Are some magicians using demons to do supernatural things?

[Alan McDougall]

[Dave]

John 5:19 Jesus therefore responded and said to them, `Verily, verily, I say to you, The Son is not able to do anything of himself,

John 8:28 Jesus, therefore, said to them, `When ye may lift up the Son of Man then ye will know that I am he ; and of myself I do nothing, but according as my Father did teach me, these things I speak;

All Christian magic is never from a man. It is always from the Father.
Faith healers say, it is not I, but the Lord who works through me.

non-Christian magic – also not from a man - YES

Of course we are only talking about true magic or miracle.
Trickery is always is man-made and some of it is really good – example – the guy at the end of this video that changes his face mask – this is a trick, the most common form is a lady that changes her dress over and over. Quick Change Artist they are called.

I used to talk of “Poof versus Bang”
God’s miraculous magical “Poof” of creation versus the Big Bang

[Dave]

Although, the Koran fully acknowledges the Djinn as evil demons and serpents,they attribute all Black Magic to Israel and the Jewish Kabbalah.



AND - they are correct in what they say.

According to the Key of Solomon:
Solomon was told he could ask for any gift from heaven he wanted, so he wished for wisdom.
The wisdom that was given included all of God's reality.
The angel Michael gives Solomon a ring with a pentagram on it
With this symbol Solomon could command the Djinn - evil spirits
Solomon named them and describes them in detail
Solomon uses them to build the Temple - lifting the heaviest blocks

All of this is the beginning of the Kabbalah - Jewish magic

In the Koran - it is said that it was by the will of Solomon's God that he had power over the Djinn

The Key of Solomon, The Lesser Key of Solomon, The Testament of Solomon, and the Aris Paulinis and Aris Goerta were used to rite the Roman Rites of Exorcism - then these same text were banned for public view.

Alister Crowley who wrote the 'Satanic Bible' used these same texts

So the Kabbalah is a Jewish creation - this is true - but the information came from the Djinn through Solomon.

The end of Solomon's story
He becomes enchanted by vices provided by the Djinn
He imports a religious idol for one of his wives
Then allows his wives to build a temple to the Fish god Chemosh 1 Kings 11:7
Then builds a temple to Ashtoreth (a god of the Mobites)2 Kings 23:13
Then he begins running in the streets as a crazy man

[Alan McDougall]

Somethings of the things, these magicians do, are simply beyond any rational explanation, like Pharaohs magicians making a stick become a snake, which Moses followed with one of his own stick to snake magic, his snake then ate the snake that Pharaohs magicians had produced.

[Dave]

What a perfect scriptural example - magic is not always trickery - sometimes magic is of forces beyond human, yet, working with / through a mortal.

It is not a mythical thing of ancient scripture - it is alive today as always!

Gen 3:15 --- Eph 6


Read this:

ROGER MORNEAU
AND
SATAN'S COUNCIL OF THE 1700's

Read more: ponderingconfusion.proboards.com/thread/119/roger-morneau#ixzz3e8Zy3fKL

[Stella]

In our belief, we do not watch tricks or perform tricks.



Turn Away from Astrology, the Occult,
Mediums, Divination and Sorcery
(c) 2005 Doug Britton, LMFT


Do not turn to mediums or seek out spiritists, for you will be defiled by them. I am the LORD your God. (Leviticus 19:31)

God tells us to turn to him and renounce the occult

Many people, including Christians, think it's harmless to look at astrological charts or engage in various forms of spiritism. They think it is fun or entertaining.

Others look to astrology, divination, and mediums for guidance, not just entertainment.

But God clearly warns against such practices in many Bible verses. Some reasons the Scriptures warn against engaging in any form of the occult:
We are opening ourselves up to spirits other than God's.

We are not looking to God for guidance, but to the occult.

We are turning away from true faith in Jesus.

We are disobeying God's word, the Bible.

The Israelites often made the same mistake and turned from God, although God clearly warned them about this.

When you enter the land the LORD your God is giving you, do not learn to imitate the detestable ways of the nations there. Let no one be found among you who sacrifices his son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, or casts spells, or who is a medium or who consults the dead. Anyone who does these things is detestable to the LORD, and because of these detestable practices the LORD your God will drive out those nations before you. You must be blameless before the LORD your God. The nations you will dispossess listen to those who practice sorcery or divination. But as for you, the LORD your God has not permitted you to do so. (Deuteronomy 18:9-14)

Saul, Israel's first king, started out well. He expelled mediums and spiritists from the land, then violated God’'s word and his own conscience by consulting a medium (1 Samuel 28:3-25). His end was tragic (1 Samuel 31:1-6).

New Testament Christians turned from sorcery. Let their example serve as an inspiration and a warning.
Many of those who believed now came and openly confessed their evil deeds. A number who had practiced sorcery brought their scrolls together and burned them publicly. When they calculated the value of the scrolls, the total came to fifty thousand drachmas. In this way the word of the Lord spread widely and grew in power. (Acts 19:18-20)

These verses are given to us as warnings. God wants us to learn from the examples he gives in the Bible, and to avoid making the same mistakes. He loves us and wants us to turn from anything that will get between us and the joyful life he offers.

Bible verses warning about mediums and spiritists

Do not turn to mediums or seek out spiritists, for you will be defiled by them. I am the LORD your God. (Leviticus 19:31)

I will set my face against the person who turns to mediums and spiritists to prostitute himself by following them, and I will cut him off from his people. (Leviticus 20:6)

When men tell you to consult mediums and spiritists, who whisper and mutter, should not a people inquire of their God? Why consult the dead on behalf of the living? (Isaiah 8:19)
Bible verses warning about astrology

And when you look up to the sky and see the sun, the moon and the stars—all the heavenly array—do not be enticed into bowing down to them and worshiping things the LORD your God has apportioned to all the nations under heaven. (Deuteronomy 4:19)

... and contrary to my command has worshiped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars of the sky. (Deuteronomy 17:3)

All the counsel you have received has only worn you out! Let your astrologers come forward, those stargazers who make predictions month by month, let them save you from what is coming upon you. Surely they are like stubble; the fire will burn them up. They cannot even save themselves from the power of the flame. Here are no coals to warm anyone; here is no fire to sit by. That is all they can do for you—these you have labored with and trafficked with since childhood. Each of them goes on in his error; there is not one that can save you. (Isaiah 47:13-15)

Hear what the LORD says to you, O house of Israel.This is what the LORD says: "Do not learn the ways of the nations or be terrified by signs in the sky, though the nations are terrified by them." (Jeremiah 10:1-2)

In every matter of wisdom and understanding about which the king questioned them, he found them ten times better than all the magicians and enchanters in his whole kingdom. (Daniel 1:20)
Bible verses warning about divination, sorcery and magic charms

Do not practice divination or sorcery. (Leviticus 19:26)

Therefore this is what the Sovereign LORD says: "I am against your magic charms with which you ensnare people like birds and I will tear them from your arms; I will set free the people that you ensnare like birds." (Ezekiel 13:20)

The idols speak deceit, diviners see visions that lie; they tell dreams that are false, they give comfort in vain. Therefore the people wander like sheep oppressed for lack of a shepherd. (Zechariah 10:2)

"So I will come near to you for judgment. I will be quick to testify against sorcerers, adulterers and perjurers, against those who defraud laborers of their wages, who oppress the widows and the fatherless, and deprive aliens of justice, but do not fear me," says the LORD Almighty. (Malachi 3:5)

[Dave]

I know your Church

No dancing, no playing cards, no make up, no beauty parlors, and only plain clothes.

I respect your people very much. I learned much about having convictions from Ora Mast. You never fully understand how much people effect you until years later. My life has been touched by the Amish in a way that will linger with me until my death.