human understands the process of salvation? 

Your question is all about you – how do you obtain – what SIGN would satisfy you

The Methodist teach the method – basically it is the more time you spend with God – the more you do for God – the more time you spend the more you do – the more God is with you.

To this I say – OK - whatever works – the Jewish Parade lived on for 1000 years – repeating the message – over and over – precept upon precept.

Surely there is a place, that is written in chronological order with simple child like understanding? 

Rom 10:9  For if you confess with your mouth that Yeshua is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 
Rom 10:10  For with the heart it is believed for righteousness, and with the mouth it is confessed for salvation. 

Do you not understand scripture – or do you doubt scripture

Joh 3:16  “For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life. 

Do you not understand scripture – or do you doubt scripture - trust is a full part of faith

It seems to me, that the entire world sees faith as some concept of "mental assent". I use a term given to me by U Tube videos, while I do not fully understand the term, it appears to be a theme based on belief. SO being saved is a believing process, whatever that means.

I am not interested in talking about things I do not fully understand myself.
But you teach it as truth
I thought you were a seeker of the truth ?

Q1: You seem to suggest your one and only Strong Authority creates RA along with the TOV for this world. This is a Gnostic teaching, that God created a flawed world intentionally.
You are trying to play a blame game - it is a Jewish teaching

The Christian view is that RA came into our world as a result of sin. The planet of earth was formless and void, because angels banished there were already sinning. Hence GOD created a new creation over the earth, so the brand new innocent and sinless humans would bear witness to the sin problem, and GOD's dealing with the SIN problem, which existed BEFORE the humans existed.

I know you will not understand this, but you asked me for my view.
I absolute understand the Roman Catholic view – but it is NOT the opinion of the disciples – to me that is all that matters

Q2: Isn't the act of eating leaves and act of RA? Hmm? Difficult question.
Only if you are not honest – or you have flexible definitions

Q3: So yes God can speak things into existence, not as science wishes to make all things appear as a natural process.
OK – did it – where is your empirical evidence

Rom 1:18  For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men. In unrighteousness they suppress the truth, 
Rom 1:19  because what can be known about God is plain to them—for God has shown it to them. 
Rom 1:20  His invisible attributes—His eternal power and His divine nature—have been clearly seen ever since the creation of the world, being understood through the things that have been made. So people are without excuse— 

So how can GOD gift us a spirit, it this is not matter, but a part of GOD? And if it is a part of GOD, how does God allow us to have free will with it? I can ask you questions you cannot answer?

You mock the question – only you make the claim that man’s spirit is a part of God – No Jew every thought as you do

God created the angels – they are spiritual beings – each independent
God created the archon (Sons of God) – they are in between beings – invisible yet bound to earth
God created man – spirit beings – each independent

Gen 2:7 – animal/beast man + spirit = a human being

Man is Beast (yester ra) + (Spirit – yester tov)
Man is the only creature concerned with right and wrong
Man is a Beast (yester ra) – without the (Spirit – yester tov) man would have no conscious – no guilt – no consequence.

Long before becoming a Christian

My understanding the HS is partnered to the shaped clay, and the function of namashah (breathing spirit) comes to function as the human spirit. Our memories are recorded, yes, the DNA is only holy words and is also a grand recording machine, is it not?

The Holy Spirit IS the Spirit of God
Question: If this part of God (gifted to us as spirit) can talk without a mouth, and think without a brain, why does God enclose the spirit into a body subject to RA, knowing this causes the spirit to sin? To develop free will? Suddenly your idea of sinning is not a free will choice?

I have always said this – if man is just the HS – then why does the HS sin?

Q6: We are part of the host of heaven, as an army, yes, to witness against the agency's of sin, a great controversy you do not believe in, but now allude to?

Gen 2:1  Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 

When was man created?
Answer – Day 1