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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2020 13:45:33 GMT -5
Greetings Dave
Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
How many wars in heaven? One How many opposers? One with his army of angels
How many wars on earth? One How many opposers? One with many different marketing ways to deceive.
Re 18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
How many Babylons are there ? One
Who fornicates with her? The whole world does.
Only the remnant church of Jesus does not.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jun 24, 2020 17:16:36 GMT -5
Your Point?
I have offered evidence that this verse speak to Islam It cannot apply to Rome or Catholicism
Rev 17:8 The beast that you saw was, and is not, and yet is about to rise up from the abyss and head for destruction. Those who dwell on the earth—whose names have not been written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world—will be astonished when they see the beast, because he was and is not and is to come. Rev 17:9 This calls for a mind having wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman is seated. They are also seven kings— Rev 17:10 five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; and when he comes, he must remain a little while.
What are the five fallen hills of Rome? This is the Ottoman Empire
Rev 18:2 He cried out with a mighty voice, saying: “Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great! She has become a den for demons, a haunt for every unclean spirit and for every unclean bird and for every unclean and detestable beast. Rev 18:3 For all the nations have drunk of the wine of the fury of her immorality. The kings of the earth have committed sexual immorality with her, and the merchants of the earth grew rich off the power of her self-indulgence.”
What is the wine that the whole world drunk upon? How do merchants of the world get rich off of Rome? Islamic oil
Isaiah 21 - clearly places babylon in Arabia
The destruction of Mystery Babylon cane bee seen from the red sea - Christian Jer 49:21 (KJV) The earth is moved at the noise of their fall, at the cry the noise thereof was heard in the Red sea.
Jews say - sea of reeds Jer 49:21 (LTV) The earth will tremble at the noise of their downfall. The sound of their outcry will be heard at the Sea of Reeds.
Rome is not visable from either sea - Mecca is
Mat 24:26 (KJV) Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: Mat 24:26 (TLV) “So if they say to you, ‘Look, He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out. Or, ‘Look, He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it.
Rome is not in the desert or wilderness
Isa 34:9 Its streams will be turned into pitch, its dust into brimstone, and its land will become burning tar. Isa 34:10 It will not be quenched night or day. Its smoke will go up forever. From generation to generation it will lay waste—forever and ever none will pass through it.
It is about oil - Arabia - Islam
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2020 13:55:44 GMT -5
Greetings Dave
Your write: "I have offered evidence that this verse speak to Islam It cannot apply to Rome or Catholicism
You present a really nice presentation about Islam, and oil, and things.
But you don't understand, Islam is just the right hand of Catholicism.
Babylon is a Hebrew word meaning confusion, and stands for the first global empire of mankind that was set up OPPOSING GOD. The Catholics established Islam, being older than Islam, not the other way round. This is why both religions are seen close to each other. But you don't see this. That is your view, and your glasses you wear.
You don't even like the OPPOSER idea, who OPPOSES GOD either?
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 ¶ Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. 5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? 6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. 7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
This "son of perdition" began to rise even in Paul's day, cannot be Islam, it has to be Pagan Rome, than eventually becomes Papal Rome.
Why a split of two global powers? One taking over the other?
I am not sure if you view the metal man of Daniel correctly, the first king was a gold kingdom showing Babylon. The second was Persia showing silver, with two kingdoms the Medes and Persians, because the two arms of the metal man, combine. The middle kingdom was one king in Bronze, Alexander the Great, which after he died split into 4 kingdoms, than came a dark harder kingdom, terrible it was, as the they iron ruled better over the other softer inferior metals, was Rome, but ROME is shown as two legs, West Rome (pagan Rome) and East Rome (papal Rome), and this picture of ROME fits how ROME came to be, and lastly is a kingdom of two strange metals, called "clay" the metals of silicon and aluminium, metals not seen before, that do not mix with iron, and are 10 kingdoms.
As powerful as Islam is (and mentioned in the Revelation), it does not get mentioned in Daniels vision of the metal man, only papal Rome does.
So the kingdoms mentioned all carry on with the religion ideas of Babylon, that they are the gateway to heaven, the Hebrew idea of confusion.
Paul speaks that this empire was opposing GOD in his day, and would continue to do so, until the end of time.
What day of Biblical Sabbath does Islam follow? or Catholics follow? or Jews follow? Which day is blessed by GOD in the Scriptures?
One day, the whole world will follow a global mandatory worship of Sunday Sabbath, just as the whole global world will follow a COV19 new world order. I get that Islam plays a important role in the conflict, but the real power behind it all is called Babylon, and all the kingdoms listed under her...
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
Here is a prophecy happening soon
Re 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. 12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast. 14 ¶ These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful. 15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. 16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. 17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. 18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth. (KJV)
Which city rules over the kings of the earth? The city has seven hills?
Only Rome fits this. Vatican city.
Notice the one world order exists for only one hour, or 3 weeks, before it falls. God does not allow it to continue, so it falls in a mighty crash. When does this happen? When global Sunday law begins. It begins in the USA, and 60 days later becomes a global Sunday law. Than the new world order begins, and lasts for only 3 weeks and crashes terribly. The COV19 is just the beginning of this arising.
Does this mean Jews and Islam people also follow Sunday? I guess so, but seems unlikely doesn't it? Perhaps the mark of this beast power can be done in two ways, either on the head or on the hand. During the days of Babel, under Nimrod, the first city of Babel, later Babylon was built.
This was a religious power...
Ge 10:9 He was a mighty hunter before the LORD: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the LORD. 10 And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar.
You say :
Isa 21:9 And, behold, here cometh a chariot of men, with a couple of horsemen. And he answered and said, Babylon is fallen, is fallen; and all the graven images of her gods he hath broken unto the ground. 10 O my threshing, and the corn of my floor: that which I have heard of the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, have I declared unto you. 11 ¶ The burden of Dumah. He calleth to me out of Seir, Watchman, what of the night? Watchman, what of the night? 12 The watchman said, The morning cometh, and also the night: if ye will enquire, enquire ye: return, come. 13 ¶ The burden upon Arabia. In the forest in Arabia shall ye lodge, O ye travelling companies of Dedanim.
Just how does Is 21, say this?
Jer 49:18 As in the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah and the neighbour cities thereof, saith the LORD, no man shall abide there, neither shall a son of man dwell in it. 19 Behold, he shall come up like a lion from the swelling of Jordan against the habitation of the strong: but I will suddenly make him run away from her: and who is a chosen man, that I may appoint over her? for who is like me? and who will appoint me the time? and who is that shepherd that will stand before me? 20 Therefore hear the counsel of the LORD, that he hath taken against Edom; and his purposes, that he hath purposed against the inhabitants of Teman: Surely the least of the flock shall draw them out: surely he shall make their habitations desolate with them. 21 The earth is moved at the noise of their fall, at the cry the noise thereof was heard in the Red sea. 22 Behold, he shall come up and fly as the eagle, and spread his wings over Bozrah: and at that day shall the heart of the mighty men of Edom be as the heart of a woman in her pangs.
And how is this a context for your cause?
Notice:
Isa 14:4 ¶ That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
Isa 14:9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
Who is this about? Babylon?
Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
Why is this in the middle of Babylon story?
Isa 14:17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?
Who makes the humans into prisoners? Babylon does, but who is behind Babylon, this bright star is, who OPPOSES GOD.
Where have we seen this passage of yours, Jesus comes to rescue the souls in prison?
Isa 14:22 For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name,
See the whole passage is about Babylon still.
Isa 14:25 That I will break the Assyrian in my land,
Isa 14:29 Rejoice not thou, whole Palestina, because the rod of him that smote thee is broken: for out of the serpent's root shall come forth a cockatrice, and his fruit shall be a fiery flying serpent.
Isa 14:31 Howl, O gate; cry, O city; thou, whole Palestina, art dissolved: for there shall come from the north a smoke, and none shall be alone in his appointed times.
This north smoke, that stings as a scorpion is Islam, comes out from Babylon.
The whole of Is 47 is about Babylon, the lady of the kingdom of earth.
Jer 50:1 ¶ The word that the LORD spake against Babylon and against the land of the Chaldeans by Jeremiah the prophet
The whole of chapter 50 of Jerimiah
Jer 50:17 Israel is a scattered sheep; the lions have driven him away: first the king of Assyria hath devoured him; and last this Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon hath broken his bones.
Jer 51:1 ¶ Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will raise up against Babylon,
The whole of chapter 51 too
Jer 51:6 Flee out of the midst of Babylon, and deliver every man his soul:
Jer 51:7 Babylon hath been a golden cup in the LORD'S hand, that made all the earth drunken: the nations have drunken of her wine;
Get away from Babylonian false doctrines of religion...
Jer 51:13 O thou that dwellest upon many waters, abundant in treasures, thine end is come,
Whose the richest religion upon many peoples?
Jer 51:16 When he uttereth his voice, there is a multitude of waters in the heavens;
Whose voice is powerful over all the earth? pope?
Jer 51:24 And I will render unto Babylon and to all the inhabitants of Chaldea all their evil that they have done in Zion in your sight, saith the LORD. 25 Behold, I am against thee, O destroying mountain, saith the LORD, which destroyest all the earth:
Jer 51:28 Prepare against her the nations with the kings of the Medes, the captains thereof, and all the rulers thereof, and all the land of his dominion.
Jer 51:33 For thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; The daughter of Babylon is like a threshingfloor, it is time to thresh her: yet a little while, and the time of her harvest shall come.
Babylon has daughter cities? who are these?
Jer 51:45 My people, go ye out of the midst of her,
Where is spoken again?
Re 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
So if we don't identify Babylon, you will receive of her plagues.
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jun 25, 2020 18:44:47 GMT -5
Your write: " I have offered evidence that this verse speak to Islam It cannot apply to Rome or CatholicismBut you don't understand, Islam is just the right hand of Catholicism. If you would say that the archon are behind each – I would agree The archon are behind modern medicine The archon are behind evolution You want to prove that they are working in concertYou think too one dimensionallyIslam spent 1400 years killing Catholics Catholics spent 700 years killing Muslims Today – it is the Catholics and Oriental Christians that are being beheaded by Issis The Catholics established Islam, being older than Islam, not the other way round. So – who said Islam established Catholicism? Actually – Judaism is older than both – and is the foundation for bothI have a Koran - and I have read large sections of it Let’s study your concepts You don't even like the OPPOSER idea, who OPPOSES GOD either? We tried to study this – you failed to demonstrate one verse that proves the Hebrew word Accuser actually means God’s personal opposer - in every verse we studies - God used satan as a tool to facilitate God's Will The archon oppose man - and keep him buisy, or side tracked, or trapped in a religion doctrineThis "son of perdition" began to rise even in Paul's day, cannot be Islam, it has to be Pagan Rome, than eventually becomes Papal Rome. DUH – the son of perdition – is the spirit of the anti-Christ – false teachers – Agree Rome – then later Islam – then Later Protestantism – and all who keep catholic doctrine A miss direction – on multiple fronts - AGREE Why a split of two global powers? One taking over the other?If you did not deny Ezk 38 – you would never ask this question
I am not sure if you view the metal man of Daniel correctly, the first king was a gold kingdom showing Babylon. Ancient Babylon of the past - AgreeHere is a prophecy happening soon Mystery Babylon of Revelation end-timesRe 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. Mountains = nations – Ottoman Empire Rome – is a nation 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. Five Kings of these nations have fallen – Ottoman Empire How have five hills in Rome fallen? - 6 still remain 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. And all seven Kings are united under one beast / sar / archon / archon The only thing the nations of the Ottoman Empire had in common is Islam 12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast. 14 ¶ These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful. Islam making war against Christians - Agree 15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. 16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. 17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. Oops! Robert theology conflict – God does the ra to fulfill His will – uses ra as a tool – as Dave alwasys says 18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth. Which city rules over the kings of the earth? The city has seven hills?And the world has been kissing OPEC’s ass since the 1950’s Oil has become the petro-dollar of the entire globe All current wars are about energy – gas and oil
Only Rome fits this. Vatican city. Sorry – only if you ignore scripture – which I gave you Desert – red sea – all the cities of Mystery Babylon are in Arabia – not even close to Italy
Does this mean Jews and Islam people also follow Sunday? I guess so, but seems unlikely doesn't it? Non-believers are everywhere – what is your point?Perhaps the mark of this beast power can be done in two ways, either on the head or on the hand. I showed you this in image form (bismalah) – you reject any image except your ownDuring the days of Babel, under Nimrod, the first city of Babel, later Babylon was built. Interesting – data please – Babylon was built upon the Tower of BabbleScripture pleaseJust how does Is 21, say this? (Wiki) In the Book of Isaiah (Isaiah 21:11), Dumah is mentioned in the context of Seir, which was associated with the territory of Edom in the Negev region. www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/5039-dedanimDEDANIM (Hebr. ; R. V. Dedanites): By: Kaufmann Kohler, Bernhard Pick The descendants of the Arabian Dedan, spoken of (Isa. xxi. 13) as engaged in commerce. Dedan is first mentioned (Gen. x. 7; I Chron. i. 9) as a son of Raamah, son of Cush, and again (Gen. xxv. 3; I Chron. i. 32) as a son of Jokshan, son of Keturah. Dedan is found in Jer. xlix. 8, where Edomitish settlers seem to be referred to, as "Dedan" occurs in the prophecy against Edom; again in xxv. 23, with Tema and Buz; in Ezek. xxv. 13, with Teman, in the prophecy against Edom; and in Isa. xxi. 13 ("The burden upon Arabia. In the forest in Arabia shall ye lodge, O ye traveling companies of Dedanim"). As a Keturean tribe Dedan seems to have occupied a position in northwest Arabia. Regarding the reference to Dedan in Ezek. xxvii. 15, 20, which points to South Arabia, Gesenius and Winer suggest that the Keturean Dedan intermarried with the Cushite branch, and this theory of mixed descent gains weight from the fact that in each case the brother of Dedan is mentioned as Sheba. Thus the name of Dedan may apply to one tribe. (Wiki) - Edom (/ˈiːdəm/;[1][2] Edomite: 𐤀𐤃𐤌 ’Edām; Hebrew: אֱדוֹם ʼÉḏōm, lit.: "red"; Akkadian: 𒌑𒁺𒈠𒀀𒀀 Uduma; Syriac: ܐܕܘܡ) was an ancient kingdom in Transjordan located between Moab to the northeast, the Arabah to the west and the Arabian Desert to the south and east Let’s see – all Arabia – all ottoman Empire – zero percent ItalyJer 49:18 As in the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah and the neighbour cities thereof, saith the LORD, no man shall abide there, neither shall a son of man dwell in it. 19 Behold, he shall come up like a lion from the swelling of Jordan against the habitation of the strong: but I will suddenly make him run away from her: and who is a chosen man, that I may appoint over her? for who is like me? and who will appoint me the time? and who is that shepherd that will stand before me? 20 Therefore hear the counsel of the LORD, that he hath taken against Edom; and his purposes, that he hath purposed against the inhabitants of Teman: Surely the least of the flock shall draw them out: surely he shall make their habitations desolate with them. 21 The earth is moved at the noise of their fall, at the cry the noise thereof was heard in the Red sea. 22 Behold, he shall come up and fly as the eagle, and spread his wings over Bozrah: and at that day shall the heart of the mighty men of Edom be as the heart of a woman in her pangs. Edom – Teman – 100% Arabia 0% Rome Red Sea or even Reed Sea – both 100% visible if Arabia 0% visible if RomeAnd how is this a context for your cause? Notice: Isa 14:4 Isa 14:9 Who is this about? Babylon?Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. Why is this in the middle of Babylon story?Because it is a story of a man getting to big for his britches Any King or Man that thinks he can go against God’s Will is in error What happened to Stalin, Hitler, Cyrus, The King of Tyre, Michael Jackson, or Pope Gregory? Just like the planet venus that thinks it is the brighest in the sky - untill all creation proves it wrong
Right now the Ayatollah is calling for the destruction of Mecca and Israel Israel because it exist And Mecca because Saudi Arabia has prostituted Islam to sell oil to the world But you don’t consider history or current events relevant
Isa 14:17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners? Who makes the humans into prisoners? Babylon does, but who is behind Babylon, this bright star is, who OPPOSES GOD. If Islam was not a major player in the end-times scenario – you might be right But – all that happens - happens according to God’s Will – no other How can Moses be the savior to Israel – without Egypt? How could David slay Goliath without the rephien and the Philistine How could the Resurrection of Christ happen without Judas? All examples of God using the ra as a tool – to facilitate his will You see God does not do the ra Himself – He has a staff for that
Isa 14:22 For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, See the whole passage is about Babylon still. Isa 14:25 That I will break the Assyrian in my land, Just where in Italy or Rome is the Assyrian – Oops! - ArabiaIsa 14:29 Isa 14:31 This north smoke, that stings as a scorpion is Islam, comes out from Babylon. The whole of Is 47 is about Babylon, the lady of the kingdom of earth.NOT ALLOWED – You argue that all of these prophesies are canceled Ellen White says so – The physical nation of Israel has no role in scripture any more From now on it is all spiritual
Whose the richest religion upon many peoples? That would be secularism – high finance – political officeWhose voice is powerful over all the earth? pope? Tell me how Iran, Saudi Arabia, India, or Chins listen to the Pope? Yet, they all deal with radical IslamRe 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. What wine of Rome have the nations of China and Iran get drunk on? Once again the answer points to - Arabian OILSo if we don't identify Babylon, you will receive of her plagues. I have told you this before – you cannot avoid the Demographic Winter of the next 50 years
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Post by Dave on Jun 26, 2020 10:40:55 GMT -5
What is the mission of your soul during its souljourn here? To be a prophet unto the nations - to remember and share / teach What is the mission of the archon - what is the purpose of the Gen 3:15 Contest
The Hypostasis of the Archons - The Nag Hammadi Library Moreover, they threw mankind into great distraction and into a life of toil, so that their mankind might be occupied by worldly affairs, and might not have the opportunity of being devoted to the holy spirit.
Anything - that causes man to ‘miss’ Does not have to be an anti-God war - to oppose God Gen 3:15 is between man and satan’s seed - as well as Christ and the son of perdition
As long as you continue to point fingers at fellow Christians - this group is bad - my group is better - you serve the archon’s very mission
Baptist warring with Presbyterians - current involving guns in the Philippines - Christian vrs Christian Catholics vrs Protestants - 30 years war, Inquisition, Purity purges, just so King Henry could get a divorce - today we have Catholic Ireland vrs Protestant Northern Ireland During my years in high-school and college - Ireland was shooting war - Christian vrs Christian fractured theology into over 2000 Protestant denominations
So for a SDA to suggest the anti-Christ = Catholics sure serves the archons mission - Christian vrs Christian
In the meantime - the Nation of Israel and the Jewish people are faced off against Islam In fact - the SDA go so far as to suggest all that happens in the Middle East has ZERO to do with Christianity and all of Judaism is wrong anyway
This is exactly why I call myself a Gnostic - to remove myself from all that Roman Christendom religious mythology - it only serves the archon
Judaism is not my enemy - and Catholicism is not my friend
There have been amazing Christians born of the Catholic Church - YES! There have been amazing Christians from all denomination - probably God call who he calls There have been amazing Christians long before Jesus was even born
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2020 18:03:19 GMT -5
Greetings Dave, Happy Shabbath
Dave writes: " You don't even like the OPPOSER idea, who OPPOSES GOD either? We tried to study this – you failed to demonstrate one verse that proves the Hebrew word Accuser actually means God’s personal opposer - in every verse we studies - God used satan as a tool to facilitate God's Will
OK I will present this so called one verse yet again:
Did the chief OPPOSER attack Jesus humanity or Jesus divinity when Jesus walked on the earth as the SON of GOD and the SON of MAN? That depends how you define sin? "chata" is the Hebrew word for missing GOD is it not? So as humans we are born connected to GOD, so sin is a daily breaking of that relationship. The GOD-MAN connection. But Jesus is a member of GOD, or you would say GOD as an expression, so this connection relates to Himself.
As humans our connection for living comes from GOD via the HS living in us. As Christ, His connection for living as a human comes from His own divinity, so His living does not rely on Father on His Father, would you agree with this, as you have two expressions of GOD, and often seem confused with the third expression, the Father, whom Jesus spoke to often??
I find it hard to talk to you any more Dave because we differ so much in the reading of our Scriptures....
You don't even see the nephesh as dependent upon GOD for living, and say it is immortal, a gift of living from GOD. If that was true, the concept of sin, or missing would mean nothing, as the soul would never die.
Mt 4:9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me. 10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.
Now if a chief archon comes to you and says to worship it, rather then GOD, who is this attacking most, the humanity or the human-GOD connection of living forever? Obviously the latter... why attack the connection, causing the human to die? Why did the Opposer want Jesus to die?
If Jesus had sinned, His sacrifice for sinning would be without power, He would be a Sinner like Man. So what was the Opposer attacking than in Jesus? His connection to Himself, or His connection to His Father?
However you say it Dave, the Opposer was attacking His divinity... I get the friendly servant thing of JOB, but the Opposer here was attacking what from JOB? His connection to Himself, or His connection to His Father and Saviour? Why did the Opposer destroy and kill Job's family, except Job and his wife?
What does Job himself say about this?
Job 19:25 For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: 26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
So what was the Opposer opposing? Job's connection to GOD, his Redeemer.
Would GOD want humans to no longer be connected to GOD? This is what your saying making God the author of sin and archons and even a department doing God's will of making humans no longer want God.... think about what you saying?
Why would GOD who created humans, want humans to lose their connection to God?
God does not tempt man to do evil, God has a department for that? That's a silly idea Dave. Your saying GOD wants humans to be lost...I thought Scripture says GOD is love, now we also have GOD is a murderer too?
So when Jesus, who is GOD as an expression according to you, meets this chief archon and calls it an Opposer. Why?
How can a created being, a friend of GOD, working with GOD, you say, a department for that, be called an Opposer?
What did this Opposer try to get Jesus to do?
Mt 4:3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
Which power was this referring to? His humanity or His divinity? How does stones become bread? from a divine miracle, nothing to do with humanity....
Mt 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.
Which power was this referring to? His own internal divinity, or the support of an outside divine connection to GOD? This is about faith, the support we show to GOD, where we humans get our power from.... not from ourselves, but from GOD.
Again this is a plea by the Opposer to break the divinity connection to GOD.
Mt 4:9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me. ANd this last temptation was about what, humanity or divinity? What is worship? The worship of humans as humans or the humans claiming to be divine? Its about divinity again...
The OPPOSER was opposing the divinity, not the humanity inside Jesus. Why would the Opposer oppose this, since Jesus is GOD.... arh but Jesus was a GOD-MAN, the humanity and the divinity were connected by suppporting His Father making his divinity vunerable to missing or sin....thus why the Opposer would oppose GOD. Satan had to get GOD to sin, so the divine-human connection would be broken.
To me that is a being directly opposing GOD.
Dave writes: "The archon oppose man - and keep him buisy, or side tracked, or trapped in a religion doctrine
That is ridiculous . The Opposers only oppose man, ? Why? so man dies? I thought you said the soul is eternal and cannot die, I thought you said the archons were created by GOD. SO why would God want most humans to die?
You might say it a contest of obedience? Develop free will to choose... So GOD for some glorious purpose thought it good to create free will agents to test love response, so God created man and archons together to develop a full love response. So we have a GOD of good and evil, using evil for a good purpose to test the free will in man. Sounds great Dave. I get your reason... opposes oppose man only.
If opposers oppose man only, why did Jesus have to die? Sin is just a missing of the test response, not the breaking of eternal laws, with eternal consequences...
No need for GOD to die, if both good and bad are created by GOD, and this is just a test response, not the transgression of an eternal law. But you neglect the cherub chata verse, who broke the eternal law of GOD. Dave writes: "What wine of Rome have the nations of China and Iran get drunk on? Once again the answer points to - Arabian OIL I see your point on Islam and Arabia on this.
Dave writes: "Anything - that causes man to ‘miss’ Does not have to be an anti-God war - to oppose God
SO why does GOD create opposers that help man oppose GOD? You call them archons who do God's will... SO it is the will of GOD that most humans miss out on GOD?
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jun 27, 2020 2:03:38 GMT -5
YES! – the ‘sar’ of this world tempted Jesus Christ with all the secular wealth and fame possible Just as we are each tempted – Jesus experience 100% humanity If Jesus was not tempted as you and I are – he would have not been the perfect sacrifice The point you miss – is that Jesus pass His test – can you Again – God used ra as a tool to facilitate God’s plan Except – God didn’t do it – the ‘sar’ of this world did it
I really don’t think you understand Christianity at all The wages of sin = death It is true – and if the soul chooses to sin – it is purified if possible – proportional punishment But – if the soul is not willing (continued choice) – The Fire of Purification becomes the Lake of Fire which is the second death
The debate within Christianity is how long is that punishment? Eternal hell fire and brimstone Babtist to the Jewish 12 months
YES! – Why did your satan force the crucifixion that opened salvation to all humanity Your satan opposes your God so much he killed Jesus so all the world could be saved Your theology is conflicting
Proving the divinity of Jesus Christ – thank you satan
Again you deny scripture – Angel of death in Egypt – All of the Rephiem , man, women, children, babies, pets, and livestock
Because it is his function
Chose secular / worldly reward over obedience to the Lord Because it is his function
I sure wish you understood basic Christianity Those who die in Christ – are the First Fruits – existing in heaven with God This is the Promise of Judaism – a restoration to the perfect man in communion with God This is the promise of Christianity – The promise of Judaism through Jesus Christ
The Promise of Judaism has always been available to all mankind – just hidden – Divine Pardon To open the promise of Judaism to all mankind – Jesus Christ is revealed as the Divine Pardon All Prophets die – the point is Christ was resurrected – defeated death / transcended death Proving to all – that the after-life is real and tangible
How about Gen 3:15?
By choosing to be one dimensional – you are limiting your theology
Scripture begins in the heavens – the First age was in the heavens Adam and Lillith – Chief Archon – choshek – Jer 4 – Rev 12 All Contestants were spiritual in form and face to face We were spirit beings – in God’s presence
The 2nd age – Adam and Eve – Gen 3: 1-15 – Gen 6 – Gen 8 All Contestants were 3D corporeal – on earth – face to face From God I came – into this valley of the shadow of death – but God is with me From spirit being to man – de-evolve – a step down
Jewish literature – Adam and Eve lost many abilities when they were ejected from the garden Like the ability to see into the heavens – to see the music that the angels were singing From 3D life without death – now man only lives about 1000 years – de-evolve – a step down
Next age – after the flood – the archon are ejected from earth, but 10% remain becoming the evil spirits trapped to earth and the rephiem gene pool of Ammorite Contestants are separated man on earth – archon = off world, evil spirits, and a tainted gene pool Man is again limited to 120 years – de-evolve – a step down Tower of babble – man is again de-evolved – with the inability to work together
Now in the age of the Gentile – the beast is bound – and man is empowered The contest playing field has become a quagmire of deception and attacks on all fronts WE must be living in the absolute most difficult time
Each age – the rules change
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2020 17:04:11 GMT -5
Dave: " The point you miss – is that Jesus pass His test ... Passed what test Dave? Dave: " God used ra as a tool to facilitate God’s planSO the Father planned for His Son to die? Why? Dave: " I really don’t think you understand Christianity at all The wages of sin = death It is true – and if the soul chooses to sin – it is purified if possible – proportional punishmentRob: Yes Dave, you don't understand Christianity... If GOD created everything, than we should I die just because I made a bad choice? Why test the free will to choose in the first place? Why punish our choice should we choose wrongly? How does punishment help? It doesn't...only love helps... not the whip... Pr 26:3 ¶ A whip for the horse, a bridle for the ass, and a rod for the fool's back. 4 ¶ Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him. 5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit. Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Ps 53:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good. SO Job was a fool was he? No Job was upright, perfect, Scripture says, so why the punishment still? Your idea of the Opposer being a friend is so off track... Your idea of GOD wanting to punish the righteous.... why? So they seek the Lord better? really ? so punish a child and he loves you more? prune, discipline yes, but punish? are you sure Dave, that GOD delights in killing people, like in Job? Dave: " YES! – Why did your satan force the crucifixion that opened salvation to all humanity Your satan opposes your God so much he killed Jesus so all the world could be saved Your theology is conflictingEllen White writes Satan tried all manner of ways to get Jesus to sin, one last effort was to kill him, surely Jesus would not want to go to the grave... Dave writes: " Your satan opposes your God so much he killed Jesus"SO which is it Dave, did the Opposer oppose GOD or not?
Or did GOD want His Son to die a cruel death, and for what reason? Rob asks: " If Jesus had sinned, His sacrifice for sinning would be without power, He would be a Sinner like Man. So what was the Opposer attacking than in Jesus? His connection to Himself, or His connection to His Father? Dave writes: Pro ving the divinity of Jesus Christ – thank you satanRob replies: Than Dave, you agree, the Opposer was opposing the divinity of Jesus, and therefore OPPOSING GOD !!!!!!!!!!!
Dave writes:" All Prophets die – the point is Christ was resurrected – defeated death / transcended death Proving to all – that the after-life is real and tangible
God is the author of death, and the after-life is real...Why create both hate and love, death and after-life? Your GOD is both all things of chaos and good, your GOD is both evil and right.... So Jesus died just to show that GOD is the author of death and the author of living. Is that only why He died? What about LAW? Are not GOD's laws eternal, immortal, cannot be changed by GOD, because GOD wrote them long before creation. Pity our governments change our laws, we are weak and stupid, God is not...His Laws are eternal and unchanging.... You do not mention this... Dave writes: " Scripture begins in the heavens – the First age was in the heavens Adam and Lillith I follow Adam and Eve, not Adam and Lillith.... You have a multidimensional universe, added with Greek, Babylonian ides, written by Simon Magnus, and others... so confusing and outside of the books of Moses...and the prophets, we are commanded ONLY to study.... Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them. And Isa 8:15 And many among them shall stumble, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken. 16 ¶ Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples. No where does Scripture say to read, except for the 5 books of Moses first, and than the prophets as witnesses.... You ignore this command.... Ho 6:3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth. Here the torah is broadened to mean the teachings of a teacher, the former teaching and the latter teachings.... the OT and NT, both are in harmony to Jesus, our teacher. The cherub chata verse you reject, so reject all the Bible with it. For 500 posts, Dave we discussed things, but you see Scripture differently to me... How can this be? Where does Scripture say how to read Scripture? Isa 28:9 ¶ Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: Here. We read line upon line, all the lines, not the ones we like and ignore the ones we don't like... Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jun 27, 2020 19:13:11 GMT -5
Dave: "The point you miss – is that Jesus pass His test ... Passed what test Dave?
Now you don’t believe Jesus was tempted in the wilderness? OR - You are going to argue that it was not a test – it was a tempting I say you like to play word games to keep yourself confused You are so confusing – conflicted
Dave: "God used ra as a tool to facilitate God’s plan SO the Father planned for His Son to die? Why?
Joh 3:16 “For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Are you willing to argue this was not God’s plan – but satan’s plan for mankind?
If GOD created everything, than we should I die just because I made a bad choice? Why test the free will to choose in the first place? Why punish our choice should we choose wrongly? How does punishment help? It doesn't...only love helps... not the whip... Well – there is your question isn’t it Why didn’t your Helpful Love God let Adam and Eve off the hook and not curse the ground? All Feel Good Catholics are confuse by this question Why does sweet innocent little Jimmy have to die of cancer at age 4? Catholics say – God’s Will- but do not even believe it because here you are questioning it
Ps 53:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.
Job was upright, perfect, Scripture says, so why the punishment still? Why did Job have to endure life as a mortal?
Mal 3:3 And He will sit as a smelter or a purifier of silver, and He will cleanse the sons of Levi, and purify them like gold or silver. Then they will become for Adonai those who present an offering in righteousness.
So we remember and share – that is our mission
Your idea of the Opposer being a friend is so off track... Friend is your word – to mock me – it Ok you can mock me if you want Satan is a function – not a person – and God uses this function to facilitate His Will
Your idea of GOD wanting to punish the righteous.... why? I was going to quote a verse - but as I looked it up I think I will just say – read Mathew 10 God doesn’t punish us with the Contest – God helps us through the Contest
So they seek the Lord better? really ? so punish a child and he loves you more? prune, discipline yes, but punish? are you sure Dave, that GOD delights in killing people, like in Job? Are you sure Rob that the motives and feeling of the Lord are the same as man’s You anthropomorphize God – this is why your family metaphor feels good for you
Dave: "YES! – Why did your satan force the crucifixion that opened salvation to all humanity Your satan opposes your God so much he killed Jesus so all the world could be saved Your theology is conflicting
Dave writes: "Your satan opposes your God so much he killed Jesus" SO which is it Dave, did the Opposer oppose GOD or not? See how you treat English – by quoting only ½ of the sentence you misrepresent me Your satan opposes your God so much he killed Jesus so all the world could be saved? It is a rhetorical question – that you did not answer
Is John 3:16 God’s plan or satan’s – which is your God?
Or did GOD want His Son to die a cruel death, and for what reason? At a 12 step program Bible Study long ago An additc’s #1 complaint to the world is no one knows what his pain is like – no one understands The PASSION OF CHRIST was the worse death imaginable ‘Roman Scouging’ – vinegar – while your mother stood and watched Jesus understands – because He went through it – all the wat to the cross – 100% Human This is why the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob understands exactly what the Contest is like
Rob asks: "If Jesus had sinned, His sacrifice for sinning would be without power, He would be a Sinner like Man. So what was the Opposer attacking than in Jesus? His connection to Himself, or His connection to His Father? Dave writes: Proving the divinity of Jesus Christ – thank you satan Rob replies: Than Dave, you agree, the Opposer was opposing the divinity of Jesus, and therefore OPPOSING GOD !!!!!!!!!!! Man – you are really grasping for staws If Jesus would have sinned – it would have proved that He was just a man But Jesus didn’t sin – proving that Jesus was much more than just a man – He is divine This tempting / testing served God’s purpose / God’s Will
Dave writes:"All Prophets die – the point is Christ was resurrected – defeated death / transcended death Proving to all – that the after-life is real and tangible God is the author of death, and the after-life is real
See – this is an important point – and I am surprise you miss the point A lot of Christian’s preach – the death of Jesus – the Human Sacrifice – He died for you – He died for your sins – He was the Perfect Lamb of God upon the Alter and Died upon the Cross – just for you because you are a sinner
Is this an effective message today? Do you think it was an effective message at the time of Jesus Christ?
Jesus Christ was Resurrected the after-life is real and tangible Now this message makes people stop and consider that after life – what each individual chooses to do with this information is up to that individual – it can begin the Search for the Kingdom of God – or not
Why create both hate and love, death and after-life? Your GOD is both all things of chaos and good, your GOD is both evil and right.... Ask – Isaiah why the HS moved him to write it down I do not know God’s mind – and don’t pretend to – I can only report what Isaiah wrote
What about LAW? Are not GOD's laws eternal, immortal, cannot be changed by GOD, because GOD wrote them long before creation. Pity our governments change our laws, we are weak and stupid, God is not...His Laws are eternal and unchanging....
AND – they will lead you to the Jewish Divine Pardon, as they always have
You have a multidimensional universe, added with Greek, Babylonian ides, written by Simon Magnus, and others... so confusing and outside of the books of Moses...and the prophets, we are commanded ONLY to study....
There ya are mocking me again – and it is OK – I can take it added with Greek, Babylonian ides, written by Simon Magnus, and others Should accurately say – added with Chabad Judaism which speak a lot about Jewish Kabbalah and First Century Christian literature authored by the same authors as the agl
But we have a problem here Houston! - Science is validation scripture all over the place 2 Peter 3:8 and Psalms 90:4 and Einstein are in 100% agreement What are we to do – Praise the Lord that he is real and His word is spot on? Or do as you may suggest – redact those passages? Or attack science as the anti-Christ?
No where does Scripture say to read, except for the 5 books of Moses first, and than the prophets as witnesses.... You ignore this command.... Why do you include the agl and Ellen White? And you will say – they are valid witnesses Beleive it or not - the Jews are not restricted to Roamn canon - their history is much older and richer
Here the torah is broadened to mean the teachings of a teacher, the former teaching and the latter teachings.... the OT and NT, both are in harmony to Jesus, our teacher.
Question – if Judaism and Christianity are in harmony to Jesus, why aren’t they in harmony to you? Judaism and Christianity is not two different religions – with two different Gods – and two different saviors
There is only Messianic Christianity
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2020 16:56:49 GMT -5
I will simplify your response,
Dave: "The point you miss – is that Jesus pass His test ... Passed what test Dave?
Now you don’t believe Jesus was tempted in the wilderness? OR - You are going to argue that it was not a test – it was a tempting I say you like to play word games to keep yourself confused You are so confusing – conflicted
Please try again with different words, you did not answer my question. If Jesus was GOD and came as a MAN, why would he require testing?
Sure Jesus underwent suffering, because the archons made him suffer.... but why do you require a righteous sinless MAN to be further tested?
Dave: "God used ra as a tool to facilitate God’s plan SO the Father planned for His Son to die? Why?
Joh 3:16 “For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Are you willing to argue this was not God’s plan – but satan’s plan for mankind?
See you are using Another Being, to answer me. You say Satan is a function, not a Being anyhow.
There is no reason why the Father couldn't just forgive sinners, and if they have enough faith, save them. SO your answer does not satisfy why GOD had to die?
Grace does not require GOD dying in order to be kind. Isn't GOD love? So why could not the Father just forgive Adam when he sinned? Why did a Lamb, a sinless innocent animal have to die the very day, Adam sinned?
I was attracted to you first because you dared to answer the question, but did not answer it, so really, why did Jesus have to die? Why did that little Lamb have to die when Adam sinned, GOD clothed them with animal skins.
Sure GOD so loved the world He gave us His son, but this famous verse does not say Jesus had to die....
Leave satan, your functions, out of it, answer the question if you can.... my answer has to do with sin.... and the first being who sinned? the cherub chata, remember, that metaphor we can ignore....sure I have an answer, but you can't have one unless you invoke the word "satan".
Ex 21:22 ¶ If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. 23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
Judgements are details of explain GOD's eternal immortal law.
Ex 21:22 ¶ If "any creature" strive, and hurt "the HS" with child, so that her fruit depart from her, 23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
Here is the details of the LAW "no wounding". Command 6.
This explains why Jesus died....to rescue sinners from sin's penalty, because a "Creature" tricked them to do missing.
Leave out this theme, and you cannot answer Why Jesus died?
Shalom
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2020 17:25:30 GMT -5
Your Matthew 10
Mt 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all ... for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mt 10:25 It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?
Mt 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
These verses speak of archons ruling humans, opposing GOD... but you say they just oppose man, not GOD.
The archons only kill the body, not the soul. Fear GOD who can kill both soul and body in hell. So who's greater in this contest? God is.
Suffering happens because archons want to kill the body and the soul. Its the same war on earth that follows the war in heaven, but you ignore this.
Sure there are many archons, but one chief archon, termed OPPOSER, who by definition opposes GOD, claiming worship and claiming to be like the Most High, taking the high places of GOD. This "cherub chata" verse you reject.
The war in heaven, you say was 6 seconds long. Continues on earth.
This chapter 10 in Matthew, speaks about... the Jews claimed Jesus was Satan,"the master of the house Beelzebub", the one who opposed the Jews. Irony.
The devil was a murder from the beginning, Jesus says.... beginning of what? Long before earth existed.... the "cherub chata" verse you ignore...
Shalom
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Post by Dave on Jun 29, 2020 2:49:52 GMT -5
Mt 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. It would be much easier to talk to you if you stuck to one theology You have been telling me that man does not have a soul – only nephesh and ruwasch which is only the HSThese verses speak of archons ruling humans, opposing GOD... but you say they just oppose man, not GOD. Demonstrate to me how these verses are anti-God Non-believing men will hate believing men Do not fear the archon because they can only kill the body not the soul – only God can kill the soul – that would be at the Lake of Fire – but man does not have a soul according to you – it is only animal man and memoriesThe archons only kill the body, not the soul. Fear GOD who can kill both soul and body in hell. So who's greater in this contest? God is. Suffering happens because archons want to kill the body and the soul. So which is your theology – archon cannot kill the soul but they want to kill the soulSuffering happens because the archon want you to be distracted from Seeking the Kingdom of God If the archon wanted you dead – man would have died long ago If the archon just kill you – who would worship the archon?
Its the same war on earth that follows the war in heaven, but you ignore this. WHAT – you keep inventing things I say This aion is a reflection of the previous aion This world is a reflection of the heaven above God’s Will on earth as in heavenSure there are many archons, but one chief archon, termed OPPOSER, who by definition opposes GOD, Only by your personal; definition G4567 - the accuser, that is, the devil: - Satan. H7854 - From H7853; an opponent; especially (with the article prefixed) Satan, the arch enemy of good: - adversary, Satan, withstand. who by definition opposes GOD – not in Hebrew or Greek – only in RobertThis chapter 10 in Matthew, speaks about... the Jews claimed Jesus was Satan,"the master of the house Beelzebub", the one who opposed the Jews. Irony. So all the Jews said this – not just a few of the Pharisees?
Joh 12:37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: Joh 12:38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? Joh 12:39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, Joh 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
The First Christians were Jews So why do you consider anything Jewish in error? Why Christianity must be a different religion – it cannot be Messianic JewishQuestion – is it true to say – all SDA members are sexual abusers?I have examples – of some SDA members being sexual abusers Of course you will say – it isn’t the denomination – just some non-Christians within our group But it is always all the Jews are this or thatAbuse of Aboriginal Children at Adventist Mission in Mid 20th Century Reported atoday.org/abuse-aboriginal-children-adventist-mission-australia-mid-20th-century-reported/Mona Mona was one of 14 missions operated by various Christian denominations in collaboration with the government of the State of Queensland. The children of Aborigines were taken from their families at an early age in placed in dormitories at the mission stations where they were educated. These children are now senior citizens, many in their 80s. They recall the loneliness of being separated from their parents, harsh conditions in the dorms and instances of physical and sexual abuse. The Aborigines thought the SDA were agents of satan Sexual Abuse Lawsuit Alleging Negligence Filed against the Florida Conference of Seventh-day Adventists. spectrummagazine.org/news/2019/sexual-abuse-lawsuit-alleging-negligence-filed-against-florida-conference-seventh-day Attorneys for two victims abused by Orlando, Florida, Seventh-day Adventists pastor Billy Leveille have filed a lawsuit against the Florida Conference of Seventh-day Adventists, alleging the church was negligent after the Orlando pastor was convicted of sexual activity with a minor and child abuse. The women who wanted to be named and tell their stories had attended Bethel Elise Haitienne Des Adventists Church in Orlando, where Leveille was the senior pastor. Kenia Gilles said she was 16 years old and Jeny Desronvil said she was 21 when the abuse began, shortly after they were both elected and appointed to the church's secretarial team. So – if all SDA members are just the HS acting within an animal body And – if the archon cannot tempt an SDA member because they go to church on Saturday Then all this sexual abuse and cultural disrespect must be deliberate acts of the HS
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Post by Dave on Jun 29, 2020 9:25:27 GMT -5
Joh 3:16 “For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Are you willing to argue this was not God’s plan – but satan’s plan for mankind?
See you are using Another Being, to answer me. You say Satan is a function, not a Being anyhow.
CORRECT - therefore it is God's plan - God's Will Gos is in change - not your satan
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Post by Dave on Jun 29, 2020 9:54:34 GMT -5
I will simplify your response, Dave: " The point you miss – is that Jesus pass His test ... Passed what test Dave?
Now you don’t believe Jesus was tempted in the wilderness? OR - You are going to argue that it was not a test – it was a tempting I say you like to play word games to keep yourself confused You are so confusing – conflictedPlease try again with different words, you did not answer my question. If Jesus was GOD and came as a MAN, why would he require testing? Sure Jesus underwent suffering, because the archons made him suffer.... but why do you require a righteous sinless MAN to be further tested? Really Robert – I have never met another Christian that didn’t understand this passage Is this an SDA teaching that you do not understand why Jesus was tempted Or is it just RobertThe excuse - satan made me do it - will not excuse your choice at Judgment The archon only suggest - places the idea - man (himself alone in his own wilderness make his own choices) Did the archon make Jesus suffer? You say YES!For me - scripture says the archon - specifically the 'sar' of this world tempted Jesus one on one once and Jesus passed that test Every other attack upon Jesus was by man - by the Pharasees The archon - corrupt men into deception / disbelief Man chooses to do the rest on his own www.christianity.com/jesus/life-of-jesus/youth-and-baptism/what-was-the-significance-of-the-temptation.html So Jesus clearly was tempted. But listen, he did not have that inward vulnerability to give in to the temptation. Because the Bible says a man is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and he is enticed. You see, the temptor needs cooperation with the temptee. That would be us. And for that temptation to work, we have to desire and want the thing that's being offered to us. And so the devil knows it's now Jesus does not have that inward vulnerability, that combustible, sinful nature that we have. Therefore, we might protest and say, "Well then he wasn't really tempted", because if he didn't have the ability to fall, then that temptation was not genuine. Well I don't think that's true. He basically resisted it. www.blueletterbible.org/faq/don_stewart/don_stewart_1326.cfmThere are at least five reasons as to why Jesus was tempted.1. It Demonstrated His Humanity The temptations gave proof of His true humanity. The Bible says: Because he himself suffered when he was tempted, he is able to help those who are being tempted (Hebrews 2:18). The fact that He could be tested showed that Jesus was genuinely human. 2. It Is An Example To Us It is part of His example to us. We are told to walk as He walked: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did (1 John 2:6). 3. It Formed Part Of His Personal Discipleship The temptation formed part of His own personal discipline. In some sense Jesus learned obedience through the temptation. During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him (Hebrews 5:7-9). 4. He Can Sympathize With Us It helped Him be a sympathizing intercessor. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are - yet was without sin (Hebrews 4:15). Jesus experienced the same temptation as human beings and can therefore sympathize with humanity. 5. It Is Part Of The Great Conflict It formed part of the great conflict in which the "seed of woman" was to "bruise the head of the serpent." (Genesis 3:15). In this first great struggle of the conflict the destined conqueror came off completely victorious. Summary Jesus was led of the Spirit to be tempted by the devil. These various temptations had a purpose. First, they demonstrated His humanity - only human beings can be tempted. Jesus was also tempted to be an example to us. We are to respond to temptations in the same manner in which He did. In addition, it was part of Jesus' own personal discipleship. The temptations also helped Him to sympathize with us when we are tempted. Finally, the temptations were part of the great conflict that the Bible speaks about. Bible Questions Answered www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-temptations.htmlQuestion: "What was the meaning and purpose of Jesus’ temptations?" Answer: The three temptations by Satan in the wilderness were not the only temptations our Lord ever suffered on Earth. We read in Luke 4:2 that He was tempted by the devil for forty days, but He was undoubtedly tempted at other times (Luke 4:13; Matthew 16:21–23; Luke 22:42), and yet in all this He was without sin or compromise. Although some have suggested that the Lord’s period of fasting compares with that of both Moses (Exodus 34:28) and Elijah (1 Kings 19:8), the main point is how the Lord deals with temptation in the light of His humanity. It is because He is human, and made like us in every way, that He could do three vital things: 1) destroy the devil’s power and free those who were held in slavery by their fear of death (Hebrews 2:15); 2) become a merciful and faithful High Priest in service to God and atone for our sins (Hebrews 2:17); and 3) be the One who is able to sympathize with us in all our weaknesses and infirmities (Hebrews 4:15). Our Lord’s human nature enables Him to sympathize with our own weaknesses, because He was subjected to weakness, too. More importantly, we have a High Priest who is able to intercede on our behalf and provide the grace of forgiveness.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2020 14:14:57 GMT -5
So Jesus clearly was tempted. But listen, he did not have that inward vulnerability to give in to the temptation. Because the Bible says a man is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and he is enticed. You see, the temptor needs cooperation with the temptee. That would be us. And for that temptation to work, we have to desire and want the thing that's being offered to us. And so the devil knows it's now Jesus does not have that inward vulnerability, that combustible, sinful nature that we have. Therefore, we might protest and say, "Well then he wasn't really tempted", because if he didn't have the ability to fall, then that temptation was not genuine. Well I don't think that's true. He basically resisted it.
Well said
5. It Is Part Of The Great Conflict It formed part of the great conflict in which the "seed of woman" was to "bruise the head of the serpent." (Genesis 3:15). In this first great struggle of the conflict the destined conqueror came off completely victorious.
agree. Do you agree with this Dave? What Great Conflict?
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