|
Post by Dave on Aug 12, 2022 6:09:31 GMT -5
R" Your playing with me aren't you? "meat" is a old English term for food, including fruit and veggies, not necessarily a reference to animal protein.Sorry Robert – it is your word gameThe verse tells you any way, manna is a plant based food, so meat refers to plant based food.You teach ZERO polysemy – The Robert Method – Jeff Brenner HebrewSorry Robert – victuals – includes animal meatPs 78:25 Man did eat angels' food: he sent them meat (H6720) to the full. Your angels are carnivores – meat eaters – did your satan god rewrite their DNA also?H6720 - צֵידָה - Feminine of H6718; food: - meat, provision, venisonH6718 – צַיִד - From a form of H6679 and meaning the same; the chase; also game (thus taken); (generally) lunch (especially for a journey): - X catcheth, food, X hunter, (that which he took in) hunting, venison,
H6679 – צוּד - a primitive root; to lie alongside (that is, in wait); by implication to catch an animal (figuratively men); (denominative from H6718) to victual (for a journey): - chase, hunt, sore, take (provision). Ps 78:25 Man did eat angels' food: he sent them meat to the full. Your angels are carnivores – meat eaters – did your satan god rewrite their DNA also?Either your angels ate meat – did your satan god rewrite their DNA also? Or H6720 + H6718 + H6679 are your examples of polysemious Hebrew words100 Synonyms of VICTUALS | Merriam-Webster Thesaurus www.merriam-webster.com › thesaurus › victuals Synonyms for VICTUALS: bread, chow, chuck, comestibles, eatables, eats, edibles, fare. Compare Synonyms = Aliment, bread, chow, comestibles, eatables, eats, edibles, fare, feed, foodstuff, goodies, groceries, grub, larder, meal, nourishment, provender, provisions, rations, refreshments, snack, supplies, You have absolute rules others must follow - why don't your own doctrines apply to yourself?Mr consistant
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2022 16:19:42 GMT -5
D"Sorry You teach ZERO polysemy – The Robert Method – Jeff Brenner Hebrew Sorry Robert – victuals – includes animal meat
R" You think?
Jeff Benner makes the meaning to "hunt" the "produce from the hunt"
I disagree with Jeff here.
Ge 27:3 Now therefore take, I pray thee, thy weapons, thy quiver and thy bow, and go out to the field, and take me some venison; Ge 27:4 And make me savoury meat,
Why the two different Hebrew words? I am seeing the word "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find".
And "mat`am" refers to "vension-meat" from "a killed animal".
Ge 42:25 Then Joseph commanded to fill their sacks with corn, and to restore every man's money into his sack, and to give them provision for the way: and thus did he unto them.
Again Joeseph gives money into the sacks of "wheat" calling it "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find".
Ex 12:39 And they baked unleavened cakes of the dough which they brought forth out of Egypt, for it was not leavened; because they were thrust out of Egypt, and could not tarry, neither had they prepared for themselves any victual.
Again the children of Israel have to go "travelling over the desert to collect the seeds to grind into flour to make the unleaven bread, and this food is called "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find".
All other contexts say the same as above. No new contexts, all considered here.
Now Dave write your rebuttal here, inside my discussions.
Stop making Hebrew into a language of polysemy, which it is not.
D"Or H6720 + H6718 + H6679 are your examples of polysemious Hebrew words R" NO, see my study above.
D"You have absolute rules others must follow - why don't your own doctrines apply to yourself? R" I cannot find a suitable English word for "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find".
Jeff Benner sees the Ancient Hebrew letter "to hunt" I disagree, it means to "seek and travel" like Aborigines seeking and travelling over the land to hunt for yams they dig out with digging sticks. (It can also mean seeking to hunt animals)
NOW are you willing to see that ANGELS eat MAN, the food from heaven, food one must go and seek and travel to find. It is biological food, same as the fruit of the tree of life, so you are wrong to assume biology is a bad thing. God created biology and can exist in heaven as long as the biology is sinless, not corrupted by sin, nor spoiled by a Spoiler. The DNA words remain holy inside the matter, for eternity. The WORD became flesh, (Joh 1:14) is a simile of biology in heaven, The Divine (not of matter) assumes matter and become biology in heaven. Your Gnostic view is totally wrong. So stop twisting and changing themes as you do.
1Jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
John wrote to counter Gnosticism, the alpha heresy coming into the disciples gospel.
You Dave have this idea that Jesus is not in biological flesh in heaven, and so you are presenting what this verse John wrote is advising of me, to have nothing to do with your theories.
Both Paul and John wrote against Gnostic views and I am beginning to see your subtle views come more and more as your write your discussions.
Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 13, 2022 5:49:55 GMT -5
D"Sorry You teach ZERO polysemy – The Robert Method – Jeff Brenner Hebrew Sorry Robert – victuals – includes animal meat R" You think?
I am seeing the word "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find". All other contexts say the same as above. No new contexts, all considered here. Now Dave write your rebuttal here, inside my discussions. Word game Stop making Hebrew into a language of polysemy, which it is not.
Psa 78:23 Though he had commanded the clouds from above, and opened the doors of heaven, Psa 78:24 And had rained down manna upon them to eat, and had given them of the corn of heaven.
H8064 -שָׁמֶה - shâmayim air or heaven – you say manna from heaven angel food in heaven
Psa 78:26 He caused an east wind to blow in the heaven: and by his power he brought in the south wind. Psa 78:27 He rained flesh also upon them as dust, and feathered fowls like as the sand of the sea:
H8064 -שָׁמֶה - shâmayim air or heaven – you say FLESH / MEAT / FOWL from heaven angel food in heaven
There are your carnivore angels in heaven eating meat in heaven – angel food
D"Or H6720 + H6718 + H6679 – and now H8064 are your examples of polysemious Hebrew words
D"You have absolute rules others must follow - why don't your own doctrines apply to yourself? R" I cannot find a suitable English word for "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find".
What about H7607 – שְׁאֵר - From H7604; flesh (as swelling out), as living or for food; generally food of any kind; figuratively kindred by blood: - body, flesh, food, (near) kin (-sman, -swoman), near (nigh) [of kin] you say FLESH / MEAT / FOWL from heaven - angel food in heaven
1Jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: John wrote to counter Gnosticism, the alpha heresy coming into the disciples gospel. Which one of us preach the spirit – and which one of us deny the Spirit of God?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2022 17:10:43 GMT -5
Dave you write flip flop, inconsistent
You you say AFTER quickening, biology is allowed in heaven
SO make up your mind,
Is SINLESS biology , no entropy in the BIOLOGY, allowed in heaven or not?
Stop fighting over of the verses that say bioogy is in heaven?
Make your claims clear and write a discussion.
ROb summaries " I am seeing the word "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find".
Now Dave write your rebuttal here, inside my discussions.
Dave writes no rebuttal, therefore you agree with me'
"tseydah" means to go "travelling for food" , could include hunting animals, if you RE USED to Sin and RA foods.
SO you agree angels eat SINLESS FOOD in heaven, the MAN as the Hebrew terms it.
SO SINLESS biological bodies is the bodies of angels in heaven?
SHalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 13, 2022 18:10:23 GMT -5
Dave you write flip flop, inconsistent
You you say AFTER quickening, biology is allowed in heaven Make your claims clear and write a discussion.
Rob summaries " I am seeing the word "tseydah" meaning "food you must go travelling to find". Now Dave write your rebuttal here, inside my discussions.
H8064 -שָׁמֶה - shâmayim air or heaven – you say manna from heaven angel food in heaven
Psa 78:27 He rained flesh also upon them as dust, and feathered fowls like as the sand of the sea:
H8064 -שָׁמֶה - shâmayim air or heaven – you say FLESH / MEAT / FOWL from heaven angel food in heaven Either heaven means the realm of God and the angels – then There are your carnivore angels in heaven eating meat in heaven – angel food That means – according to you – that all of the angels DNA was changed by your satan god
OR – the heavens = the airs above and this was a physical manifestation in the wilderness
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2022 14:37:36 GMT -5
D"There are your carnivore angels in heaven eating meat in heaven – angel food R" No Dave, have you never seen manna on earth? Same manna in heaven? It doesn't look or taste like meat? You can read the story of manna falling onto the earth. It's been tested in a lab too. spiritualsprings.org/ss-1506.htmSO yes the angels are in heaven in 3D biology eating real food, and they have a form not revealed to humans on earth, as your verse you quote to me is saying. And their matter their bodies are made from do not have any entropy in it. Really you should let Gnostic views go, it's deceiving you. Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 14, 2022 20:25:05 GMT -5
D"There are your carnivore angels in heaven eating meat in heaven – angel food R" No Dave, have you never seen manna on earth? Same manna in heaven? It doesn't look or taste like meat?
Psa 78:25 Man did eat angels' food: …. OK – manna – from where – the air or heaven
If you say heaven – then why do you omit the rest of scripture
Psa 78:25 … he sent them meat to the full. Psa 78:26 He caused an east wind to blow in the heaven: and by his power he brought in the south wind. Psa 78:27 He rained flesh also upon them as dust, and feathered fowls like as the sand of the sea:
Flesh from heaven – angel food = meat / flesh / fowl
If you say heaven – then angel food includes meat / flesh According to you – this is only possible because your satan rewrote all their DNA after Eve took a bite According to you – all of God’s angels are corrupt
OR – the word heaven here = a physical manifestation of this world – and has ZERO reference to the diet of angels in heaven
Your argument – your teaching – does it hold up – or is it contradictory?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2022 14:07:53 GMT -5
D" OR – the word heaven here = a physical manifestation of this world – and has ZERO reference to the diet of angels in heaven
Your argument – your teaching – does it hold up – or is it contradictory?R" You do realize that Scripture which is mostly poetic can be written off without doubting minds, as you clearly do? Ps 78:2 I will open my mouth in a parable: I will utter dark sayings of old: 3 Which we have heard and known, and our fathers have told us. The prayer begins as a poetic utterance, that all Jewish fathers know. hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/questions/49533/do-angels-eat-physical-foodThis person's comments are good readPs 78:11 And forgat his works, and his wonders that he had shewed them. 12 Marvellous things did he in the sight of their fathers, in the land of Egypt, in the field of Zoan. The prayer is a list of all the wonders Israel chose to forget.... Ps 78:13 He divided the sea, (this is literal and physical) Ps 78:14 God led them with a cloud, and all the night with a light of fire. (this is literal and physical) Ps 78:15 He clave the rocks "tsuwr" in the wilderness, and gave them drink as out of the great depths. 16 He brought streams also out of the rock "Cela" This is a fantastic prayer utterance, in similes and parables. It is saying that TWO Divine Beings were with Israel, the Father tsuwr and the Son cela. (but you do not like a Family Elohiym Power do you?) The Father sent His messenger to be for Israel, because the Father got tired of their sinning all the time, who was the messenger, Jesus His Son, who alone pardons sin. Ps 78:23 Though he had commanded the clouds from above, and opened the doors of heaven, There are several meanings of heaven, the earth skies, the space beyond, and where God lives. Considering the almighty wonders in this prayer, one would be foolish indeed to quibble over the details of "heaven" as you do, it's like saying "parting the Red Sea was a local physical affair, and did not come as a Power from Heaven" "God opened the doors of heaven", is manna a miracle wonder from GOD or not? Or is manna just a physical rarity that Gods causes to come from out of the earth? Ex 16:4 Then said the LORD unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no. Here is a simile saying "God will rain bread from heaven" So the ten commandment law, the simile here, did not come from heaven? The simile of manna is not from where God is? And the power spoken here is not from heaven either, God spoke on earth, so the power is earthly....the ten commandments are not from heaven either, only from earth for earthlings only.... really Dave you are a doubter aren't you? Ps 78:24 And had rained down manna upon them to eat, and had given them of the corn of heaven. Same idea here, "God rained bread from heaven" so this didn't happen and it didn't come from where God lives, even though God provided the miracles every day. Or maybe the simile is just referring to the words of torah, no literal food is intended? really Dave you are a doubter aren't you? Did you read my link to the manna that falls today on earth? Obviously not? Ps 78:25 Man did eat angels' food: Sure the Hebrew word "abbiyr" means "mighty" ? Ps 22:12 Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round. 13 They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion. A prayer prophecy about Jesus during His cross ordeal.... the strong mighty ones gather around Him as a roaring lion? Who are these ? Princes. Greek archons, Hebrew sar. Sinning angels bent on trying to get Jesus to sin. Ps 50:13 Will I eat the flesh of bulls, or drink the blood of goats? Eating the flesh of mighty and drinking their blood, is a simile of what I wonder, the worship of these sinning angels claiming to be your Saviour. The link says this " Why were so many tons of bread/food in heaven? Why is it the food of heaven or the grains of heaven as per the Hebrew if no one in heaven consumes it? Why is God growing grains in heaven by the tons. Seeing Jesus is quoting the Septuagint and not the Hebrew (He says food not grain of heaven), it would follow that He didn’t have an issue with the Septuagint translation which in the next verse speaks of this food as that of angels" Now back to the real problem You do not see Jesus in clad in 3D biological form as He went up into heaven with. You seem to think Jesus left His old body with scars on it behind on the way to heaven, took off his old garment and put on the new restored garment. If that is the case, the sacrifice would not be " life for life": would it? The judgements in the ten commandments are very important to read.... Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, So if the Divine Jesus comes to restore the mischief done by the mischief maker, the exchange is eternal life for eternal life, and the mischief maker get eternal death. So Jesus retains the old body in heaven with its RA-scars of SIN, the only memorial to the problems of dealing with SIN. Now in all these twisting you do, I do not invent stuff, I use the Scriptures for all the themes I present, but you ignore some verses you don't like, and here is yet another verse you don't like, it's becoming a pattern Dave, so many verses you don't like and twist to whittle away their meaning. Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 15, 2022 20:15:05 GMT -5
D"OR – the word heaven here = a physical manifestation of this world – and has ZERO reference to the diet of angels in heaven Your argument – your teaching – does it hold up – or is it contradictory? R" You do realize that Scripture which is mostly poetic can be written off without doubting minds, as you clearly do? 1- You post scripture to make a point of fact – angel food from heaven – proof of biology 2- when you find yourself in a satan contradiction – you claim metaphor
You have absolute rules others must follow - why don't your own doctrines apply to yourself? Mr consistant
H8064 - שָׁמֶה שָׁמַיִם - shâmayim shâmeh – heaven, air, sky There are several meanings of heaven, the earth skies, the space beyond, and where God lives. OH Polysemy in Hebrew – how is that consistent with the rest of your Robert method
Ps 78:24 And had rained down manna upon them to eat, and had given them of the corn of heaven. Same idea here, "God rained bread from heaven" so this didn't happen and it didn't come from where God lives, even though God provided the miracles every day. Or maybe the simile is just referring to the words of torah, no literal food is intended? How does this prove as fact the diet of the angels in heaven? -------------
You do not see Jesus in clad in 3D biological form as He went up into heaven with. You seem to think Jesus left His old body with scars on it behind on the way to heaven, took off his old garment and put on the new restored garment. EXCUSE ME – changed – twinkle of an eye – not sure what we will be Just to be clear - changed = NOT THE SAME - DIFFERENT
If that is the case, the sacrifice would not be "life for life": would it? SORRY BUDDY BOY - JESUS DIED A MORTAL DEATH ON THE CROSS
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2022 16:00:44 GMT -5
D"EXCUSE ME – changed – twinkle of an eye
R" Yes we change from being with a body of RA corrupted from our sinnings, to a body that is holy and restored with any entropy in it...wow...what a 3D biology that will be.
D" SORRY BUDDY BOY - JESUS DIED A MORTAL DEATH ON THE CROSS
SO you deny this verse too?
Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
Jesus had to offer something for eternity, to pay for our living for eternity.... A simple death on the cross in the temporary body is not life for life is it?
For more details, see my other post
Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 17, 2022 2:52:29 GMT -5
D"EXCUSE ME – changed – twinkle of an eye R" Yes we change from being with a body of RA corrupted from our sinnings, to a body that is holy and restored with any entropy in it...wow...what a 3D biology that will be. Correct – different – not as we are now – but as he is NOT 3D as in this 3D world
D" SORRY BUDDY BOY - JESUS DIED A MORTAL DEATH ON THE CROSS SO you deny this verse too?
Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, D" SORRY BUDDY BOY - JESUS DIED A MORTAL DEATH ON THE CROSS
Jesus had to offer something for eternity, to pay for our living for eternity.... A simple death on the cross in the temporary body is not life for life is it? You deny the Cross and Resurrection is enough to atone for the sins of mankind? You deny the Resurrection Jesus is dead – God died 2000 years ago – and is gone from existence Jesus is dead and gone – like Caesar Just what type of Christian are you?
I am afraid Ellen White has you seriously screwed up If you say you are a Christian and believe Jesus Christ is dead in the grave You are seriously screwed up
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2022 15:44:11 GMT -5
Dave" You deny the Cross and Resurrection is enough to atone for the sins of mankind? You deny the Resurrection
Rob" I deny no such thing,
But you do not support Scripture....
Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
It says LIFE for LIFE, more than just rising from the dead... its says eternal LIFE for eternal LIFE.
If it was just rising from the dead, why didn't a sinless human or a sinless angel die for our sins, not good enough.
Sheep are sinless? Not good enough.
Angels are sinless? Not good enough.
Has to be DIVINE, who alone is LIFE.
The DIVINE has to exchange eternal life for eternal life, profound cost yes. Such is the enormous cost to DIVINITY for humans rescued from the mischief maker.
Only the Divine has LIFE, not a sinless creature...
Do you even acknowledge this verse, a judgement on the verse, NO WOUNDING.
Question when the ARAM tricked Eve in sinning, did the ARAM WOUND Eve? Y/ N?
Yes, Even Jeff Benner says the ARAM deceived the woman with truth.
The penalty for wounding is eternal life for eternal life, a very extreme penalty indeed.
But you deny this? Why?
Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 18, 2022 3:34:20 GMT -5
But you do not support Scripture.... Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, its says eternal LIFE for eternal LIFE. The DIVINE has to exchange eternal life for eternal life, profound cost yes. Such is the enormous cost to DIVINITY for humans rescued from the mischief maker.
So your god is dead – died upon the cross - dead for all eternity
But you deny this? Why? BECAUSE GOD IS NOT DEAD
How do you get eternal life from the word 'nephesh'
H5315 - נֶפֶשׁ - nephesh From H5314; properly a breathing creature, that is, animal or (abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental): - any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, X dead (-ly), desire, X [dis-] contented, X fish, ghost, + greedy, he, heart (-y), (hath, X jeopardy of) life (X in jeopardy), lust, man, me, mind, mortality, one, own, person, pleasure, (her-, him-, my-, thy-) self, them (your) -selves, + slay, soul, + tablet, they, thing, (X she) will, X would have it.
I though you denied the eternaty of life - the only eternal life is god according to you Why do you teach god is dead If you deny the Trinity - why do you teach Christ is dead
The more we talk - the less Christian you sound - all to defend your satan god
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2022 15:39:13 GMT -5
D "So your god is dead – died upon the cross - dead for all eternity R" No, Jesus fully human has the breath of life making his soul live by the Breathing of the Father via the HS, as humans have. But the divinity part of Jesus, is not used as Jesus chose to get all his strength from the Father using faith, as Humans do, by quoting the words of the Father.
When Jesus died, the soul died, and the HS and the Father both left their Son in the grave, but the body did not decay, clearly mentioned in Scripture.
So why didn't it decay, because the Divinity of Christ kept it alive, not the presence of the breath of life, from the Father via the HS. When the Father and HS came down to restore the humanity in Jesus again, the breath of life came into the body again and so Jesus rose from the dead under the powers of the Father via the HS, and so we have Jesus living forever under the relationship of the Father and the HS, as humans have. Death is defined as separation of GOD permanently from you as a creature, thus you cease to exist. D'How do you get eternal life from the word 'nephesh' ? R" You don't?
D"Why do you teach god is dead... R" Scripture says Jesus was in the belly of the earth 3 days and 3 nights, not a permanent separation of the Father and HS. SO why do you misquote me, ask questions before you mock...
D" the only eternal life is god according to you R" Is that a problem, all living comes from GOD, who alone is immortal and the source of all living, God gifts His living to those worthy to receive ongoing living.
Shalom
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Aug 21, 2022 3:20:35 GMT -5
D "So your god is dead – died upon the cross - dead for all eternityR" No, Jesus fully human has the breath of life making his soul live Ex 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
It says LIFE for LIFE, more than just rising from the dead... its says eternal LIFE for eternal LIFE. When Jesus died, the soul died,… Then why do you preach that God is deadWhen Jesus died, the soul died, and the HS and the Father both left their Son in the grave, D" Why do you see 3 different and independent gods working together?R" Why do you assume " independent gods" ? Not in my view. When Jesus died, the soul died, and the HS and the Father both left their Son in the grave,Death is defined as separation of GOD permanently from you as a creature, thus you cease to exist. Moses died – why didn’t he cease to exist – fully alive and well in the Transfiguration Jesus died on the Cross – why do you teach he no longer exist - ChristianD"Why do you teach god is dead... R" Scripture says Jesus was in the belly of the earth 3 days and 3 nights, not a permanent separation of the Father and HS. SO why do you misquote me, ask questions before you mock...YES – Jesus – Son of Man – flesh and biology – was in the tomb for 3 days and nights (unless you are a Catholic and Jesus was crucified in Friday – then it was only 2 nights and 2 days)However Christ – Son of God – continued to LIVE and serve God 1Pe 3:18 For Messiah once suffered for sins also—the righteous for the unrighteous—in order to bring you to God. He was put to death in the flesh, but made alive by the Ruach. 1Pe 3:19 Through the Ruach He also went and preached to the spirits in prison. 1Pe 3:20 Long ago they disobeyed while God kept waiting patiently, in the days of Noah as the ark was being built. In that ark a few (that is, eight souls) were brought safely through water. 1Pe 3:21 Corresponding to that, immersion now brings you to safety—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but a pledge to God of a good conscience—through the resurrection of Messiah Yeshua. 1Pe 3:22 He has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels and authorities and powers subjected to Him. D" the only eternal life is god according to you R" Is that a problem, So the promise of eternal LIFE (John 3:16) is a false promise – it that what you preach now?
|
|