Biblical Textual Criticism

[Dave]

What is an "Original" Text of the Bible? - Biblical Textual Criticism
Jul 8, 2020 - Israel Bible Center

The oldest text – original text was written by hand – and then copied over and over

Jews and Christians believe that the Torah was given all at once – to Moses
Truth #1 – this is unlikely (1) the style is not consistent throughout indicating different authors – or written at different times (2) it also contain the record of the death and burial of Moses – obviously added after the fact
Truth – moot point – doesn’t matter – small detail

Truth #2 - Jerimiah? – Obviously NOT written by one man – or at one time – or during the lifetime of Jerimiah
This is true of a large part of ahl/OT scripture – Kings – Chronicles

Truth #3 - Ezekiel – was QUESTIONED by the Rabbis since it was written – does NOT agree with Torah Law

Truth #4 – By the Second Temple period – before Jesus Christ – the inter-testament period – the time of Egyptian Ptolemy’s LXX Temple Scroll / ahl/OT – Septuagint – circa. 250 BC
* There were thousands of copies of copies of copies through the centuries
Which copy? Which version? Which temple Scroll did the 70 Rabbi’s use? - UNKNOWN

Truth #5 – Rome’s Received Text is 100% Erasmus Greek and the Septuagint (LXX)
**The 1611 KJV = Rome’s Received Text = Erasmus Greek and the Septuagint (LXX)

Truth #6 – the Masoretic Text is 100% the Westminster Leningrad Codex 1008 AD
The Hebrew Tanak of the Jews = Masoretic Text = the Westminster Leningrad Codex (WLC)

Truth #7 – Today – modern Christian Bibles - and modern Jewish Tanak - are a composite of over 5500 ancient texts – they do not all agree – letter to letter – spelling to spelling

Is there older Greek an what Erasmus used – YES – in fragments
Does the older Greek fragments agree letter to letter – spelling to spelling – or even word for word – NO

Is there older Hebrew than the (WLC)? – YES – in fragments / in complete
Does the older Hebrew fragments agree with the (WLC) – letter to letter – spelling to spelling – or word for word – NO
ALEPO CODEX – we are told it was used to add and correct – something had to be different

Questions –
What do we call the base text for Christians? = Erasmus Greek + Ptolemy’s (LXX)
What is the base text for the Hebrew Tanak? = (WLC)
Are these two sources the same source – NO

Questions –
Do the older text – Greek or Hebrew – agree with what we consider the base text? - NO
(google) How many complete manuscripts does the Bible have?
There are over 5,800 complete or fragmented Greek manuscripts, 10,000 Latin manuscripts and 9,300 manuscripts in various other ancient languages, such as Syriac, Slavic, Gothic, Ethiopic, Coptic and Armenian.

How much do they differ – TRUTH
(google) total number of textual differences in scripture
… the number of non-spelling variants among New Testament manuscripts around 500,000, though he acknowledges his estimate is higher than all previous ones.

Actually – I always thought the numbers were 5500 ancient text + 2000 textual differences in 6500 places
Regardless – the number of textual criticisms = a lot – in many places

Questions –
How does religion / church / canon authority deal with many of these differences?

(google) Showing results for when was the first revision to the kjv
1881 = The result was the publication in 1881 of the English Revised Version,

Ecc 12:7 (12:8) (1611 KJV) Then shall the dust be turned agayne vnto earth from whence it came, and the spirite shall returne vnto God who gaue it.
Ecc 12:8 (12:9) All is but vanitie (saith the preacher) all is but playne vanitie.

Ecc 12:7 (1881 KJV) Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
Ecc 12:8 Vanity of vanities, saith the preacher; all is vanity.

Questions –
How does Judaism deal with many of these differences?

FACINATING CORRELATION – Revised KJV = 1881
The translation project began in 1882 with twenty-two translators working under the editorship of Marcus Jastrow, and expanded to include a committee of translators from both sides of the Atlantic led by Max Margolis.

Tanakh: The Masoretic Text Reform Movement
by Jewish Publication Society
For nearly a century, the 1917 translation of the Tanakh from the Jewish Publication Society has remained a prominent English translation of the Hebrew Bible. The 1917 Tanakh (base on the WLC) takes into account the Septuagint, the Targums, the Peshitta, the Vulgate, and numerous other translation traditions.

Is Scripture INFALIBLE
Answer – as to precept upon precept, line upon line – YES
Teaching upon teaching, message upon message commandment upon commandment – instruction upon instruction – ABSOLUTELY YES!
As for letter to letter, spelling to spelling, word for word – ABSOLUTELY NO!

Robert only wants to play word games – completely disregards context or grammar – all he can see is the surface level – misses the context altogether
No serious translator would ever build an enter doctrine around a single word

Robert falls to his knees and worships – this is the most important passage in all of his presentation
Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
Eze 28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned:
It is Robert’s answer for everything – satan did it – changed God’s Plan against God’s Will

Robert denies that Adam was the guardian messenger in Eden – there to tend the garden
Robert insist – Hebrew satan did it – changed God’s Plan against God’s Will

R Define what is a word game?

I will stop here Dave, because Rabbi SInger knocks your Gnostic religion so badly, you cannot have anything anything to do with it.
More of Robert’s False Witness
I am a Gnostic Christian – the Gnostic text I read were written by the authors of the agl/NT – James, John, Paul, Peter, Phillip and Thomas
Robert’s efforts to paint me as an ancient Gnostic without Christ is just an attack upon me, this Ministry, this forum, and the truth

Jan 19, 2022 15:07:08 GMT -5 @robertt said:

RP" Notice we become SONs of GOD? - what is the spirit of adoption?
D" To claim parentage of someone you did not biologically procreate
PRODIGAL SON adopted to THE Father – not our biological earthly sperm doner
R" OK but who was the creator of your spirit and spirit body living in your RA body? The Father is.

D"Yes –Rabbi Singer correctly presented the common criticism of ancient Gnosticism
R" Oh so for others who see Gnostic views, they see Gnostic as deception and wrong, we are misguided, while Dave see Gnostic views are true and faithful. Hmm? I think you are misguided.
Why do you deny the reality of David Ike?
Why do you deny the ministry of L.A. Marzuli?
Why do you deny the Reality of the Archon – but present Hebrew satan as the god of evil

Wee SDA do not have a god of evil, only an agent of sin.
MORE Robert word games = denial

Jun 5, 2020 18:55:58 GMT -5 @robertt said:

Yes I have two Kings and two gods opposing each other. What's wrong with that?

Everything is wrong with that. This is the adopted theology of the Zoroastrians, brought into Christianity by the Catholic Church. [/quote]You must understand that no one of Jewish persuasion will never agree with you
The Jews spent the entire ahl struggling against these pagan gods and their religions that infiltrate Jewish culture [/quote]

Please prove to me that satan is God’s opponet – here are the versesAnd your answer is

All your "hoo har" over 49 verses verses 23, doesn't matter, I need only one verse, apart from Ezek and Rev 12. There was war in heaven?

At least we have discovered the value of line by line – it doesn’t matter if it goes against Catholic doctrine[/quote]

Jan 19, 2022 15:07:08 GMT -5 @robertt said:

D"All the angels are not just fragments of the HS – they are unique and independent individuals
R" Can't you quote me correctly. The word ruwach does not mean HS literally for all verses, but the word "medium" for all verses, "wind" is a medium. HS means "holy medium" a functional descriptor of the Shadday allowing the Father's flow into a RA world.
Everything that lives Dave lives inside the medium of GOD, administrated by the HS.

This is called the pagan religion of pantheism
WE are all god - Rocks - trees - water – insects – cut them open and find God (HS)
On the sub-atomic level – I agree –

But you deny God can create life
You god only created a tov world – then your satan god change all of God’s Plan against God’s Will
You deny that God can create independent angelic life forms
You deny that God can create independent archon life forms
You deny that god can create man as a spiritual life form
All you have is biology and this world – the goal of the archon – just focus upon biology and world

Jan 19, 2022 15:07:08 GMT -5 @robertt said:

D"In Gnostic words – the mission of the archon is to keep man focused upon world – se we do not have time for devotion to the HS
R" We are not saved by devoting our time to the HS?

WHAT – we are not saved by devoting our lives to God – Jesus Christ
You are not a Christian – how can you write such a disrespectful thing

D"This is FUNCTION – physical – worldly – diet - has absolutely nothing to do with it
R" Again you are wrong Dave. Sorry. The vagus nerve runs from the brain to the stomach, so appetite is the first and most difficult sin to remove from our lives,
Biology – 3D corporeal world – is all you teach – because it is all you see