Why did Jesus have to die?

[Dave]

in fact most great science people are also believers in GOD.

Yes - my personal experience agrees
However - all of them have incomplete cosmologies that Prevents them from taking that church stuff seriously - therefore they throw Jesus out along with the Mythology

Deut 32:2-12 I see how Jesus applies - absolutely
However Jesus is not the end goal - he is the vehicle

Being born again - baptized by the Holy Spirit - personal Pentecost - personal relationship
So, I substitute Holy Spirit for Jesus

David had an indwelling of the Holy Spirit
That indwelling convicted him resulting in the 51st Psalm

The Gospel of Thomas
Translated by Thomas O. Lambdin

(53) His disciples said to him, "Is circumcision beneficial or not?"
He said to them, "If it were beneficial, their father would beget them already circumcised from their mother. Rather, the true circumcision in spirit has become completely profitable."

The Gospel of Philip
Translated by Wesley W. Isenberg

"He who shall not eat my flesh and drink my blood has not life in him" (Jn 6:53). What is it? His flesh is the word, and his blood is the Holy Spirit. He who has received these has food and he has drink and clothing.

Why does Jesus, the YHWH here say he did lead them "alone", when clearly the Holy Spirit and the Father were with Him?

When Jesus walk as a man - was he alone? He acted alone. He was independent enough to be directly and deliberately tempted

This is dependent on how your cosmology deals with the Trinity - again cosmology affect understanding

If we see protons as providers and electrons as responders, the neutron is perhaps a collector, the functional use of a son perhaps? I note in Scripture that Jesus has both provider and responder functions.

Isn't it interesting that the Rutherford model of the atom has the components
Each of the 3 have within them - 3 quarks - a trinity of creation as it should be for 3 dimensional science

[Dave]

Sept 2, 2019 1:33:18 GMT -5 robert t said:

badad, the pictograph reads "the home door (enters in the) door"

Jeff explains this word as one in a different part of the house through different doors can be alone in this sense, in though the house may have all three members there?

Perhaps our understand of badad is wrong?

Can you help?

NO

I took classical Greek in High School and College
I used to play a lot with my NT Greek
I have taught entry level Greek in small groups more than once

I am not an expert

Hebrew - I thought of learning now that I am retired
But - It isn't going to happen
Other than e-Sword
My Hebrew insight comes from AHR -
I just ask questions and explore the Jewish and Islamic mind-set from a far

[Richard]

Sept 2, 2019 1:33:18 GMT -5 robert t said:

De 32:2 My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech (imrah) "Words-personified"


De 32:12 So the LORD alone did lead him,

Holy Spirit dropping like rain on everyone everywhere.

Separation of personages, as in, some things only the Father knows

[robert t]

If you have a look at the 11 contexts of "badad",

the meaning is more about "separation", than being "alone".

Le 13:46 he shall dwell "Separated" from the camp.

The possibility of coming back to the camp in rare cases if the leprosy was taken away.

Nu 23:9 the people shall dwell separated from other nations.

Notice the meaning "separated" makes more sense than "alone".

De 32:12 So the LORD alone did lead him, and there was no strange god with him. (KJV)

De 32:12 So the Adown-YWHW-Jesus "separated" did lead him, and there was no strange "Strong Authority" with him. (Ancient Hebrew)

If you have a look at the whole chapter, both the Father-YHWH and the Holy Spirit are also mentioned, but Adown-YHWH-Jesus is separated from the other members of the Divine Family to lead Israel... why is it this way?

How else does a Divine Being come close to Sinners without them perishing?

Science and scripture answer this question using the medium properties of media.

When light enters another media, its properties change. Simple. Yes but this requires a minimum of three Divine Beings to work. One Being has to be a light source, the other Being functions as a media to partially block the light causing a shadow. And the third Being collects this shadow or diminished power from all three members of Elohiym and takes it personally to Sinners, hence they do not perish.

Notice in Gen 17, both YWHW and Shadday walk among men. And in Psalm 91:1-4 the shadow of the Most High is carried by the SHadday.

These show that "separation" is necessary for Divinity to touch sinners, and allow them to live.

[Dave]

Sept 5, 2019 14:13:44 GMT -5 robert t said:

These show that "separation" is necessary for Divinity to touch sinners, and allow them to live.

Great observation!

Exo 33:20  (ASV) And he said, Thou canst not see my face; for man shall not see me and live. 21  and Jehovah said, Behold, there is a place by me, and thou shalt stand upon the rock: 22  and it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a cleft of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand until I have passed by: 

Face - Glory - Hand

[Robert T]

De 32:12 So the LORD alone(badad) did lead him, and there was no strange god with him. (KJV)

De 32:12 So the LORD separated did lead him, and there was no strange "strong Authority" with him. (ancient Hebrew)

Our understanding of "badad" is wrong, the meaning should be "separated" not "alone as the term solitary"...

Le 13:46 Lepers were separated from the camp, sometimes the disease went away and they could return to the community.

Nu 23:9 The people were to live separately from the influence of other nations.

Ps 4:8 Don't understand the context?

So why does Jesus rescue Israel, separated...when the Father and the Holy Spirit are near Him?

Ge 17:1 In this verse the YHWH and the Shadday walk together, gives a clue

Ps 91:1 ¶ He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty

Here the Father Most HIgh and the Shadday also gives clues. Shadows need two objects to make shadows work, one object acts as light, the other object partially blocks the light. In science this property is called a medium affect, where light is affected by various media it's travelling through.

YHWH-Jesus appeared to Abram and talked to him, yet Abram did not perish by the encounter. Why not? Separation of Elohiym Power. This is the only way it can work. The Father flows via the Shadday and both of these flow via the Son, so YHWH can talk to Abram and not perish. How ? Is a media or medium affect, the power of light diminishes when entering media, the Father passes through the Shadday to make a shadow (a changed property to light) and this property is carried as a message via the YHWH to Abram.

Thus the term "separation" is important, but does not mean that YHWH is the only Strong Authority there is within Elohiym, as Jews make out. If this was the case, how to they explain how shadows are made by one object alone? How do they explain why Abram did not perish? They can't...

Any comments on Badad? is this a possible thought? Shalom

[Richard]

Sept 6, 2019 14:59:32 GMT -5 Robert T said:

Our understanding of "badad" is wrong, the meaning should be "separated" not "alone as the term solitary"...

Le 13:46 Lepers were separated from the camp,

This just seems a matter of perspective

If I am in town and come across the leper on my way out of town - the leper appears separated
But if I am coming into town - and come across the leper - he appears alone