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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2021 14:12:18 GMT -5
Isa 28:7 You Dave have erred through wine, so that there is no place clean. 9 Whom shall he teach knowledge?
Isa 28:11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
Is this NOT saying the Hebrew tongue goes out into another tongue (translated) to this people?
Isa 28:12 as a refreshing: yet they would not hear.
SO sad, even when written in Greek, the Hebrew they still not not hear.
Isa 28:13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.
But still they fall backward and are broken and fail to fathom...
Isa 28:14 ¶ Wherefore hear the word of the LORD, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem.
SO GOD gives this over...
Isa 28:15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death,
Since they long for death, than death they shall have...
Isa 28:16 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone,
GOD sent a stone, but it was rejected.... this rock cela, was Jesus.
So what language is salvation written in? Hebrew or Greek? both
Yes but who is the older language of salvation ? Hebrew or Greek? Hebrew
Thus the former torah is the father of the latter torah which was sent.
I asked you for your understanding of this passage.
Give me an answer in Greek or Hebrew than, whatever you think the passage means ?
Ro 10:1 ¶ Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. 5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them. 6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:) 7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.) 8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Indeed how is a person saved?
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Apr 30, 2021 7:36:35 GMT -5
Isa 28:7 You Dave have erred through wine, so that there is no place clean. WOW you wrote me into scriptureIsa 28:11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. Is this NOT saying the Hebrew tongue goes out into another tongue (translated) to this people? OK – Greek was the most tightly constructed language on earth – and it was the most common language throughout the known world at the time of JesusIsa 28:13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. D" I asked for a scripture - R Man was given the ability to reason? I remember reading 30 years ago of a Japanese scientist doing experiments in a preflood world, lots of humidity, remove radiation, increase O2 level, and provide better soil, etc. He found animals grew larger and lived longer. I think he ran the O2 levels to 27 % much more than we have today. You have to assume Which is it Robert – make assumptions or precept upon preceptIf it is precept upon precept, line upon line – then satan opposes man NOT GOD Or let us return to the 23+49 verses and study them again Isa 28:14 ¶ Wherefore hear the word of the LORD, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem. SO GOD gives this over... Isa 28:15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, Since they long for death, than death they shall have... I thought your God was LOVE and patient waiting for all to be saved If I say God lays his hand upon them – you say no way it is the god satan But you can say – God gives them over – and that’s different word manGive me an answer in Greek or Hebrew than, whatever you think the passage means ? Ro 10:1 -9 - Indeed how is a person saved?and shalt believe in thine heart – has nothing to do with intellect, knowledge, or worshipIf you are walking in the spirit – you are following the Law – whether you know the law or not Abraham did – long before the Law was given Gen 26:5 because Abraham listened to My voice and kept My charge, My mitzvot, My decrees, and My instructions.”
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2021 16:09:54 GMT -5
D"Ro 10:1 -9 - Indeed how is a person saved? and shalt believe in thine heart – has nothing to do with intellect, knowledge, or worship
R Has everything to do with intellect, knowledge and worship
You missed talking about an important word here "believe" What does "believe" mean?
The word "heart" lab, refers to the way those actions come into the mind and make attitudes of the heart.
Happy Shabbat
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Post by Dave on May 1, 2021 7:49:38 GMT -5
D"Ro 10:1 -9 - Indeed how is a person saved? and shalt believe in thine heart – has nothing to do with intellect, knowledge, or worship R Has everything to do with intellect, knowledge and worshipSo retarded people cannot be saved in your world People who have suffered brain damage in a accident – also lost to hell What a merciless god you have WorshipSo – if you are in prison and forced to work on the Sabbath – you cannot be saved Do you follow all 613 Laws or do you get to pick and choose which rituals you need to do That POOR GUY on the cross next to Jesus didn’t have time for any of theat You missed talking about an important word here "believe" What does "believe" mean?BELIVE means – you think it so with your intellect / brain / mind But – with more information – beliefs can change – and they do all the time Belief and Faith are two totally different thingsOne is based upon hope – and one is based in gnosisYou can believe that you will live forever – but you would be wrong I gnosis fire is hot and I will never deliberately stick my hand in a flame Paul believed Jesus was a man that caused trouble for his peoplePaul was taken from this earth into the third heaven and met Jesus face to faceAfter that – Paul gnosis – and was changedDid this mean Paul became a perfect man that cannot sin – NO It changed him into a repented man ashamed of his own fleshMiserable man that I amBut you doubt that Paul's experience - written in agl scripture is even possible You would call it Glossolalia - or some other WORD you could argue These types of event cannot happen to people you say You say it must be a long slow process of ritual worship You don't even believe agl scripture - or at least you attempt to cast doubt upon Paul's BORN AGAIN experience - I know who you are
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2021 15:49:32 GMT -5
Is God a GOD of love that He cannot overlook some sin offerings NOT unto death? Not all sinning is unto death, the torah says. Sure any intellectual handicapped person can be saved. Why do you suppose salvation is hard? Paul never experienced Glossolalia so why do you mock Paul's experience? Paul was humble and meek enough for Jesus to do many public miracles through Paul.
Believe is from the family of words of amanuah, a concept of something you seem not to understand.
The Jews didn't do amanuah, for Paul wrote concerning most Jews:
Ro 10:1 ¶ Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
SO most Jews in Israel do not do amanuah. Hence were never saved by GOD.
Ro 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that amanuah.
This word is explained only once in the OT, and most of us miss understanding the meaning.
Ex 17:12 But Moses' hands were heavy; and they took a stone, and put it under him, and he sat thereon; and Aaron and Hur stayed up his hands, the one on the one side, and the other on the other side; and his hands were steady until the going down of the sun.
Here is amanuah used here, explaining what the word means.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on May 2, 2021 0:29:58 GMT -5
Paul never experienced Glossolalia so why do you mock Paul's experience? Paul was a Born Again Christian – 100% spiritual
2Co 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven. 2Co 12:3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) 2Co 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.
I am not the one that mocks the spirit
Here is amanuah used here, explaining what the word means. Sure Robert – everyone who believes and remains steady till the end is saved It is not the same as being Born Again of spirit and has nothing to do with Paul's experience
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2021 16:19:50 GMT -5
D" and heard unspeakable words,
R" Yes Dave, but this is NOT Glossolalia
You are assuming something not in the text.
D" Here is amanuah used here, explaining what the word means. Sure Robert – everyone who believes and remains steady till the end is saved It is not the same as being Born Again of spirit and has nothing to do with Paul's experience
R" steady is NOT a meaning for all contexts of amanuah. "support" is a better English term
Paul quotes directly how to be saved by amanuah.
Ro 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
No mention of your "It is not the same as being Born Again of spirit and has nothing to do with Paul's experience"
It has everything to do with amanuah and Paul.
When Paul "met Jesus face to face" on the road, being blinded, He began to support Jesus. That is what amanuah is all about.
What happened when Paul was baptised? The HS empowered him with the presence of Jesus.
Ac 9:20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
And here is the same principles of being saved:
Ro 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Amanuah.
Ro 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Amanuah comes from hearing the words of GOD speak back to you.
But most people get the experience of amanuah wrong:
Ro 10:21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people. (KJV)
Paul goes on to explain what stops amanuah from working in so called Christians:
Ro 11:4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
BAAL is a Hebrew word referring to the completed action of serving SELF as a MASTER. Self prevents amanuah from working miracles in your life, because you do things using human powers, rather than allowing GOD's powers from amanuah to work in you instead.
Ro 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works:
Humans who have sinned do not deserve amanuah, yet God's grace allows us to use amanuah even while we are sinners. Our works are God's works in us, not our human works of pious doings.
Ro 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off,
Many of Israel do not use amanuah, so GOD grafts in Gentiles who do use amanuah.
Ro 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God,
Notice the passage is still speaking of amanuah
Ro 12:6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
Paul now changes to the gifts of amanuah, not all receive the same...
Ro 12:9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good. 10 Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;
Notice Paul mentions both Hebrew words of love here close to the flow of amanuah in us.
Ro 12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him;
Practical applications from amanuah
Ro 13:1 ¶ Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers.
Respect Government
Ro 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Here Paul says love is the summation of the ten commandments.
Ro 14:1 ¶ Him that is weak in the faith receive ye,
Than Paul speaks of those weaker in amanuah...
Does this mean all the ceremonial teachings can be abandoned? Hmm?
Ro 14:15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.
I once ate kangaroo meat offered to me by an Australian Aboriginal Pastor, not wishing to offend His faith, and accept his understanding of GOD. I feel the verse is referring to these situtations.
Ro 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin. (KJV)
Here Paul defines anything NOT of amanuah is SIN. In everything we do we must support GOD using HIS WORDS.
The word is a very big topic in your salvation Dave.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on May 2, 2021 18:22:39 GMT -5
Technically speaking Dave I should not be welcome to your Gnostic forum because I am clearly against Gnosticism and thus I am not supporting your forum. That is so obvious – just as with AHR – your purpose here is not to academically study the word of God – but to corrupt, tear down, and in the process you have no honor in your post AND here again you employ the Robert methodFirst – you misrepresent what I have said - But you doubt that Paul's experience - written in agl scripture is even possible You would call it Glossolalia - or some other WORD you could argue These types of events cannot happen to people you say You say it must be a long slow process of ritual worship Then – you can argue against yourself – just to make noiseD" and heard unspeakable words, R" Yes Dave, but this is NOT Glossolalia You are assuming something not in the text. I am assuming nothing – you are simply misrepresenting information just to opposeI know who you areR" Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them. If one part falls, all of it must fall. Your words – not mine So are you an honorable student - or – here to corrupt, tear down, and in the process you have no honor in your posts BECOMING MORE AND MORE IMPRESSED WITH SDA CHRISTIANITY
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2021 4:22:20 GMT -5
Sorry you feel that way, not my intention to tear you down. It would be a sad day if nobody discussed torah anymore for fear of hurting people because we have different views?
You are the first person (maybe the second) I have met who is actually willing to defend their views of Scripture. I find that admirable. How many emails would you get from an SDA Pastor or SDA elder? Just one or maybe 3 over the years, not one or two or three daily as we have shared together. I admire your willingness to talk with me, and I do enjoy reading your replies. You have influenced me to study more of the torah, to follow Gnostic writings for the first time.
There are some things we have in common, we both love reading Scripture. We also have the same view of the HS, as being feminine. My SDA fellow believers do not support this idea at all, and our public creed now requires us to affirm the HS as masculine.
I have always wanted to speak to Messanic Jewish ideas, and have enjoyed talking with you. Most Jews get turned off by trinity and see it as polytheism, but you seem to embrace a Christian view of this.
D" D" and heard unspeakable words, R" Yes Dave, but this is NOT Glossolalia
You are assuming something not in the text.
I am assuming nothing – you are simply misrepresenting information just to oppose I know who you are
I don't follow you Dave. Glossolalia is a highly defined word in the dictionary, referring to babbling of words that are not a known vernacular. Paul heard words, and we do not know anything about those words. Many churches seem to think speaking in tongues can be Glossolalia, when from Scripture speaking in tongues referred to known languages. It would have been great if I could have easily spoke pidgin when in PNG, preaching to them, but alas I did not pray for this miracle.
I am assuming nothing – you are simply misrepresenting information just to oppose
I am not trying to oppose or argue. Often we do not talk enough, so I misunderstand you. Sorry about that.
Enjoy your walk with GOD and be a blessing to others. SHalom
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Post by Dave on May 3, 2021 10:43:55 GMT -5
It would be a sad day if nobody discussed torah anymore for fear of hurting people because we have different views?It is even sadder when people misrepresent scripture to fit a human preceptScripture must validate itselfYou have a cherub chata that hates God and opposes God YET there is not a validating verse to be found Jews and non-Catholic Christians see satan as an angel working for the LORD And every scripture we discuss validates this view But you choose doctrine over scriptureYou are the first person (maybe the second) I have met who is actually willing to defend their views of Scripture. All I can do is witness – it is our mission – or commission – our purpose - the meaning of lifeJer 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you, and before you were born, I set you apart—I appointed you prophet to the nations.” I have always wanted to speak to Messanic Jewish ideas, and have enjoyed talking with you. Most Jews get turned off by trinity and see it as polytheism, but you seem to embrace a Christian view of this.All Hasidic Jews accept that God exist in a duality – male Father upon the throne and female Spirit shekeinah that radiates out from God and moves among the peopleThe agl teaches us that – Christ is the Creator who send the Comforter YHWY is CHRIST + shekeinah The only thing the agl adds to the ahl is that Christ is God – Christ is God on earth in the form of man D" D" and heard unspeakable words, R" Yes Dave, but this is NOT Glossolalia You are assuming something not in the text. I am assuming nothing – you are simply misrepresenting information just to oppose I don't follow you Dave. Glossolalia is a highly defined word in the dictionary, referring to babbling of words that are not a known vernacularWhat did I say? You pretend English is too hard to grasp - yet consider yourself an expert in ancient languages But you doubt that Paul's experience - written in agl scripture is even possible You would call it Glossolalia - or some other WORD you could argue These types of events cannot happen to people you say You say it must be a long slow process of ritual worship AND I was 100% correct – instead of answering if you believe scripture is correct when is says Paul was taken into heaven You change to subject to argue vocabulary – that has nothing to do with my statement Just to avoid answering You have influenced me to study more of the torah, YES - I challange you to pick up your game - you wish to speak as an expert - become oneto follow Gnostic writings for the first time.Follow? - The Kabbalah, Enoch, Mid Rash, Dead Sea Scrolls or Nag Hammadi Library are commentaries by the actual people of scripture They do not replace scripture - only add supplimentScripture is weighted by author - God says #1 - Christ says #2 - The Holy Spirit teaches #3 -messangers of God says #4 - prophets though whom God spoke #5 - Writtings of people who actually walked and talked with Jesus Christ before and after His resurrection OUT WEIGH anything written bt a Catholic Saint several centuries after the fact
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2021 14:09:42 GMT -5
You have a cherub chata that hates God and opposes GodDoes not Scripture say the wages of sin is death? Is this not opposing GOD? Does not GOD hate sin and oppose sin, but love the sinner and try to save him from sin? All Hasidic Jews accept that God exist in a duality – male Father upon the throne and female Spirit shekeinah that radiates out from God and moves among the peopleReally? what about this? “They were all filled with the Holy Spirit and spoke the word of God with boldness.” (Acts 4:31) Sometimes we need to ask the Holy Spirit to refill us with His strength. Written for Bibles for Jews, emailed to me. Suggests the HS is masculine?? AND I was 100% correct – instead of answering if you believe scripture is correct when is says Paul was taken into heavenOh I see. sorry my friend. this is a real experience. The only thing the agl adds to the ahl is that Christ is God – Christ is God on earth in the form of manYou mean to write modalism, but you don't "The only thing the agl adds to the ahl is that Christ is God – Christ is the Father on earth in the form of man" The Kabbalah, Enoch, Mid Rash, Dead Sea Scrolls or Nag Hammadi Library are commentaries by the actual people of scripture
They do not replace scripture - only add supplementI see. Writtings of people who actually walked and talked with Jesus Christ before and after His resurrection OUT WEIGH anything written bt a Catholic Saint several centuries after the factI see. Why weren't they highly prized in the common received text than? And compiled by AD 55 int he dead sea scrolls? Not all commentaries are recorded in the torah. Why is that? www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/2494730/jewish/Torah-and-Genocide-FAQ.htmThis is interesting read. What do you think? SHalom
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Post by Dave on May 3, 2021 16:27:41 GMT -5
All Hasidic Jews accept that God exist in a duality – male Father upon the throne and female Spirit shekeinah that radiates out from God and moves among the people
Really? what about this? “They were all filled with the Holy Spirit and spoke the word of God with boldness.” (Acts 4:31) Sometimes we need to ask the Holy Spirit to refill us with His strength.
Written for Bibles for Jews, emailed to me. Suggests the HS is masculine??
POINT – First you are confusing two different languages
H7307 – רוּחַ - rûach - feminine noun KJV Translation Count — Total: 378x The KJV translates Strong's H7307 in the following manner: Spirit or spirit (232x), wind (92x), breath (27x) etc etc
Root Word (Etymology) From רִיחַ (H7306) - verb The KJV translates Strong's H7306 in the following manner: smell (8x), touch (1x), quick understanding (1x), accept (1x).
In Hebrew what is the Holy Spirit – it is the touch, the smell (aroma), the quick understanding Through the FEMINE RAUCH (SPIRIT) = Holy Spirit = shekeinah that radiates out from God and moves among the people
In Hebrew the Male pronoun “He” never applies to a feminine word So why use it – Judaism is male centric – just like Christianity It is culturally disrespectful to call the Male Father “HER or SHE”
This is evidence that the Jews consider the Female shekeinah the Ruach of God HEBREW MODALITY
BUT – Your quoted scripture is Greek – The Book of Acts written by Luke the Greek Physician Act 4:31 καὶ δεηθέντων αὐτῶν ἐσαλεύθη ὁ τόπος ἐν ᾧ ἦσαν συνηγμένοι, καὶ ἐπλήσθησαν ἅπαντες Πνεύματος ῾Αγίου, καὶ ἐλάλουν τὸν λόγον τοῦ Θεοῦ μετὰ παρρησίας.
Πνεύματος ῾Αγίου, = Spirit (Capital – female) of the HOLY ONE (male and male) The female spirit of the Holy Male And cultural respect demands – the Holy One is male because Theos is Male
In Greek the other culprit is my favorite word G846 - αὐτός Which means just about any combination of - he, she, and it, possible
The only thing the agl adds to the ahl is that Christ is God – Christ is God on earth in the form of man You mean to write modalism, but you don't "The only thing the agl adds to the ahl is that Christ is God – Christ is the Father on earth in the form of man" You can argue all the vocabulary you choose Jesus Christ was God incarnate – God in the form of a man – 100% Divinity + 100% Mortality
Writtings of people who actually walked and talked with Jesus Christ before and after His resurrection OUT WEIGH anything written bt a Catholic Saint several centuries after the fact
I see. Why weren't they highly prized in the common received text than? And compiled by AD 55 int he dead sea scrolls? 1- the agl was not completed until 1625 – academic accuracy Your reference to the agl within the Dead Sea Scroll is error – academic accuracy 2- Why didn’t the Roman Authority include the texts that illuminate the Archon Answer – the Roman edit – you are not suppost to know this – you are not allowed to read this – just believe in Fallen Angels that teach God Grace is a myth – that teach people can fall from God – that teach that God's own created hates Him and has turned against God
And here you are 2000 years later doing all your best to continually deny our true struggle and enemy And suggest we should just believe in satan
Not all commentaries are recorded in the torah. Why is that?
(wiki) The following are mentioned in the Hebrew Bible: The Book of Jasher is mentioned in Joshua 10:13 and 2 Samuel 1:18 and also referenced in 2 Timothy 3:8.[1] From the context in the Book of Samuel, it is implied that it was a collection of poetry. Several books have claimed to be this lost text, some of which are discounted as pseudepigrapha. Certain members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints secured the copyright to a particular English translation of one of these and republished it in 1887 in Salt Lake City.[2] The Book of the Wars of the Lord[3] is mentioned in Numbers 21:14. It is speculatively associated with one of the Dead Sea Scrolls, the War of the Sons of Light Against the Sons of Darkness.[citation needed] The Book of the Wars of the Lord is also cited in the Book of Jasher (trans. Moses Samuel c. 1840, ed. J. H. Parry 1887) Chapter 90:48 as being a collaborative record written by Moses, Joshua and the children of Israel. The Chronicles of the Kings of Israel and Chronicles of the Kings of Judah are mentioned in the Books of Kings (1 Kings 14:19,29). They are said to tell of events during the reigns of Kings Jeroboam of Israel and Rehoboam of Judah, respectively. The Chronicles of the Kings of Israel is again mentioned in 1 Kings 16:20 regarding King Zimri, and many other times throughout 1 and 2 Kings. The Book of Shemaiah the Prophet and Visions of Iddo the Seer (also called Story of the Prophet Iddo or The Annals of the Prophet Iddo) is mentioned in the 2nd Book of Chronicles. (2 Chronicles 9:29, 2 Chronicles 12:15, 2 Chronicles 13:22). This book has been completely lost to history, save for its title. The Manner of the Kingdom. Referenced at 1 Samuel 10:25. The Acts of Solomon. Referenced at 1 Kings 11:41. The Annals of King David. Referenced at 1 Chronicles 27:24. The Book of Samuel the Seer. Also called Samuel the Seer or The Acts of Samuel the Seer, which could be the same as 1 & 2 Samuel. -Referenced at 1 Chronicles 29:29. The Book of Nathan the Prophet. Also called Nathan the Prophet or The Acts of Nathan the Prophet or History of Nathan the Prophet.[7] Referenced at 1 Chronicles 29:29, and also 2 Chronicles 9:29. The Book of Gad the Seer.[8] Referenced at 1 Chronicles 29:29. The Prophecy of Ahijah,[9] might be a reference to 1 Kings 14:2–18. Referenced at 2 Chronicles 9:29. The Book of the Kings of Judah and Israel.[10] Referenced in 2 Chronicles 16:11, 2 Chronicles 27:7 and 2 Chronicles 32:32. Might be the same as 1 & 2 Kings. The Book of Jehu,[11] could be a reference to 1 Kings 16:1–7. Referenced at 2 Chronicles 20:34. The Story of the Book of Kings.[12] Referenced at 2 Chronicles 24:27. The Acts of Uzziah. Also called The Book by the prophet Isaiah. Perhaps the same as the Book of Isaiah.[7] Referenced at 2 Chronicles 26:22. The Vision of Isaiah.[13] Referenced at 2 Chronicles 32:32. The Acts of the Kings of Israel. Also called The Acts and Prayers of Manasseh.[14] May be identical to The Book of the Kings of Israel, above. Referenced at 2 Chronicles 33:18. The Sayings of the Seers.[15] Referenced at 2 Chronicles 33:19. The Laments for Josiah. Also called Lamentations. This event is recorded in the existing Book of Lamentations. Referenced at 2 Chronicles 35:25. The Chronicles of King Ahasuerus.[16] Referenced at Esther 2:23, Esther 6:1, Esther 10:2, and Nehemiah 12:23. Deuterocanon See also: Deuterocanonical books Book (or Wisdom) of Ahikar referenced by Tobit 1:22, Tobit 2:10, Tobit 11:18, Tobit 14:10[17] Aesop's fable of The Two Pots referenced at Sirach 13:2–3[17] The Egyptian Satire of the Trades, or another work in that tradition[18] referenced at Sirach 38:24–39:11 "The archives" referenced by 2 Maccabees 2:1[17] Memoirs of Nehemiah referenced by 2 Maccabees 2:13,[17] could be the same as the Book of Nehemiah. "letters of the kings" referenced by 2 Maccabees 2:13[17] "five books by Jason of Cyrene" referenced by 2 Maccabees 2:23: the author of 2 Maccabees here tells us that the work is abridged from the history by Jason. "the king's letter" referenced by 2 Maccabees 11:22[17] New Testament Mennonite scholar David Ewart has mentioned that Nestle's Greek New Testament lists some 132 New Testament passages that appear to be verbal allusions to paracanonical books.[19]
Pagan authors quoted or alluded to:[20][21]
Menander, Thais 218 (1 Cor. 15:33) Epimenides, de Oraculis, (Titus 1:12–13, where Paul introduces Epimenides as "a prophet of the Cretans," see Epimenides paradox) Aratus, Phaenomena 5, (Acts 17:28, where Paul refers to the words of "some of your own poets") Non-canonical books quoted or alluded to:[20]
Book of Enoch (Jude 1:4, 1:6, 1:13, 1:14–15,[22] 2 Peter 2:4; 3:13,[23][24] and John 7:38 [25]). The Book of Jannes and Jambres, according to Origen (2 Timothy 3:8 "... as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses") Epistle to the Laodiceans (Colossians 4:16 "read the epistle from Laodicea") Life of Adam and Eve (2 Corinthians 11:14 "Satan as an angel of light", 12:2 "Third Heaven")[26] A lost section of the Assumption of Moses (2 Timothy 3:8, Jude 9 "Michael.. body of Moses") Martyrdom of Isaiah (Hebrews 11:37 "they were sawn in two")
Not all commentaries are recorded in the torah. There are many commentaries referred to in scripture You declare them all to be error - Why is that?
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2021 14:08:52 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know so many other books are not added to the common received text.
Thanks for posting them here.
The Jews only copied a selection of torah they considered inspired, and the Hebrew adding of letters and rows of letters required a certain number of letters, no more no less. A single yud would have spoiled the mathematical precision.
2- Why didn’t the Roman Authority include the texts that illuminate the Archon Answer – the Roman edit – you are not supposed to know this – you are not allowed to read this – just believe in Fallen Angels that teach God Grace is a myth – that teach people can fall from God – that teach that God's own created hates Him and has turned against God
I see.
Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
There was no war in heaven, just a bustle
Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. 7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh( from angels), are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. 8 ¶ Likewise also these filthy dreamers (angels) defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities. 9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil (angels) he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
This entire passage is about angels, sinning angels, who
left their first estate some are held in chains for judgement some caused humans to sin and made GOD destroy Sodom because of terrible depravities some defile the flesh even the chief angel fights over those GOD claimed to have saved, ie Moses
This entire passage you ignore
Eze 28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
Here it says a cherub sinned, but you ignore this too, and say the cherub is really a human, or talking about humans in a poetry sense... you ignore the poetry language of the simile, the allegory and the poetry representation of something like something else.
Thy word is a lamp, a light unto my path. Similes, Show something to mean something else.
The dark ages were meant to be an age of reformation, learning the correct truth from torah, an awakening.
Da 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
A prophetic awakening time, people came to learn truth, hidden by deception.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on May 4, 2021 16:05:29 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know so many other books are not added to the common received text.YES YOU DID – we had long discussions about your precious Textus ReceptusNo Jew every had an authorized received text of anything – they had a collection of Temple Scrolls They had a Temple Library – and texts were rare and expensive so every Temple did not have the exact same Library The Dead Sea Scrolls – contain about 2000 different documents The Nag Hammadi Library is a collection of scrolls from a 2nd Century Messianic Christian Temple I listed for you in the past all the text that a Jewish Rabbi would learn from – a lot of them the same as I just listed again The difference is – If a Jew was in the possession of a writing by King Solomon – he would respect itYou demand that King Solomon is a liar or the text is a forgeryIn the 2nd Century Messianic Christian Temple if they had possession of writings by the disciples of Jesus Christ they respected themYou demand they all must be liars and forgeries 2- Why didn’t the Roman Authority include the texts that illuminate the Archon Answer – the Roman edit – you are not supposed to know this – you are not allowed to read this – just believe in Fallen Angels that teach God Grace is a myth – that teach people can fall from God – that teach that God's own created hates Him and has turned against God I see. - There was no war in heaven, just a bustleAND YOU REGURGITATE CATHOLIC CATACISM OF FALLEN ANNGELS Too bad you are not will to objectively study those passages Everytime we do – you avoid the conclusions and change the subjectIf you are a Roman Catholic – which all Western Christendom is – these aliens will destroy the religion because it will prove the religion wrongWhy will the aliens prove Roman Christendom wrong?BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT ANGELS – or fallen angels – or satanic demons even They will be 3D creatures of matterBECAUSE THEY ARE NOT ANGELS – they are shedim – archon – principalities and power And who is in charge of this deceiving antichrist power?
Hab 1:5 ¶ Behold ye among the heathen, and regard, and wonder marvellously: for I will work a work in your days, which ye will not believe, though it be told you. 6 For, lo, I raise up the Chaldeans, that bitter and hasty nation, which shall march through the breadth of the land, to possess the dwellingplaces that are not theirs.
Jesus is. Jesus does this wonder of wonder, closing earth history down. Brings in the deceiving spirit. Why? to wake us up one last time. And you say this is proof the opposer is on GOD's side? Wait for it - Jesus does this wonder of wonder, closing earth history down. Brings in the deceiving spirit.And you say this is proof the opposer is on GOD's side?Who brings the deceiving spirit? Jesus does / God does – God’s Will / God’s Plan And what does the deceiving spirit do – what Jesus brings this wonder of wonder to do = closing earth historyJesus does this - are you going to argue now that Jesus is not on God’s side – in some way you believe Jesus opposes God and God Will – you are filled with opposition to everything – everything opposes everything for you – you are obsessed with your opposer Or answer the question - why is it a sin for th decieving spirit to obey Jesus or God
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2021 4:09:56 GMT -5
D" The difference is – If a Jew was in the possession of a writing by King Solomon – he would respect it You demand that King Solomon is a liar or the text is a forgery In the 2nd Century Messianic Christian Temple if they had possession of writings by the disciples of Jesus Christ they respected them You demand they all must be liars and forgeriesR" One has to ask the question Dave, deceive the very elect, remember the prophecy. So how can we be sure these are inspired? Test them against known torah, first Moses torah. I have done tests using Martin Luther material and find it 70% inspired, possibly a lack of material to test for, or a non-inspired prophet. Any writer who is not a prophet, is non-inspired by definition, hence not considered worthy of consideration, one must draw a line somewhere. And all prophetic writers have to be 100% inspired, or the whole of the writer's writings are false. That includes my Ellen White too. I believe she wrote down all the Lord Jesus told her to write, nothing is secular. However she did write secular stuff, that is not considered the Spirit of Prophecy. I have tested some Gnostic writings and find them unworthy of consideration, sorry. However I do admire the way you pick and choose the best bits for your faith, and I admire this of you, and those presentations make sense, but that is not how we use prophetic writings, all of it must be inspired. A common way I test prophetic writings is to match the word meaning they write against Ancient Hebrew meanings, few Jews would know, the inner circles will. Some say Moses didn't write Ancient Hebrew, but according the Jeff Benner Moses did. This Ancient Hebrew is generally not known to modern Jews, and so I use the meanings to test prophetic writings. Do you have a link to a large amount of supplementary material, so I can test it between us, and show you how I do this? I find this is the most scientific objective way to test the spirits as the Bible says. The material must allow me to search many thousands of words and sentences, otherwise the probability of testing is too low. spiritualsprings.org/ss-1381.htm A comaprison test of both Martin Luther and Ellen White. The words I use for the test: (1) Ab----------------Father & Fruit (2) El------------------Strong Authority (3) Elohiym ------------Heavenly Powers (4) Echad----------------Unity or united (5) Tamiyd---------------Daily or continual (6) Chata and Chataah ----Sin and Sin-offering (7) Tsachaq ---------------- Mock & Laugh (8) Torah ----------------Teachings & Rain (9) cela and twusr---Rock similes of Jesus, Father (10) Qahal ---------- Assembly or Church These meanings come directly from Jeff Benner, hence do not come with my personal religious bias. (number 9 is unique to myself?) Any prophet who has a 100% match for all these words, I would see as inspired. ----------------------------- D" Or answer the question - why is it a sin for the deceiving spirit to obey Jesus or GodR" In answer to the rest of your post, Remember the story of the parents with two wayward children. The Parents are always in control. So the parents allow the wicked son to rise up and corrupt the wayward son, in the hope that the wayward son repents and returns to the parents. You have assumed just because parents give permission for the wicked son to influence the wayward son, that this means the parents approve of the wicked son's intentions. I understand perhaps that the wicked son is not opposing the parents, but only rebelling against the parents rules of love. But aren't we splitting straws? That why the Jews under KJV translators advice chose "Adversary" rather than "Opposer", because an sinning angel cannot truly oppose GOD, at best only be an Obstacle. So I am wondering what about this English meaning for Satan verb obstaclizing (looks like NOT an English word?) noun obstacle This aligns more with adversary, than opposer, and fits our discussions better. My only problem with obstacle, over opposer is the fact that obstacle cannot be personified, whereas an Opposer can. And really to be fair to GOD rules of love, any creature who sins is technically opposing GOD and everything GOD as love stands for. I am beginning to see your view, with GOD sending or allows a deceiving spirit. However I would not see this as the deceiving spirit being on GOD's side, rather as GOD allowing the deceiving spirit permission to do what comes naturally to him, ie do more sinning. SHalom
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